what happened at ASA on an ATR tonight?

[JimGlasair3]

I was watching one of our ATR's parked in "Hotel Mode?" on D the other day when they released the prop brake; wow. No warning at all; no slow spin up just an immediate high RPM. I am surprised that no one albeit ramp personnel or a lost passenger has inaderently wondered into the area when that monster has come alive. Litigation city.

I think ASA inherited a terrible ramp design! It was built for large fuselage aircraft that "require" a jetbridge; Eastern. Is Hotel Mode what it is called when the prop brake is engaged with the turbine running?

Good Flying

The other day on "D," one of our ATR's had a mechanical failure of the prop brake, and the prop let loose, when it wasn't supposed to. The immediate action is to shut down the engine. The prop isn't supposed to turn until clear of the ramp. This may or may not have been what you saw. These airplanes are suffering major mechanical problems on nearly every leg, and are probably near the end of their useful life. As far as the incident airplane is concerned, I wouldn't cry over tearing that engine down anyway. I had the incident airplane just two legs prior, wrote up the engine for torque surges in excess of 5%. I swapped airplanes. I don't know what maintenance did to clear the write up, but it was flying again in less than an hour.

Not sure about the C-ramp, but D is overcrowded with equipment, and there are no safety zones painted. Most of the airplanes are parked two deep at the same gate. In fact, a number of the line-up lines have been changed, without re-painting. Oh yea, it was dark and raining, so the lines wouldn't have been visible anyway. It has been an accident waiting to happen. Negligence on management's part, in my opinion.

While the FO had a basic responsibility to look out for obvious hazards, on the right side, it is very difficult to see if the airplane is clear of equipment.

"Hotel mode" is when the #2 engine is running with the prop brake engaged.

 

[Stifler's Mom]

When I flew the ATR, we were parked at the Top of C Concourse, when we had that crazy ass pull in parking up on the railings. Anyway, we were in hotel, and the Prop Brake Warning went off. I looked over my shoulder to see 2 rampers standing in front of the prop area. They wouldn't have been hit by it, but I guarentee that 2 guys would have needed new pairs of shorts if that thing had actually let go.

Stay the hell away from those engines when it's in hotel mode, I don't trust them enough to get near them.

 

[atrdriver]

These airplanes are suffering major mechanical problems on nearly every leg, and are probably near the end of their useful life.

Our oldest ATR is 13 years old. Hardly close to the end of their useful life. We have problems like this every 8 or 9 months when maint quits babying them. After a while they get sick of having them broke and they will start taking care of them for a few months, and the cycle will repeat. During the 7 years I was on the ATR it had a better dispatch rate than the jet did.

 

[Huck]

In 1000 hours I had the thing come out of hotel mode twice on its own....

 

[DrunkIrishman]

I have parked in spots where I thought things would get in the way, but through constant vigilance on the wing walker and my wing we cleared them. We simply cannot tell from the cockpit, which is why we use wing walkers. The crew will probably get to participate in a Critical Incident Review, but should not be disciplined for following company policy.

As for arm chair quarterbacks like Vandal, come fly with me sometime and I guarentee I can point out a few things you do wrong in the flight too. Show some support for your fellow pilots.

 

[Redan]

All Hail Mr. Vandal

I think our Mr. Vandal must be one of those vastly superior military pukes. He11, he's got a thousand hours! Must be nice to be able to sit up on a pedestal in judgement of other pilots.

Obviously our Mr. Vandal has no concept of the Atlanta ramp operation. I would like to see how much he'd enjoy parking that Herky Bird on our ramp three plus times a day during the multiple fourteen plus hour days per week enjoyed by our crews...in all weather day and night. He only gets to have two pilots, no engineer, no crew chief or observers. And he has to use our ground crews, many of whom would rather be anywhere than here. You see Mr. Vandal, this is not one of your orderly pristine military fields with accountable ground personnel. This is Atlanta, my friend. The ramp looks like a bomb went off with equipment scattered everywhere. Many spots aren't marked and involve maneuvering that ATR beast through an obstacle course, seldom just straight in...it's dark and you can't see whether you're clear...most airliners have considerably less visibility than a Herc. That's why we have to trust the ground crews for better or worse.

My advice to judgemental pilots: be very very careful my brother. Because you are setting yourself up to look like a major a$$ when your day comes. And it damm well will come.

 

[Speedtape]

Bottom line--many safety rules are compromised. However, the corporate culture accepts the risk because it's cheaper than a safer alternative! Unfortunately, many pilots contribute and enable this culture to perpetuate.

 

[imacdog]

I have also had wing walkers signalling to stop while the lead marshaller continues to direct us in, blissfully ignorant that our wingtip is about to strike something. Had that been on the left side of the plane, the captain probably wouldn't have seen it and we could have hit something. Atlanta is such a mess that I'm surprised incidents like this don't happen more often.

 

[ATR-DRIVR]

I have parked in spots where I thought things would get in the way, but through constant vigilance on the wing walker and my wing we cleared them. We simply cannot tell from the cockpit, which is why we use wing walkers. The crew will probably get to participate in a Critical Incident Review, but should not be disciplined for following company policy.

As for arm chair quarterbacks like Vandal, come fly with me sometime and I guarentee I can point out a few things you do wrong in the flight too. Show some support for your fellow pilots.

Good post.

 

[GreatView]

Is there something special about an ATR that makes this the marshaller's and not the crews fault?

No disrespect Vandal, but if all you have is 1,000hrs flight time, you don't even know how to fly yet.....

Get more experience and then put in your $.02