Weapons

[gearjockey]

Here's some more gristle for you guys to fight over:
Supreme Court scales back police right to search cars
The ruling limits searches to cases when there may be a weapon within the suspect's reach or evidence related to the arrest. The decision sets aside broader powers granted by the court in 1981.



http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-scotus-carsearch22-2009apr22,0,1967319.story

 

[Fly91]

That's correct Timmay! Also I've had hunters bring weapons on my aircraft and TSA just watched us walk into the FBO with them and didn't utter a word.

I carry my gun with me almost every single time I fly. The only places I will not take my gun are those states where I do not have reciprocity with my Florida concealed permit. Currently, I'm good to go into 32 states. But you have to be careful where you take hunters with "handguns", because transport of "handguns" and some long-guns across state lines, in some states, is illegal. And in some states, the people with the guns can get up to 3 years in prison mandatory. Possible you could get into trouble for allowing it, don't know. Take people into New York State with a handgun, look up the Sullivan Act. New Jersey has something just like it. Bad trouble.

I also do not carry my gun to just any foreign country. I have in the past gotten written temporary authority to carry my gun into a country from that countries officials. You simply ask and apply. Its a yes or a no. Caribbean countries are the easiest.

A good question you have is whether or not a cop can walk up to your private plane and just start going through it. I would guess "no way". That means they can search cars, hangars and peoples offices. The FAA can;t even search a plane, they are just allowed to check and look for specific items. I highly doubt it inside the United States. Only time there's nothing you can do when law enforcement wants to search your plane is when you clear back into the USA. There's no way I'd ever let a cop search our planes at a corporate jet served airport at an FBO in any state. I'd lock it and tell them to get a search warrant, unless the boss said it was ok. If they find a gun, who cares. As long you are not posessing it illegally...meaning concealing it on your person without an acceptable license or its a state where handguns are simply not allowed, who cares if they see it. Even in New York/New Jersey long-guns are ok to own and carry from place to place, just not handguns.

I used to fly for a company out of Orlando, everywhere we went, regardless of which state, my boss had armed gaurds with him, but they all had federal license which allowed them to carry in every state.

But...what FBO do you fly out of that has TSA standing there? Just curious. I've never seen them at an FBO anywhere.

As mentioned earlier by someone, you're not supposed to take a weapon into a secured area of an airport "terminal" known as the "sterile area" of an airport. But there's no law that says you cannot carry a weapon, concealed on your person with a permit or in a proper case unloaded and locked anywhere on the grounds of airport that does not have a passenger terminal. An FBO is not a passenger terminal controlled under the same laws as an airline terminal at a large airport with "security checkpoints and defined sterile areas."
This is who I ask all of my law related questions regarding firearms, airports or transportation. They answer any questions and they do it for free. The best attorney for firearms questions in the country.
http://www.floridafirearmslaw.com/m...ry_Code=Analysis-Florida-New-Self-Defense-Law

 

[Fly91]

Let me ask this: what good is a gun do you in flight sitting in your holster? Unless you have reinforced cockpit door to "slow" someone down a bit, tactically you are a sitting duck!

I only carry my gun everywhere I go as to protect myself in the hotel and in the city, just like I do at home.
Arming pilots in cockpits, I think, is plain stupid and will stop nothing anyway. Most of the boobs I know will kill themselves first up there.

On a corporate jet, I know everyone that boards it. Or I trust my people to allow non-terrorists to fly with us only.

 

[Fly91]

You might want to read Heller. The Supreme court has indicated therein that the 2nd amendment conveys an individual right to keep and bear arms.

Also, in most cases where firearms are being posessed illegally....but were used in self-defense, there are usually no criminal charges ever filed. Like Leo Goetts in New York City. Killed like 3 attackers and got off scott free. Used a concealed handgun.

So really, it falls back on the whole "right to bare arms". How can you prosecute someone that saved their own life from an attacker.

 

[stupidpilot]

Signature @ ORD has a TSA checkpoint there. Score one for the Daly political machine to waste more taxpayer money.

 

[avbug]

Also, in most cases where firearms are being posessed illegally....but were used in self-defense, there are usually no criminal charges ever filed.

Wrong.

Like Leo Goetts in New York City. Killed like 3 attackers and got off scott free.

"Leo Goetts" was a character in a Mel Gibson movie. You may be thinking of Bernhard Goetz. He was charged with attempted murder and assault. He did serve a brief 8 month prison sentence, and did not get off "scott free." Ultimately he was convicted of criminal possesesion of a firearm. Of course, he also lost the subsequent law suits against him, suffering 43 million in damages based on the jury award against him, and declared bankrupcy.

So really, it falls back on the whole "right to bare arms".

That's the "right to bear arms," genius.

No doubt you also have the right to go sleeveless if you want, however. That's up to you.

How can you prosecute someone that saved their own life from an attacker.

An honest, but naive question, as it happens all the time. Including the situation which you just cited, with Bernhard Goetz. The circumstances dictate.

Historically there's a high probability that you will see your firearm confiscated and face prosecution if you injure or kill someone, even defensively. Where, when, what, and how it occured are important factors. Whether you go to jail or not, there exists also a high probability that you'll face a civil law suit. If the charges don't get you, the expenses will. The crowd loves to parrot phrases such as "molon labe" and "better to be judged by twelve than carried by six." Those who do have never been on the unpleasant end of a law suit against which it's out of their pocket to defend.

Press the trigger, and nobody wins.

 

[Sandhawk]

That's the "right to bear arms," genius.

Press the trigger, and nobody wins.

It's "Pull the trigger" - genius


:smash:

 

[erichartmann]

Avbug,

The following quote from your post #76:

"You're a militia, are you? To which militia do you belong? You belong to a well regulated militia? "

clearly implies you believe belonging to a militia is a prerequisite for the "right to keep and bear arms" as enumerated in the 2nd Amendment. The so-called requirement to belong to a militia was one of the anti-gunner's classic arguements. Heller says otherwise. Unfortunately the court left somewhat open the meaning of "shall not be infringed" by indicating that some police regulation might not be out of the question. Personally, I think "shall not be infringed" means just what it says any law which restricts my right to "keep and bear" infringes that right. Getting that through a court in, say D.C. or MA. is another thing. I prefer to not fight battles I can't win.

 

[erichartmann]

(partial quote)

Historically there's a high probability that you will see your firearm confiscated and face prosecution if you injure or kill someone, even defensively. Where, when, what, and how it occured are important factors. Whether you go to jail or not, there exists also a high probability that you'll face a civil law suit. If the charges don't get you, the expenses will. The crowd loves to parrot phrases such as "molon labe" and "better to be judged by twelve than carried by six." Those who do have never been on the unpleasant end of a law suit against which it's out of their pocket to defend.

Press the trigger, and nobody wins.

None-the-less some might see that as preferable to being killed, seriously, perhaps permanently injured or maimed even after the court cases.

I believe I have a right to defend myself. The fact that current law might allow me to be charged and/or sued is a travesty. The solution is to change the laws. There are people working on that.

 

[stupidpilot]

If you read some of the framer's thoughts regarding the right to bear arms, as opposed to just the verbiage in the 2nd amendment. It is clear that they thought each individual should have the right to bear arms.

 

[Fly91]

Signature @ ORD has a TSA checkpoint there. Score one for the Daly political machine to waste more taxpayer money.

Wow, didn't know that, maybe because we avoid Signature like the plague.

Metal detectors too? Because they can't tell anyone not using an actual airport/airline terminal (sterile area), that they cannot walk onto a private plane with a gun. Its allowed. I do it all the time and so did my old bosses armed guards.

As long as its legal where you are departing from to possess a gun, have a blast. They can care less where you're going.

 

[Fly91]

Wrong.

"Leo Goetts" was a character in a Mel Gibson movie. You may be thinking of Bernhard Goetz. He was charged with attempted murder and assault. He did serve a brief 8 month prison sentence, and did not get off "scott free." Ultimately he was convicted of criminal possesesion of a firearm. Of course, he also lost the subsequent law suits against him, suffering 43 million in damages based on the jury award against him, and declared bankrupcy.

That's the "right to bear arms," genius.

I stand corrected on his name. Leo was much more memorable.
I didn't know Bernhard was found guilty of firearms possession.....whats important is he was found NOT GUILTY on all major charges.
You can't deny that saving his own life is what the jury realized....and set him free from the major charges.
It happens ALL THE TIME when thugs are involved.

SO.......do you think it was worth sitting in jail for that 8 months, by carrying an illegal weapon....which saved his own life? I'd carry an illegal gun anywhere that I knew was a dangerous place to be....and I have many times and will again in the future. Like I said before, when it comes to my life, I make the rules.

Historically there's a high probability that you will see your firearm confiscated and face prosecution if you injure or kill someone, even defensively. Where, when, what, and how it occured are important factors. Whether you go to jail or not, there exists also a high probability that you'll face a civil law suit. If the charges don't get you, the expenses will. The crowd loves to parrot phrases such as "molon labe" and "better to be judged by twelve than carried by six." Those who do have never been on the unpleasant end of a law suit against which it's out of their pocket to defend.

Press the trigger, and nobody wins.

You're absolutely wrong on that matter. Lawful self-defense carries zero consequences, except maybe you'll be a little stressed out that you blew some scumbags head off in your house. Pick up the journal from the Florida Department of Agriculture and Consumer Services. They outline literally hundreds of cases in my state where lawful self-defense ended in a dead person going to the morgue and the shooter going home with his firearm the same day/night. They also outline cases where it was obvious deadly force should not have been used (bad judgement) and those people usually got manslughter, never murder charges. I have the journal right here. Maybe where you live its different, Florida, we have the right to kill if we're in danger of just great bodily harm, doesn't have to be the fear of death. And the definition in this state of great bodily harm is a broken bone or the possibility of getting stitches. But of course, a shooter must always claim he/she was in fear of their life. Coupled with the "stand your ground" rule that went into effect Oct 2005, bad guys need to be very careful in Florida.

Lawsuits, good luck to a family winning a lawsuit against a shooting that the police, prosecutors office and investigators say was totally lawful self-defense. Only reason Goetz was able to be taken to civil court was because he was found guilty of the possession charge. That opened the door. But like in his case, if some azzclown jury does award monies, just declare bankruptcy and shoot that family a bird in court. Don't pay a penny.

 

[avbug]

clearly implies you believe belonging to a militia is a prerequisite for the "right to keep and bear arms" as enumerated in the 2nd Amendment.

I said no such thing. Put words in your own mouth, not mine. The post to which you refer was made in response to an utterly idiotic comment made by firefly, another poster. His comment read:

Most gun laws are illegal anyway no matter what some idiot judge, politician or lawyer says.

Firefly called upon the 2nd ammendment as evidence of what he or she believes to the the only acceptable law regarding the possession of firearms.

So far as the issues of militia; this has already been discussed in this thread ad infinitum. Apparently you missed out.

SO.......do you think it was worth sitting in jail for that 8 months, by carrying an illegal weapon....which saved his own life?

You'd be best served knowing what it is you're talking about before you post, as clearly you don't.

Goetz wasn't in mortal danger, and no threats were made to his life, nor was an attempt made on his life. Four men were present, one asked him for five dollars. Goetz asked the man to repeat himself, and later testified that while the man repeated his request for five dollars, Goetz was planning a "pattern of fire," and intending to shoot the men.

Upon the second request, he stood and opened fire. His life wasn't in danger. His weapon didn't save his life. He subsequently ran, hid for nearly two weeks on the run, dismantled his weapon and spread the pieces in the woods, and finally surrendered. Not exactly the act of an innocent man who was simply defending his life.

You might want to pick a better example...because Goetz hardly supports your twisted concepts. You weren't aware of the charges the jail time, and apparenly don't grasp the concept of being fined 34 million dollars, either...or going bankrupt. You clearly weren't aware that his life wasn't in danger, that the only attempted murder was on his part, and that he spent as little time incarcerated that he did only because of the popular media.

All quite irrelevant to the subject of carrying a firearm as a crewmember under Part 135...to which end you appear to have some difficulty contributing. Can you do this?

I'd carry an illegal gun anywhere that I knew was a dangerous place to be....and I have many times and will again in the future.

Clearly you're not a man of honor, not a law abiding citizen. In fact, by your own admission, you're a criminal with intent to commit the same crimes again. That really makes you no better than the people you fear. You're an intentional law breaker.

Lawful self-defense carries zero consequences, except maybe you'll be a little stressed out that you blew some scumbags head off in your house.

You're probably a young guy...in your twenties perhaps, or even still a teenager? That naive mentality, so terribly ignorant of reality, is more dangerous than you realize.

Only reason Goetz was able to be taken to civil court was because he was found guilty of the possession charge. That opened the door.

Aaaah...no. Goetz was able to be sued regardless of the outcome of the criminal trial. He severely wounded four men, one of whom was confined to a wheel chair for life. He was open to a law suit, regardless of any criminal charges...as is usually the case in a defensive shooting. You really know nothing about this, do you?

But like in his case, if some azzclown jury does award monies, just declare bankruptcy and shoot that family a bird in court. Don't pay a penny.

And with that I think we can fairly safely discount anything further you might have to say on the subject, as your immaturity and lack of credibility negate any need to listen to you further. You're on the ignore list, too.

 

[Fly91]

I said no such thing. Put words in your own mouth, not mine. The post to which you refer was made in response to an utterly idiotic comment made by firefly, another poster. His comment read:



Firefly called upon the 2nd ammendment as evidence of what he or she believes to the the only acceptable law regarding the possession of firearms.

So far as the issues of militia; this has already been discussed in this thread ad infinitum. Apparently you missed out.



You'd be best served knowing what it is you're talking about before you post, as clearly you don't.

Goetz wasn't in mortal danger, and no threats were made to his life, nor was an attempt made on his life. Four men were present, one asked him for five dollars. Goetz asked the man to repeat himself, and later testified that while the man repeated his request for five dollars, Goetz was planning a "pattern of fire," and intending to shoot the men.

Upon the second request, he stood and opened fire. His life wasn't in danger. His weapon didn't save his life. He subsequently ran, hid for nearly two weeks on the run, dismantled his weapon and spread the pieces in the woods, and finally surrendered. Not exactly the act of an innocent man who was simply defending his life.

You might want to pick a better example...because Goetz hardly supports your twisted concepts. You weren't aware of the charges the jail time, and apparenly don't grasp the concept of being fined 34 million dollars, either...or going bankrupt. You clearly weren't aware that his life wasn't in danger, that the only attempted murder was on his part, and that he spent as little time incarcerated that he did only because of the popular media.

All quite irrelevant to the subject of carrying a firearm as a crewmember under Part 135...to which end you appear to have some difficulty contributing. Can you do this?



Clearly you're not a man of honor, not a law abiding citizen. In fact, by your own admission, you're a criminal with intent to commit the same crimes again. That really makes you no better than the people you fear. You're an intentional law breaker.



You're probably a young guy...in your twenties perhaps, or even still a teenager? That naive mentality, so terribly ignorant of reality, is more dangerous than you realize.



Aaaah...no. Goetz was able to be sued regardless of the outcome of the criminal trial. He severely wounded four men, one of whom was confined to a wheel chair for life. He was open to a law suit, regardless of any criminal charges...as is usually the case in a defensive shooting. You really know nothing about this, do you?



And with that I think we can fairly safely discount anything further you might have to say on the subject, as your immaturity and lack of credibility negate any need to listen to you further. You're on the ignore list, too.

avbug,

It appears in many threads that all you do is argue anytime you say something that someone else argues with or does not agree with. You're relentless.

Go get a job and spend more time making money than talking all this crap.

And I am not like the criminals I protect myslef against........but I will do what I deem necessary to protect myslef from them. And if that includes, on occassion carrying my gun to places and in places that is illegal, I'll do it, and continue to do it. The constitution says I can, thats the law I follow.

And damn.....please set the ignore setting.

 

[stupidpilot]

avbug,

It appears in many threads that all you do is argue anytime you say something that someone else argues with or does not agree with. You're relentless.

Go get a job and spend more time making money than talking all this crap.

And I am not like the criminals I protect myslef against........but I will do what I deem necessary to protect myslef from them. And if that includes, on occassion carrying my gun to places and in places that is illegal, I'll do it, and continue to do it. The constitution says I can, thats the law I follow.

And damn.....please set the ignore setting.

I knew I liked you.