Whats all this BS about the BS degree?

[SDF2BUF2MCO]

To degree or not to degree....
This has been pretty well debated but will add my $0.02. As already stated, a lot of businesses prefer a degree. That is the way the game is played. To enhance your "employability" it is probably a good idea to get a degree.
I personally have an AA, BS, and MS. Never use the blasted things but it certainly got my foot in the door. Did it make me a better person? The jury is still out .
It has been my experience though that businesses have plenty of smart and dynamic people. What businesses (and government) are lacking are people of diligence, honor, and character. That a degree cannot give you. Good luck.

 

[alimaui]

By the way...


quote:
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There are many people who went to college who are more educated than I am
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An educated man wouldn't end a sentence with a preposition. They taught me that in college.

They taught me in college that "am" is a VERB and not a preposition.

 

[chawbein]

Degree = You have both the intelligence and the work ethic to concentrate on one goal over a four year period and at the same time broaden your knowledge of the world around you.

A degree also is proof that you have the ability to learn new concepts and ideas and apply them. That shingle shows any employer that you have the ability to take any materiel and instruction they give you and apply it to a working situation. What else do you think they do in college, give you a book to read and ask you questions about it? No, you have to apply that knowledge to a "real world" problem.

You are right, you don't have to be smart to get a degree. That just makes it less difficult, because if you are "dumber than a box of rocks", it is going to take A LOT of hard WORK to get that shingle. Watch out for anyone who is an "idiot" who has their degree, because they'll probably work a helluva lot harder than your lazy ass and pass you by (me included).

As far as I'm concerned, I am in agreement with a previous post. Don't get your degree, that is just more room for me. Oh yeah, if you do get a degree, try to lose the attitude, most find it irritating.

 

[slide33]

I'm amazed that this TIMP guy didn't get his @$$ frag'd.

 

[bobbysamd]

College degree

You should go to college and get a degree for many reasons. For one thing, the degree is proof positive to the airlines that you can handle college-level classes. We all know how airline ground schools are firehoses and pressure-cookers, and are at least comparable to college classes. Having the degree shows you have at least minimal study skills to deal with the hose and cooker. Compare it to preparing for class and tests, and studying (did I hear "cram"? ) for finals. Preparing for two finals in a day is at least comparable for studying for ground school writtens and having procedures down cold for sim.

Something else that college does is train the mind to think and understand. You certainly need those attributes to be a professional pilot.

Maybe "commitment" is the key word. Some of the most stupid people I know are college graduates. However, you can earn a degree if you make a commitment to study, prepare and go to class.

One other point. The education you receive can help you with many aspects of flying. Taking courses in business, physics, physiology, and labor relations, especially, can lay the foundation you need for a successful career.

As someone else wrote, you can have the career without the degree. But, the airlines are looking for the degree. Give 'em what they want. In doing so, you'll benefit from the education.

 

[BigFlyr]

Ahhh, the big question... To get a degree or not to get a degree?

Well you have to ask yourself a question... If I get the degree will I fit the major airline "profile" that will at least get me an interview? If the answer is no... then don't. If the answer is yes, then go for it! If you've been in the business for a while, YOU KNOW WHAT THE PROFILE IS SO DON'T ASK!

As for me... I don't think I meet the "profile" but I got the degree before I ever intended to do this stuff for a living. Has it helped me in my aviation career? No, not yet, but I'm glad I have it anyway. Would I trade it if I could... for let's say 1000 hours PIC turbine? I'd have to seriously consider it!!!

 

[gsrcrsx68]

degree?

LEGITIMATE education--not because we have to as some employment requirement, but because we want to be educated, society-contributing citizens.

Comments like this have been a long time favorite of mine. I am surprised you didn't use the "worldly". My only comment back will be that society could certainly survive a lot better without the "educated-contributing citizens" than it could without the remaining population.

As to the degree, if you want to work in a field where you proceed through the ranks based on seniority, it is only fair that everyone start of with an equal set of requirements.

Also, for all those in the non-degree camp, sit a minute in the companies shoes. Why should someone take a chance. They aren't so much taking a chance on you as they are risking their job and livelyhood.

If you want to exist outside that type of structure, go ahead and do it. Start your own company, be an innovator. Don't be one of the sheople. Cut your own swath, just don't expect others to change their standards to make room for you. Make your own room.

Basically, if you want a job where the standard is a 4yr degree, better get the 4yr degree.

 

[enigma]

To all the grammer Nazi's

People, this is a forum for communication. Not a quest for grammatical perfection. I was taught in college english (honors for anyone that cares, Dr. Richard Folkerson, East Texas State University, 1980) that grammatical perfection was much less important than the ability to communicate.

I for one, don't care if someone else ends a sentence in a participle/gerund/noun/adverb, etc, as long as I understood what he was trying to convey.

For those of you that judge someones education/intelligence/etc, by his grammer on a internet bbs, you should realize that we are not writting our doctoral thesis here. I imaging that the people, like myself, who make grammatical errors in posts, would write entirely differently when composing a paper for their class professor. Ease up.

8N

 

[TIMP]

Slide33,

"I'm amazed that this TIMP guy didn't get his @$$ frag'd."

Spoken like a true "box of rocks!" Your comment demonstrates EXACTLY why enlisted soldiers get a bad rap. If the situation doesn't agree with them the first thing they will do is bad mouth the closest officer and want to frag him. An education would serve you well. I suggest you get one ASAP!

 

[gsrcrsx68]

Enigma, well said.

One other thing. Don't buy in to the BS about Bill Gates...He was an overpriviledged snot nose from the beginning and he is educated(regardless of how he got it, it is recognized). He is a great example of the fact that it is better to be lucky than good. There are plenty of people with greater minds, ideas and inventions and they will never become as rich as BG. Don't be so impressed by his wealth.

 

[guitarflyer]

A degree (any degree) will often open doors that otherwise would be closed to you.
I got my first job in aviation at a flight college ONLY because I had a degree, and my degrees are in nothing to do with aviation.

 

[rightrudder]

The other positive aspect of having a degree, especially in a non-aviation field of study, is having something to fall back on if you lose your flying job, medical, etc.

It is pretty tough to get a decent paying non-flying job without a degree of some kind.

 

[JBHewlett]

Degree

Folks,

Come on now. I mean, seriously, this conversation has gotten very harsh. Degrading people because they have a lack of education is just wrong, and extremely un-called for. There is no room for that kind of behavior. Lack of education is NOT the same as lack of intelligence.

I am not taking either side here. What a person wants to do with there is education is up to them. Just because someone doesn't have a four year college degree doesn't make them ignorant. This may be a free a country with free speech, but let’s watch what we say.

A four year college degree is something that may be required for a job with the airlines. However just because you don't have a four year degree doesn't mean that you aren't skillful and smart enough to fly a Seven Two or a Seven Four, it just happens to be a pre-requisite for the job. It’s not saying anything about your intelligence.

RT - If you want to get a degree then go for it man. I wish you the best of luck. If you don't want to get a degree, that’s fine too. It’s all up to you. Don't ever feel because you didn't that you are ignorant because you are not. Decisions like that in life are not to be taken lightly, it’s a big decision. College truly isn’t for everyone, we are all different.

Someone in here said something like "Anyone who chooses not to go to college is ignorant". That is just wrong. Really wrong. Don't ever say that. There are some people out there who can't afford to go to college. There was a movie called the "Boiler Room" it was about stock brokers that were snookering people out their money selling shares of stock from companies that didn't really exist. One character played by Ben Affleck made the statement "Anyone who tells you that they don't have a spare $2000 is lying to you!” That’s one of the stupidest statements I have ever heard. This is not a communist society where everyone makes the same about of money as each other regardless of occupation. Money is an issue.

Folks we are pilots. Look at what we do. Just step back and look. We have no room for this arrogant behavior. We are pilots people. Look some things, are going to have to change, fortunately we can't allow our selves to get arrogant. We take a sophisticated machine, and FLY IT UP INTO THE SKY, now that’s an amazing thing. We are probably one of the most closely knit Fraternities in the world. Let’s not bicker and argue with our brothers. We are pilots. Let’s start acting them.

Now I may only be 19 but I know this!

Keep it safe folks,
J.

 

[slide33]

Dearest TIMPle

If I told you I was an active duty Air Force officer with an engineering degree, what would you say then?

I sure hope I'm as smart as you some day.

 

[rumpletumbler]

slide33,

That is a cool Avatar.

RT

 

[bobbysamd]

More about education

I appreciate Avbug's comments about the College of Hard Knox being the best university. Further to that, I believe it was Samuel Clemons (Mark Twain) who said that he did not let his schooling interfere with his education. It's unfortunate that colleges don't offer Life 101. There are so many people who could test out of it.

Unfortunately, the College of Hard Knox does not grant degrees. You need a credential to show what you've learned in school, and life. That piece of paper from Riddle, or Yale, or Armpit A & M, documents that in large part. I had a friend in college who always said he was there to spend money to get a piece of paper so he could make money.

Chuck Yeager's history is well-known. Notwithstanding his abilities, his accomplishments are remarkable. But, if you think about it, his is a typical aviation story. Flew cool airplanes (P-51s, X-1, MiG-15), survived on his wits (evaded capture after being shot down), met people along the way who helped and mentored him (Gen. Boyd, Jackie Cochran, Jack Ridley), and was in the right place at the right time (Wright Field). Had fun (Pancho Barnes). Ultimately, he made it to the top. However, as much a bunch of hot sticks as we may think we are, in the final analysis we are a bunch of average Joes. We need all the help we can get. Few people are such stickouts that they can circumvent the system. In other words, get an education for its enrichment. Couple it with the College of Hard Knox. Get the degree and give the recruiters what they want so you can get what you want.

In looking back, I wish I would have gone back to school full-time, to someplace that offered a B.S. in Aero Science ( I already had a B.S. in B.A.). I feel that I missed out on a lot of education that might have helped me in my career. Just a thought to pass on.

 

[Jboss]

"I wasn't saying that everyone that is an enlisted man was a zero."

Don't shift tense in the middle of a sentance. And don't go to college if you don't want to. It is a great experience, though, so think about it.

By the way, were you home schooled?

 

[Bluto]

You've got to be kidding me!

Listen professor,
sentence is spelled without an "A"! And, it's generally accepted that you shouldn't begin a sentence with "and", except under certain circumstances.

 

[Jboss]

"I wasn't saying that everyone that is an enlisted man was a zero."

Don't shift tense in the middle of a sentance. And don't go to college if you don't want to. It is a great experience, though, so think about it.

By the way, were you home schooled?

 

[KlingonLRDRVR]

Right on Enigma,

Reading the replies from the "grammer Nazis" makes me smile. I am one of those no mind enlisted USMC infantry grunts with a Juris Doctorate who hires a secretary to fix my spelling and grammer errors. Cheers

KlingonLRDRVR