Whats left of your USAir is worth more than what ALPA did or didn't do for u.

[Wiskey Driver]

D.O.H. And whats you interest T.O. that you would identify my employer. I have never identified you. Your britches have gotten a little big for someone who was only voted in because nobody else but a bu tt buddy wanted the position out of a total vote I could count on less than two hands being that I was the one to do the count.

But at least he stepped up! What did you do?? Have you ever signed you name stating that you are willing to serve?? I'm betting no... Save that DOH crap for when CAL is looking to staple your as$ to the bottom of their list to protect those 4yr capt they have, then lets see you out here waving the doh flag then.

WD.

 

[hmmm]

Umm lets see... how many years and how many fights did USAir East pilots go through to deserve their original DOH seniority slot.

And how come its fair an AWest pilot can come in and take the East guys slot after the East guy had worked and fought so much longer compared to the west guy?


D.O.H.

And for your question who cares whether I stepped up. What does that have to do with anything. Ask the other guy if I did step up for anything. He knows who I am and knows I'll step up to anything and not back down. Will you step up to me in person. I'll be there. Will you.

And about you Cal staple. If I wasn't waving the DOH flag then I would be a thief. Whether an agreement or not it is stolen years of seniority.

 

[get2flyin]

Exactly. I'm at a good company now and will make sure none of those scum sucking pigs ever gets hired here. On the way to the interview the captain whose flight I was jumpseating on was like:"Wait a second, are you east or west US? You're ex Am West, cool you can ride on us." Karma rules. Those A-holes will get it in the end.

Nah. 3 years from now, everybody will forget. When I was an instructor, CO-EX and others were hiring but it was pay for training. The majority of us shunned it as wrong. We told ourselves those guys would be lepers and nobody would every hire them. I don't regret not paying for training, but they're all working at UAL and other places now. Guess we were wrong. They have good jobs but I have my pride. Only time will tell which of us made the right choice.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

What are you trying to say?!


I never understand your posts.....

Neither do I!!

Umm lets see... how many years and how many fights did USAir East pilots go through to deserve their original DOH seniority slot.

Please justify deserve. Especially at the Wests' expense.

And how come its fair an AWest pilot can come in and take the East guys slot after the East guy had worked and fought so much longer compared to the west guy?

Because the East agreed to using Nic. The East aggred to binding Arbitration. The East was advised not to go this route. The East was advised, work it out on your own terms not Nic. The East was advised "you are not going to like the Nic Award".

Why is it fair the East made thier own choices, agreed to the rules and then tries to change the rules? How is that fair?

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Nah. 3 years from now, everybody will forget. When I was an instructor, CO-EX and others were hiring but it was pay for training. The majority of us shunned it as wrong. We told ourselves those guys would be lepers and nobody would every hire them. I don't regret not paying for training, but they're all working at UAL and other places now. Guess we were wrong. They have good jobs but I have my pride. Only time will tell which of us made the right choice.

Still hung up this? We live in a uber competitive economy.... some guy uses money to get an advantage and we chide him/her for it?

It is the American Way!

 

[Fly-n-hi]

If I wasn't waving the DOH flag then I would be a thief. Whether an agreement or not it is stolen years of seniority.

Um...nope. You have years of longevity...not seniority.

If you're the bottom guy at an airline and you've been there for 18 years you have zero seniority. Then, if that airline hires one pilot tomorrow you would be one number senior to that pilot...not 18 years senior.

It's not about how long you've been there, its about where you stand on the seniority list.

Hope that cleared it up for you.

 

[SaturnPilot]

Umm lets see... how many years and how many fights did USAir East pilots go through to deserve their original DOH seniority slot.

Fact is that ALPA had a merger policy that East guys knew before they went into this merger. That policy was NOT DOH. If DOH is the only "fair" way to go, then they probably should have lobbied to change ALPA merger policy before the merger.

Since you hate current merger policy as written, are you going to lobby to get it changed?

 

[becket]

Um...nope. You have years of longevity...not seniority.

If you're the bottom guy at an airline and you've been there for 18 years you have zero seniority. Then, if that airline hires one pilot tomorrow you would be one number senior to that pilot...not 18 years senior.

It's not about how long you've been there, its about where you stand on the seniority list.

Hope that cleared it up for you.

don't go and confuse gramps with the facts now!!!

The world, (at least America West) pilots most certainly owe him something!!! Why on Earth would one expect a grown man to be responsible for the choices he's made? When all else fails, go steal something...it works in the hood, why not at the airlines?

 

[Black Hawk]

This merger could have saved a lot of pilot's jobs and rejuvenated a dead career. Unfortunately it appears that pushing for a windfall will kill it off completely.

 

[Guppiedriver]

The self serving AWest pilots are not worth the paper their license used to be printed on that they didn't put the seniority proper on their own recognizance as men of morals and principle they are not, evidenced by their sitting there and accepting the ill gained spoils of war not due to them by their years in service based on Date of Hire.
[/COLOR]

Holy sh!t! That has to be the longest run-on sentence that I have ever attempted to read. I say attempted, because I still have no idea what this moron was trying to say.

Requirements to Obtain an ATP Certificate

Be at least 23 years of age.
Be able to read, speak, write, and understand the English language.

Please proceed to the nearest FSDO and surrender your ATP certificate.

 

[grog_sit_reserv]

Worst... Thread... Title... Ever....

 

[Caspian27]

Neither do I!!




Please justify deserve. Especially at the Wests' expense.



Because the East agreed to using Nic. The East aggred to binding Arbitration. The East was advised not to go this route. The East was advised, work it out on your own terms not Nic. The East was advised "you are not going to like the Nic Award".

Why is it fair the East made thier own choices, agreed to the rules and then tries to change the rules? How is that fair?

At least we agree on this US/HP merger...

 

[Wiskey Driver]

don't go and confuse gramps with the facts now!!!

The world, (at least America West) pilots most certainly owe him something!!! Why on Earth would one expect a grown man to be responsible for the choices he's made? When all else fails, go steal something...it works in the hood, why not at the airlines?

Hey dog,

what hood you talkin bout?

WD

 

[241BlujucCktl]

A question for REZ and all ALPA supporters.
Hypothetically, if you are an active pilot on a seniority list at the time of a merger announcement, (and the all important Policy Implementation Date) and you find out after the arbitration award that ALPA marked you down as furloughed and submitted a phony seniority list. Since you are such an ardent believer in ALPA policy, you would know that ALPA merger policy specifically states that the list presented shall be a CERTIFIED list. ALPA National reviews the award and finds nothing wrong with not following their written policy. Alpa National then endorses and presents the list to management.
Do you REZ and I am asking personally, if you were in this position:

A. Bend over, balance a tube of KY on your back and say “Come ALPA, Come AWA pilots, enjoy a windfall at my expense. I have reserved the last 2 inches of my lower intestine just for you.”
B. Ball up ALPA’s constitution, by laws and merger policy and leave them next to the toilette for clean up after your next defecation and proceed to cry yourself to sleep.
C. Stand up and vote to remove the self serving, dues taking, out of touch thugs who criminally neglect their own written policy.

Fairly certain Rez that you are that A type. Then again you probably would actually enjoy being that A type.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

and again!!!

Please justify deserve. Especially at the Wests' expense.



Because the East agreed to using Nic. The East aggred to binding Arbitration. The East was advised not to go this route. The East was advised, work it out on your own terms not Nic. The East was advised "you are not going to like the Nic Award".

Why is it fair the East made thier own choices, agreed to the rules and then tries to change the rules? How is that fair?

 

[Carl S.]

Another someone but me is to blame for my situation at AAA. Who submitted the bad list( AWA pilots, evil St. Nic.) or your own people? Step up a place the blame for your train wreck of a career on who has done it to you from day one, your own pilot group!

P.S.- I heard there were a few misspellings of middle names on the lists submitted and judges from all levels are looking into voiding the arbitrated award!

 

[Wiskey Driver]

A question for REZ and all ALPA supporters.
Hypothetically, if you are an active pilot on a seniority list at the time of a merger announcement, (and the all important Policy Implementation Date) and you find out after the arbitration award that ALPA marked you down as furloughed and submitted a phony seniority list. Since you are such an ardent believer in ALPA policy, you would know that ALPA merger policy specifically states that the list presented shall be a CERTIFIED list. ALPA National reviews the award and finds nothing wrong with not following their written policy. Alpa National then endorses and presents the list to management.
Do you REZ and I am asking personally, if you were in this position:

A. Bend over, balance a tube of KY on your back and say “Come ALPA, Come AWA pilots, enjoy a windfall at my expense. I have reserved the last 2 inches of my lower intestine just for you.”
B. Ball up ALPA’s constitution, by laws and merger policy and leave them next to the toilette for clean up after your next defecation and proceed to cry yourself to sleep.
C. Stand up and vote to remove the self serving, dues taking, out of touch thugs who criminally neglect their own written policy.

Fairly certain Rez that you are that A type. Then again you probably would actually enjoy being that A type.

First off my man let me help you out. You and many many other east folk seem to be under the impression "ALPA" is the entity that has a say one way or another. Well let me be one of the first to educate you. ALPA is nothing more than the people elected. ALPA has no say in your mec/lec meetings outside of that which is req'd by the dept of labor. ALPA has no vote in your mec's business. They simply provide the process by which you, me and 70,000 others voted on and accepted. So you guys need to stop looking at ALPA like it did anything at all to you or any other member in the east. That was the reps you elected! The merger committee you elected!! You know what? ALPA didn't have a damn thing to do with that but you did.

Time to man up and take responsibility for your actions...

WD

 

[PCL_128]

A question for REZ and all ALPA supporters.
Hypothetically, if you are an active pilot on a seniority list at the time of a merger announcement, (and the all important Policy Implementation Date) and you find out after the arbitration award that ALPA marked you down as furloughed and submitted a phony seniority list. Since you are such an ardent believer in ALPA policy, you would know that ALPA merger policy specifically states that the list presented shall be a CERTIFIED list. ALPA National reviews the award and finds nothing wrong with not following their written policy. Alpa National then endorses and presents the list to management.
Do you REZ and I am asking personally, if you were in this position:

A. Bend over, balance a tube of KY on your back and say “Come ALPA, Come AWA pilots, enjoy a windfall at my expense. I have reserved the last 2 inches of my lower intestine just for you.”
B. Ball up ALPA’s constitution, by laws and merger policy and leave them next to the toilette for clean up after your next defecation and proceed to cry yourself to sleep.
C. Stand up and vote to remove the self serving, dues taking, out of touch thugs who criminally neglect their own written policy.

Fairly certain Rez that you are that A type. Then again you probably would actually enjoy being that A type.

The entire premise of your scenario is faulty. The list was not "phony."

 

[241BlujucCktl]

In any organization there are rules to be followed. These rules (ALPA merger policy) were not followed. As a result the Nic List is seriously flawed and an illegal list. It is the duty of ALPA National to enforce and adhere to their Constitution By-Laws and Policies. They did not and have not and need to be held accountable. I can not continue to pay dues to an organization that violated it's own rules to deliberatly screw me out of my career. From the top to the bottom all of those involved in this violation need to be terminated without pension and without pay.

Honestly, if you think outside your own mind set, if you were in the same position that I am, wouldn't you fight it with every fiber in your body. I was an active US Air pilot at the time of the PID and was wrongly marked as furloughed. I would sooner see this place self implode than to accept an illegal list. What is wrong is wrong and I will fight for the side of right.

 

[coolyokeluke]

The pilot profession as a whole will be weakened with the splintering of the US Air people. As a whole, the profession would've been a lot better off if US Air would've gone the way of Eastern, Pan Am, Braniff, etc. If the Easties could put it in perspective they'd realize they are lucky just to have jobs. As it is the world's second biggest temper tantrum (#1 would be Palestinians/Isrealies) will continue indefinitely.

 

[becket]

In any organization there are rules to be followed. These rules (ALPA merger policy) were not followed. As a result the Nic List is seriously flawed and an illegal list. It is the duty of ALPA National to enforce and adhere to their Constitution By-Laws and Policies. They did not and have not and need to be held accountable. I can not continue to pay dues to an organization that violated it's own rules to deliberatly screw me out of my career. From the top to the bottom all of those involved in this violation need to be terminated without pension and without pay.

Honestly, if you think outside your own mind set, if you were in the same position that I am, wouldn't you fight it with every fiber in your body. I was an active US Air pilot at the time of the PID and was wrongly marked as furloughed. I would sooner see this place self implode than to accept an illegal list. What is wrong is wrong and I will fight for the side of right.

A "Policy" is not a "rule". You have no argument. USAPA will hang it's members with those yellow lanyards. They're promising things they will NEVER, EVER, EVER, be able to deliver on. Use your common sense. If USAPA wins, they, and the pilot group,(east) will be Dead on Arrival. However, because this is your stated wish, you'll be the only one smiling in the unemployment line. Good Luck Union Busting.

 

[Caspian27]

In any organization there are rules to be followed. These rules (ALPA merger policy) were not followed. As a result the Nic List is seriously flawed and an illegal list. It is the duty of ALPA National to enforce and adhere to their Constitution By-Laws and Policies. They did not and have not and need to be held accountable. I can not continue to pay dues to an organization that violated it's own rules to deliberatly screw me out of my career. From the top to the bottom all of those involved in this violation need to be terminated without pension and without pay.

Honestly, if you think outside your own mind set, if you were in the same position that I am, wouldn't you fight it with every fiber in your body. I was an active US Air pilot at the time of the PID and was wrongly marked as furloughed. I would sooner see this place self implode than to accept an illegal list. What is wrong is wrong and I will fight for the side of right.

Who provided the list of active pilots to the arbitrator? It wasn't some vindictive Westies was it? Oh that's right, wasn't it your own people at your own airline out East?

I you're trying to punish those who made the list you're doing a good job with your efforts to "self-implode" the company.

 

[Exskydiverdrivr]

When is the vote?

 

[Tejas-Jet]

Now...and April 17th can't get here soon enough. all the crap I've been getting in the mail...and I haven't been an ALPA member in over 10 years....

 

[TWA Dude]

I can not continue to pay dues to an organization that violated it's own rules to deliberatly screw me out of my career.

That's right, Sparky, ALPA National just continued it's love-fest with AWA by deliberately favoring them. {read dripping sarcasm}

You need to step off your self-imposed emotional rollercoaster and realize that the USAir pilots were screwed by the effects of two bankruptcies -- not ALPA. The biggest sin your MEC committed was not managing your expectations vis a vis the arbitration process. They should've told you your chances of DOH were nil. Judging by your emotional rant, however, I get the feeling you would've have believed them.

 

[get2flyin]

I was an active US Air pilot at the time of the PID and was wrongly marked as furloughed. I would sooner see this place self implode than to accept an illegal list. What is wrong is wrong and I will fight for the side of right.

You see, that's were you are mistaken. This so called "Embraer Division" that you junior East guys rant about WASN'T USAir. Why is that so confusing to you? It was "Jets for Jobs" at a sub-carrier. An employment opportunity for guys furloughed from the company that was spiraling to failure. Nobody owes you anything more than a recall opportunity to the bottom of the active pilots list before hiring off of the street began.

 

[PositiveRate]

241BlujucCktl,

You can take your DOH wet dream and shove it up your furloughed 'embraer division' a$s. The ruin of your career was complete before the merger was even announced.

Good luck with your yellow bellied FO friends. Your arrogance is staggering and your confidence is laughable.

Clear enough?

 

[TWA Dude]

Judging by your emotional rant, however, I get the feeling you would've have believed them.

If it isn't obvious, I meant to write "wouldn't have believed them".

 

[PHXFLYR]

It was..at least to the sane and rational amongst us.

PHXFLYR

 

[trainer8]

241BlujucCktl,

You can take your DOH wet dream and shove it up your furloughed 'embraer division' a$s. The ruin of your career was complete before the merger was even announced.

Good luck with your yellow bellied FO friends. Your arrogance is staggering and your confidence is laughable.

Clear enough?

Ahhh, yes, ALPA's Code of Ethics demonstrated by its finest.

PCL...you watching ALPA in action over here? Rez??? how about you?