Whats so great about working at a major?

[capt_zman]

Why do so many people get these major airline "blinders" on?

Flylow is right. There are other jobs out there with far better quality of life, better compensation, and more nights at home with your family than even the majors can provide.

Don't strap on the golden handcuffs just yet. Look around.

Really good advice. I was a guy who left a sweet corp gig flying top notch equipment, great people, great QOL, and decent money for the "major airline blinders". There are so many variables that come into play in an airline that I had no idea about and had not planned for.

After 3 years at FDX, I feel like I sold me and my family out, almost like a deal with the devil.

 

[Whine Lover]

The reasons to leave a good regional carrier for a major are many and most are all compelling enough to justify the move. To sum it up, though, you leave because the future upside is significantly higher than that of a regional. At 90-100K per a year, you are a hitting the ceiling of earning potential. At a major, 100K a year is the lowest pay you will receive as a first officer AFTER you've advanced deep enough into the longevity payscales (usually the 5 year point).

It's really a no-brainer. We all need to make the jump at some point. The longer you delay the inveitable pay-cut the harder it seems to overcome. But the first year goes rather quickly so it's not really that big of a deal.

Not necessarily... This is representative of what my friends make at a few of the "majors":

- 16 year American 757 FO - 89k

- 19 year Airways A320 FO - 82k

- 10 year Delta 757 FO - 85k

I think your " 100k / Five Year Theory" may be a bit flawed...


YKW

 

[AA717driver]

Not necessarily... This is representative of what my friends make at a few of the "majors":

- 16 year American 757 FO - 89k

I think your " 100k / Five Year Theory" may be a bit flawed...

YKW

Bull. As a lineholder, you'll EASILY make $105k. (Unless he bids conflicts every month and takes the 64 hour guarantee.) Work the system (sell back two of four weeks of vacation) and you're up to $115k.

I will say that the 20 hour layovers at the Sherry DO cut into your earnings--and your lifespan! TC

 

[Captain Morgan]

I have a bone to pick with some of the posters. I know this will offend some people, but not all people are "cut from the same cloth." There are all types of people that like different types of flying. I for one like flying the small regional jets and turboprops. It seems some people only got into this profession to fly the large jets. We don't give you a hard time because you want to be a captain on a 777 flying internationally, so don't catagorize us all as short sighted just because we enjoy what we do no matter how many zeros we lack on our W-2 and our plane is smaller or has props. Also, there are alot of people out there that are happy with the simple things in life and don't have to have a 300k house and a BMW along with every gadget ever invented. All I am saying is, don't go thinking we all want to be at a major because not all of us do. Good luck to everybody in the pursuit of what they want out of their career.

CM

 

[Captain Morgan]

From my very first introductory flight, private, commercial, instrument rating, CFI, CFII, MEI...it was ALL so I could get a job at a major airline. Flying is and always has been too expensive for this to be a hobby. If I thought for a minute I wouldn't have made it to a major airline I wouldn't have wasted the $20 for that first intro flight in the first place.

This argument against SWA because they require a type is STUPID. If SWA is your dream job then GO FOR IT. If it's not...then don't bother. You mean to tell me you plunked down 60-70k or more to get to the doorstep and then balk at a $6k type rating for your dream job. THAT's ABSURD.

And btw, SWA hasn't required a type before the interview for several years now...if you don't want to get the type before you show up at there "hollowed facility" you don't have to.

To put it blatenly, we need less of you in this profession. It's obvious you're not in aviation for the love of flying. Maybe you should've taken that 20 secured yourself an intro to law school.

CM

 

[Whine Lover]

Bull. As a lineholder, you'll EASILY make $105k. (Unless he bids conflicts every month and takes the 64 hour guarantee.) Work the system (sell back two of four weeks of vacation) and you're up to $115k.

I will say that the 20 hour layovers at the Sherry DO cut into your earnings--and your lifespan! TC

Well, we can all "work the system" , sell vacations and what not to make our w-2's look good.

However, many of us don't care to do so. ( myself included. Guarantee pay and maximum days off is just fine with me...)

Fact of the matter is, his annual guarantee is as stated above.

Point being...5 years to 100K as an FO is nowhere near correct with todays pay scales.

Is it possible? Sure as you state above, pick up as many trips as you can, sell vacations and work up to the pay cap (with minimum days off) and it will happen.

But it's the exception...not the Rule.

And yes, there are someplaces, SWA etc. , where the pay is still good enough that with a few extra trips here and there you can do 100k after 3-5 years.

So we don't need to have a case by case, airline by airline,discussion here.

 

[hindsight2020]

90K is nothing compared to what it needs to be (used to be). Inflation, the weakening dollar...

I, for one, have never compared myself to 90% of this country. I won't start now. I didn't get into this biz to make what 90% of the country makes. 90% of the country hasn't done what I've done to get where I am.

The same applies to the rest of you 10%ers.

Self-righteous anyone? You fly a plane. Circumstances have dictated what payscales 121 pilots are making currently for being responsible for flying people from point A to point B. But you didn't discover the cure for cancer brother, you fly planes. You're not the only one in this country sacrificing, nor the only one working, or at the very least with the perception of having worked, twice as hard to get to the same place.

90K with a semblance of QOL is nothing to scoff at. Now, is it true that today's economy forces the middle class to be two-income households by default and therefore a single person earning 90K isn't what it used to be? Absolutely. But everybody has a bloated perception of the value of one's work when compared to other careers.

I used to see this coming out of college with an engineering degree. People b%tching and whining about how they should start at X salary and they deserve more, ad naseaum. Guess what, nobody cares you fly a plane, like nobody cared I had additional education when I decided to pursue flying professionally. Just like nobody cares you feel your chosen profession should be compensated more compared to "90% of the country".

The key to keeping perspective is to make comparisons in terms of opportunity cost, rather than let your entitlement complex get out of control. You wanna make 200K+ in a "timely" fashion and feel flying a plane, current QOL and other externalities considered, is not getting you there? Hedge your bets and make the appropriate career changes and see what happens. But pounding your chest and screaming "I deserve more, I am worth more than 90% of earners because I have sacrificed soooo much" does nothing to reinforce your argument that pilots should be compensated more (which for the level of responsibility at the regional level I believe they should).

Just some perspective is all.

 

[DIAMONDDD]

What's so great about working at a major?
Lot's of things.
1. Respect. People respect you more. Management no longer looks at you like a "rookie" and will not try to take silly advantage of you. Gate agents will respect you more, even if you are just jumpseating. They realize that you have been around the block and treat you will respect. Other airline pilots, knowing that you are working for a major, will not act childish towards you. After you are off of probation, your peers will welcome you with open arms. Flight attendants will be at your command and will give you their undevided attention when you address them. What you say, goes without question. Passengers think you are something of a deity.

2. Pay. Once you get past your first year, wait'll you get of a load of your pay. Even as an f/o, you'll probably make wads and wads of cash. Be careful, you may hurt yourself tripping over bundles of fifty dollar bills around your house.

3. Job Security. Most of the legacy carriers have been around for ever. They ain't going anywhere and neither will you. And with a strong union on property, you will most likely have a "no furlough" clause in your contract. Sweet. Go ahead and upgrade to the larger house once you are on board. What's the worst that could happen?

4. Work rules. The work rules at the majors are far superior to any others in the industry. You'll seldom be tired, except after stuffing yourself on a transcon with the first class meal that most companies provide their flight crews. You'll have so much time off, your wife may think you are a part-time employee.

5. Camaraderie. You'll be one of the "family" now. No more back-stabbing, ladder climbing, I'd-hit-you-you-over-your-head-with-a-snow-shovel-if-I-thought-it-would-improve-my-quality-of-life kind of stuff going on at the majors. I guess that probably comes about because most pilots at the majors are more mature.

6. Retirement. If you are fortunate enough to get on with a major, you really are set for life. When you retire, the money just keeps on a-flowin'. With the top notch pensions, along with your 401k and social security, the only problem you'll have is what the hel to do with all of that cash. By that time, you and your wife of 40 years will have the house/houses paid off. There won't be any big-ticket items to pay for any more. It'll almost be a full time job just counting your money. Kind of like in "Scarface" when they would set up those rooms with the electronic bill counters, and would take the cash to the bank in big bags.

I could go on, but, unfortunately I just received another paycheck, so I have to do some online shopping.

 

[FurloughedAgain]

...and if you believe any of the above -- you've just been "punked"

 

[Sedona16]

Not necessarily... This is representative of what my friends make at a few of the "majors":

- 16 year American 757 FO - 89k

- 19 year Airways A320 FO - 82k

- 10 year Delta 757 FO - 85k

I think your " 100k / Five Year Theory" may be a bit flawed...


YKW

One of the following must be at play here regarding your Delta friend:

1. He lied to you.
2. He gives away alot of his trips.
3. Your lying to us.
4. You or him have fuzzy math.

Even at a conservative calculation at your friends current pay rate (aprox $106/hr) at 85 hours a months (which is average) he is making $109,140.00 This is not including a 5% bonus ($5,450.00), eleven percent (does not require matching) going into his funded account $11,990.00. nor the fact he is still getting yearly increases (ie Dec 09 he will be at $110/hr on the basic scale). This also does not include $1.85/hr per diem or roughly between $150.00 and $200.00 for a regular trip or put another way, roughly $8500.00 more per year. Please tell me how his real total income of $135,238.00 becomes $85K?

One last note, if he were to fly any inverse assignments his hourly pay for that assignment would be $212.00 per hour or $159/hr for a "green slip".

PS- If you want to justify your staying at a regional for some reason dont try the "it will take me ten years to make what I am making now or the pay sucks at the majors" arguement. The pay does suck at the majors compared to where it was in year 2000 but the earning income at a major still kills that of a regional, short and long term. The Majors will get some pay raises in the next three years (10% to 20%). These new pay rates will only further widen the gap of regional and major once again. Dont expect the solidarity from hundreds of new regional kids with SJS to make any ground at the regionals.