What's more dangerous? Taxiway or Overflight+

[Fubijaakr]

yes, it is the biggest blunder of modern airlines times.. name one bigger!

1. Tenerife
2. Palm 90
3. Eastern 401
4. Delta 191
5. NWA 255
6. Delta 1141

Six enough?

 

[Dan Roman]

1. Tenerife
2. Palm 90
3. Eastern 401
4. Delta 191
5. NWA 255
6. Delta 1141

Six enough?

and sadly enough, you are just scratching the surface. I flashed on the SWA overrun in BUR as the biggest blunder, but the fact is, any of us can screw up. The finger pointers are usually the biggest screw ups.

 

[JohnDoe]

john,
you said it is bunk and you said my assertion was false because it was not the deadliest... you missed my whole point. this incident has nothing to do with death but alot to do with complete absurdity. that is what a blunder is. A blunder is a fumbled punt. a botched snap, and on and on.

yes, it is the biggest blunder of modern airlines times.. name one bigger!

NO, the only thing I called bunk was your assertion that it was the "biggest blunder in modern airline times." I was not saying that any critisism of the incident is bunk. I think you should work on your reading comprehension.

After reading other responses, apparently I am not alone in the belief that your view of a blunder is a little out of whack.

 

[ozpilot]

It is a much harder road to admit you were breaking company policy and on your laptops than take the easy out and say "we fell asleep."

My understanding is that while it is against Delta policy, NorthWest policy actually allows the use of laptops. Anyone care to confirm this?

 

[filejw]

My understanding is that while it is against Delta policy, NorthWest policy actually allows the use of laptops. Anyone care to confirm this?

Well NW at one time encouraged you not take paper manuals so lots of folks have them on laptops. So if i was to study on a long leg my laptop would come out and studying on a trip is OK.

 

[filejw]

As for the whats more dangerous question I suggest you Google Western Airlines Mexico City accident (1979) to see what happens when you land on closed pavement..

 

[Metrojet]

john,
you said it is bunk and you said my assertion was false because it was not the deadliest... you missed my whole point. this incident has nothing to do with death but alot to do with complete absurdity. that is what a blunder is. A blunder is a fumbled punt. a botched snap, and on and on.

yes, it is the biggest blunder of modern airlines times.. name one bigger!

What about the NW DC-10 that overflew Amsterdam and was going to land at Frankfurt, and all the passengers were watching it on the in-flight movie screen before a flight attendant alerted them? Can't remember what year, and I don't think they actually landed at Frankfurt.

Metrojet

 

[IBNAV8R]

Sadly, politicians (including those in the FAA) will focus on the issues sensationalized by the media. Meanwhile, the issues that actually constitute the bigger risk factors get left on the back burner. Let's face it, the risk factors that affect the "majors" affect the "regionals" and vice versa. It's just a matter of who it happens to when there is an otherwise slow-news day.

 

[filejw]

What about the NW DC-10 that overflew Amsterdam and was going to land at Frankfurt, and all the passengers were watching it on the in-flight movie screen before a flight attendant alerted them? Can't remember what year, and I don't think they actually landed at Frankfurt.

Metrojet

You really at least should get the airports right if you are going to reference something.They were going to FRA and the controller thought they were going to BRU and vectored them there. The Ca was brand new to europe and didn't recognise what the mistake was untill it was too late and just landed at BRU. Unfortunately he had an FO that was trouble from day one at Air West and was of no help.

 

[Metrojet]

You really at least should get the airports right if you are going to reference something.They were going to FRA and the controller thought they were going to BRU and vectored them there. The Ca was brand new to europe and didn't recognise what the mistake was untill it was too late and just landed at BRU. Unfortunately he had an FO that was trouble from day one at Air West and was of no help.

Well - chalk it up to human error - just like not using spell check when you type "recognise" instead of recognize or "untill" when you mean until.

But hey - we all make mistakes - just depends if we catch the error before it becomes a major factor.

Metrojet

 

[filejw]

So voice software isn't the best so what...try staying on the subject, you remind me of a kid with ADD..

 

[Metrojet]

So voice software isn't the best so what...try staying on the subject, you remind me of a kid with ADD..

filejw -

Don't take it so personal -

I was just trying to make a point - in this job - we all make errors. I am more interested in what events allow errors to occur - and what I can learn to prevent those errors (or at least mitigate the result of an error).

Metrojet

 

[doh]

Landing on a taxiway is more dangerous, hands down.

 

[doh]

Well, stalling an airplane on approach b/c neither pilot was paying attention and then totally botching the recovery...subsequently killing 50 people.... i'd place that one higher.

Playing around like little kids in a CRJ, taking it up to 41,000 feet, stalling it, botching the recovery and trying to hide it from the feds- killing both on board. Yep, that's a bigger blunder.

Not checking your heading prior to takeoff and killing 51 people... yep, that's a bigger blunder.


Maybe you meant to say "currently all over the news but no one is going to remember it 6 months from now?"

They had a s...load more pax onboard than 51. Pure dumb luck kept them from killing them all when they landed on that taxiway. There is no way you can minimize the danger they put those people in through their complete lack of awareness of where they were.

 

[PeanuckleCRJ]

They had a s...load more pax onboard than 51. Pure dumb luck kept them from killing them all when they landed on that taxiway. There is no way you can minimize the danger they put those people in through their complete lack of awareness of where they were.

You know, you're right. This outshines even tenerife. Man, Delta sucks hard!

 

[seefive]

It's also like a surgeon beginning an operation and walking away from the operating table to sit down in font of his laptop to watch House and fall asleep until the nurse comes a-knocking to remind him theres a patient with an open heart laying on the table.

Please!....get real. let's not compare our jobs to heart surgery.

 

[seefive]

Also........if these guys were indeed on their laptops, no one was in any danger short of running out of gas which apparently wasn't an issue. They were negligent no doubt but safety wasn't compromised.

Personally, i believe a medical emergency doesn't mitigate a mistake like landing on a taxiway. We are all capable of making mistakes but landing on a taxiway is one we all hope we can avoid.

 

[climbhappy]

quote:they were negligent...but safety wasn't compromised



that's a good one!

 

[doh]

You know, you're right. This outshines even tenerife. Man, Delta sucks hard!

The only ahole on here who denigrates a whole pilot group for the mistake two of them made is acarpe. I stand by my assertion that these two had pure dumb luck on their side and that they had no idea where they were. This was not worse than Tenerife because of their luck.

 

[Yodafly]

Landing on a taxiway is way more worse. There could have been 10 planes for take off wiped out by one mistake. I know no one was hurt but it could have been bad.