When asking the GOV'T for Money, don't fly your Corporate Jet!!!!!

[Hung Start]

Delays are the least of the problem.

How about, canceled, bumped, loaded but no crew show, overflying your destination, screaming, out of control kids, people jumping up and yelling "I'm going to kill all the Jews", people locking themselves in the Lav for hours, and of course the,,, "I can't get a girl so I'm going to blow up my package" guy.

I can see a few reasons for taking the corporate jet.

General, I suggest you work on fixing your industry before you tackle ours.

Hung

 

[OPECJet]

Delays are the least of the problem.

How about, canceled, bumped, loaded but no crew show, overflying your destination, screaming, out of control kids, people jumping up and yelling "I'm going to kill all the Jews", people locking themselves in the Lav for hours, and of course the,,, "I can't get a girl so I'm going to blow up my package" guy.

I can see a few reasons for taking the corporate jet.

General, I suggest you work on fixing your industry before you tackle ours.

Hung

Don't forget about landing on taxiways.

I ONLY do that when I'm in a huge hurry.

-Wind check!

 

[DieselDragRacer]

....yet millions and millions of Americans are unemployment and our deficit is reaching $13 TRILLION but our elitist leaders in DC think this is OK:


(CBS) Few would argue with the U.S. having a presence at the Copenhagen Climate Summit. But wait until you hear what we found about how many in Congress got all-expense paid trips to Denmark on your dime.

CBS investigative correspondent Sharyl Attkisson reports that cameras spotted House Speaker Nancy Pelosi at the summit. She called the shots on who got to go. House Majority Leader Steny Hoyer, and embattled Chairman of the Tax Committee Charles Rangel were also there.

They were joined by 17 colleagues: Democrats: Waxman, Miller, Markey, Gordon, Levin, Blumenauer, DeGette, Inslee, Ryan, Butterfield, Cleaver, Giffords, and Republicans: Barton, Upton, Moore Capito, Sullivan, Blackburn and Sensenbrenner.

That's not the half of it. But finding out more was a bit like trying to get the keys to Ft. Knox. Many referred us to Speaker Pelosi who wouldn't agree to an interview. Her office said it "will comply with disclosure requirements" but wouldn't give us cost estimates or even tell us where they all stayed.

Senator Inhofe (R-OK) is one of the few who provided us any detail. He attended the summit on his own for just a few hours, to give an "opposing view."

"They're going because it's the biggest party of the year," Sen. Inhofe said. "The worst thing that happened there is they ran out of caviar."

Our investigation found that the congressional delegation was so large, it needed three military jets: two 737's and a Gulfstream Five -- up to 64 passengers -- traveling in luxurious comfort.

Add senators and staff, most of whom flew commercial, and we counted at least 101 Congress-related attendees. All for a summit that failed to deliver a global climate deal.

As a perk, some took spouses, since they could snag an open seat on a military jet or share a room at no extra cost to taxpayers. Rep. Gabrielle Giffords (D-AZ) was there with her husband. Rep. Shelley Moore Capito (R-WV) was also there with her husband. Rep. Ed Markey (D-MA) took his wife, as did Rep. Jim Sensenbrenner (R-WI). Congressman Barton -- a climate change skeptic -- even brought along his daughter.

Until required filings are made in the coming weeks, we can only figure bits and pieces of the cost to you.

Three military jets at $9,900 per hour - $168,000 just in flight time.

Three military jets at $9,900 per hour - $168,000 just in flight time.
Dozens flew commercial at up to $2,000 each.

(CBS)​

321 hotel nights booked - the bulk at Copenhagen's five-star Marriott.
Meals add tens of thousands more.

Steve Ellis of Taxpayers for Common Sense, wasn't against a U.S. presence. But he said, "Every penny counts. Congress should be shaking the couch cushions looking for change, rather than spending cash for everybody to go to Copenhagen."

Nobody we asked would defend the super-sized Congressional presence on camera. One Democrat said it showed the world the U.S. is serious about climate change.

And all those attendees who went to the summit rather than hooking up by teleconference? They produced enough climate-stunting carbon dioxide to fill 10,000 Olympic swimming pools.

Which means even if Congress didn't get a global agreement - they left an indelible footprint all the same.

 

[General Lee]

Don't forget about landing on taxiways.

I ONLY do that when I'm in a huge hurry.

-Wind check!

Yeah, how about that GIII that crashed at ASE with 15 people on board at night! Sounds fun to me! Do you think they were in a hurry? SkyWest does it every night in a CR7, but hey, they aren't corporate pilots (AKA studs!). I think that GIII pilot needed a windcheck himself.


Here is part of the NTSB report:

[FONT=TimesNewRoman,Bold]HISTORY OF FLIGHT[/FONT]​

On March 29, 2001, about 1901:57 mountain standard time,

1 a Gulfstream III,

N303GA, owned by Airbourne Charter, Inc., and operated by Avjet Corporation of
Burbank, California, crashed while on final approach to runway 15 at Aspen-Pitkin
County Airport (ASE), Aspen, Colorado. The charter flight had departed Los Angeles
International Airport (LAX) about 1711 with 2 pilots, 1 flight attendant, and
15 passengers. The airplane crashed into sloping terrain about 2,400 feet short of the
runway threshold. All of the passengers and crewmembers were killed, and the airplane
was destroyed. The flight was being operated on an instrument flight rules (IFR) flight​

plan under 14 [FONT=TimesNewRoman,Italic]Code of Federal Regulations [/FONT](CFR) Part 135



Bye Bye--General Lee
​

 

[General Lee]

Delays are the least of the problem.

How about, canceled, bumped, loaded but no crew show, overflying your destination, screaming, out of control kids, people jumping up and yelling "I'm going to kill all the Jews", people locking themselves in the Lav for hours, and of course the,,, "I can't get a girl so I'm going to blow up my package" guy.

I can see a few reasons for taking the corporate jet.

General, I suggest you work on fixing your industry before you tackle ours.

Hung

The problem, as stated in the article, is the notion that CEOs can go to Washington and beg for money, while they travel there in expensive fashion. You need to stay on topic and focus here if you can. If the TSA decides to screen private FBOs at TEB next (they are considering it), then that will take away yet another thing that CEOs love. As far as security issues, there are probably more drunk or druggie people on corporate jets, since they can have unlimited amounts before and during flights. I am sure more than one Netjets stew (F200 or bigger) has been confronted with a problem like that. It may be tougher to cut off an owner from his booze.

And both of our industries are in flux right now. The airlines are having to struggle with extra security but more passengers (with less planes since many are in the desert), and the frac and corporate industry is the process of cutting back. Netjets will trim fleets from 13 to 7 for example. Time to get leaner, and that is not always fun. But, at least you guys get to experience BOTH world, with an airline flight at both ends of tours. That must bring you back to reality, you can't afford your own corporate travel. Welcome home.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[General Lee]

I think companies should get rid of computers and telephones too! Especially if they coming begging for money.

Yeah, and they should all go to work in their boxers! Talk about being way off, you take the cake. When there is a form of alternate transportation that costs less (like Airline travel), then TAKE IT when it is time to beg the Gov't for money. It is not like the CEOs will have less security, they are poor and are begging for money. It is just another excuse to fly above the rest---an entitlement problem. If they are going broke, they need to act like it.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[JungleJett]

Hey General..do you fly for the airlines?

 

[Hung Start]

No, General,, I am staying on topic.

The reason these CEOs fly private is because of the terrible service and security that most of the airlines are providing. Period.

I am not going to debate whether these folks are worth the salaries and bonus they get, that is for their Board of Directors to figure out. But, if you are paying someone in the millions of dollars a year, you want that guy to be productive. A lot. One can easily be very productive on a private flight.
One simply cannot be productive on the airlines, with all the craziness that goes on.
I also will not play silly and throw in accidents and incidents as described above, because that could happen to any industry. I DID include the overflight, because that was just plain stupid. I suspect we both will agree on that.

Hung

 

[OPECJet]

Yeah, how about that GIII that crashed at ASE with 15 people on board at night! Sounds fun to me! Do you think they were in a hurry? SkyWest does it every night in a CR7, but hey, they aren't corporate pilots (AKA studs!). I think that GIII pilot needed a windcheck himself.


Here is part of the NTSB report:

[FONT=TimesNewRoman,Bold]HISTORY OF FLIGHT[/FONT]​

On March 29, 2001, about 1901:57 mountain standard time,

1 a Gulfstream III,

N303GA, owned by Airbourne Charter, Inc., and operated by Avjet Corporation of
Burbank, California, The flight was being operated on an instrument flight rules (IFR) flight​

plan under 14 [FONT=TimesNewRoman,Italic]Code of Federal Regulations [/FONT](CFR) Part 135



Bye Bye--General Lee
​

We aren't corporate pilots either General. Interesting comparison on our own message board what our operation resembles the most. Corporate or airline. We think it's something in between the two. Operationally, it's most definitely an airline.

Hah, 495 of us, me included are unemployed pilots anyway. Might turn me into one of those corporate pilots, but you can't take the airline out of the pilot anymore than you can take the ho out of the trailer park.

Show me in that accident report where it says anything about it being a fractional flight? Looks like your every day run of the mill charter to me. No difference between me pulling up an accident with a 737, 757, 767, MD80, etc and trying to draw the same comparison. That bucket just doesn't hold water my friend.

 

[Hung Start]

Yeah, and they should all go to work in their boxers! Talk about being way off, you take the cake. When there is a form of alternate transportation that costs less (like Airline travel), then TAKE IT when it is time to beg the Gov't for money. It is not like the CEOs will have less security, they are poor and are begging for money. It is just another excuse to fly above the rest---an entitlement problem. If they are going broke, they need to act like it.


Bye Bye--General Lee

General,,there is always a form of cheaper alternative transportation. Shall we all take the railroad and skip air travel?
Yes, there are a few who like to "ride above the rest" and feel entitled. But they are damn few.
The great majority fly private becasue of the efficiency, security, and productivity it provides.
When the airlines can deliver that, then the fractional world WILL be out of business. But, I don't think that will happen soon.

And I doubt your airlines' choice of charging silly money for a bag or two is a very smart move. Keep chasing them away, General. As I said before, you really should spend more of your time fixing your industry. It certainly needs it.

Hung