Vote underway at Skywest

[Bluto]

That's disturbing Splert, I can't wait until the next time a SAPA guy bashes ALPA national for making so much cash...

 

[Halo_RJdriver]

Vote no for the sorry trailer trash proposal!

SGU is already chatting with ASA about 900's they don't give us the time of day.

Sapa don't go away mad, JUST GO AWAY!!!

 

[difete]

I am all for a "NO" on this vote. But then what? Managment says, ok then, see ya... There is nothing else SAPA can do. I think to be paid by aircraft type, while all other competitors (regionals) compensate by seating arrangment is not a form of compensation that is fair and competitive with the current market.

To fly a 90 seater for a 50 seat salary?? So much for profit sharing.

My .2 cents.

 

[OCP]

I have heard some representative credit around 140 hours a month. Others have asked SAPA to release what they credit for SAPA related duties. No reply.

They are paid 2 for 1 flight pay for SAPA related stuff. If a SAPA representative is on an overnight, at home or on a DH he can bill the company for SAPA related duty. It’s a great part time job and fits nice into reserve or line flying.

Here is a test.

Go to the SAPA site and use the GMT and request they release what they earn from SAPA. Remember it took them almost 3 years to admit they even got paid. The ol' 'we are just volunteers' BS.

The group will never know how 'lucrative" the position is without the data, right?

SAPA will not release the data. I know because others have asked.

Would seem like the SAPA guys would really NOT want SAPA to go away with pay rates like that!

 

[Rick James]

I'm getting really tired of my new FO's telling me "who cares 1.2% is better than nothing". I should have a script trying to explain how little they know of the industry. Thankfully, every now and then I'll get a Laker or someone that's atleast done more than flight instructing to exchange ideas with. I have a feeling things are really going to change at SKW with ASA and all the new BK's.

 

[Plug]

Vote no for the sorry trailer trash proposal!

SGU is already chatting with ASA about 900's they don't give us the time of day.

Sapa don't go away mad, JUST GO AWAY!!!

You are right, Jerry and company were here in ATL all week and the CRJ 705/900 was mentioned quite a bit. It was not stated as to which company they would go but the plan is not to pit one group against the other. Yeah right, actions speak louder than words. I hope the no vote passes so they can float this turd down the ASA negotiating river for us to say "hell NO" on.

On the ALPA note, how is the interest out west? I have heard some disturbing talk that some of the ALPA malcontents, also known as RJDC, are planning to derail the drive for ALPA. If these folks appear in your crew lounge you should listen to what they have to say with a 10lb bag of salt. The RJDC has brought up some good points and has a real issue with ALPA scope at the mainline carriers. Most of this comes out of the CMR camp and they are especially bitter given recent events, understandably so, but you have to take history in to account also.

CMR was pissed from the start when DAL bought them because they were about to be a standalone airline, buy Spirit, yada yada yada... They may have but that wasn't how the cookie crumbled. They say that mainline scope is way too restrictive and has a devastating affect on your career. Well, if anything mainline scope was poor in the sense that it didn't help the mainline pilots as much as they thought and in fact DCI has grown tremendously over the last 5 years in fleet size and aircraft size. Neither ASA, CMR, or SKW has furloughed to this point, unlike mainline.

RJDC's response to that is "mainline scope allowed a bidding war for DCI flying and a subsequent 'race to the bottom', and that is because they did not allow the WO's to negotiate with DAL for scope of DCI flying." Remember this, the RJDC feels that the WO's are more entitled than non WO's like SKW. When you are negotiating a percentage of your flying away to be outsourced, should you really be concerned with who it is outsourced to? It all comes down to timing!

Fact is that ALPA is the only union for an airline pilot. Aeromed., legal, etc. are top notch and an asset that would not be found at any other union. Does ALPA have its faults? Hell yeah, and letting the RJ cat out of the bag is one of them, but hindsight is 20/20 and the RJDC loves to say "I told you so."

I know I hijacked this thread, but there is a reason. It sounds like no matter how you vote on this POS proposal the result will be the result that SGU and SAPA wants. This is simply mental masturbation for the Skywest pilots. If you want the real deal then you need to vote in a union that gives you that voice and gives you the tools necessary to have some say as to how your career at Skywest will be.

Cheers

 

[auspac]

Bluto. Personally I don't believe it's right to cut and paste internal communications to this board so I will simply refer to the letter to pilots that DA sent on Sep 22.

 

[Bluto]

What exactly is "internal" about this message? Why wouldn't SAPA want it's feelings on this agreement known unless they were ashamed of it? More importantly, now that it's been posted, I'm surprised you still don't feel the need to retract your previous statement. It's clear that SAPA does in fact endorse this proposal, as they themselves have stated. Care to correct yourself? Or not?

 

[Dave Benjamin]

The more internal information you post here the less you'll get in the future. Posting details of the TA is fine. There's no need to cut and paste entire emails from SAPA though. I've seen some folks do the same thing with comm from BH. Keep the stuff off Flightinfo. The folks that need to know are already getting it.

 

[Bluto]

Dave, it's edited out of respect for you. To be fair, I only pasted a few sentences specifically refuting auspac's inaccurate post. I shouldn't have put it there in the first place, though. Sorry.

 

[Halo_RJdriver]

What exactly is "internal" about this message? Why wouldn't SAPA want it's feelings on this agreement known unless they were ashamed of it? More importantly, now that it's been posted, I'm surprised you still don't feel the need to retract your previous statement. It's clear that SAPA does in fact endorse this proposal, as they themselves have stated. Care to correct yourself? Or not?

damn straight. Nice post Bluto

www.skywest.alpa.org

VOTE NO BOYZZZ

 

[surplus1]

I have heard some disturbing talk that some of the ALPA malcontents, also known as RJDC, are planning to derail the drive for ALPA. If these folks appear in your crew lounge you should listen to what they have to say with a 10lb bag of salt. The RJDC has brought up some good points and has a real issue with ALPA scope at the mainline carriers. Most of this comes out of the CMR camp and they are especially bitter given recent events, understandably so, but you have to take history in to account also.

I'm in the "CMR camp" and I'm going to call you what you are: a liar. I don't believe you have "heard" anything for there is nothing to hear. Your allegation is false. The information you are putting out about the RJDC opposing any airline joining ALPA is blatantly false. I don't really care whether you like the RJDC or you don't but there is no need for you to lie about it.

The RJDC does not interfere and has never interfered in the political process, not at CMR itself and not anywhere else. The RJDC does NOT oppose anyone joining ALPA. The RJDC has never asked CMR pilots or ASA pilots to consider leaving ALPA. In fact the RJDC is against the idea of leaving ALPA.

If SKYW pilots would like to join ALPA that would be a great idea. They would be welcome.

The RJDC litigation is an effort to get ALPA to honor its Duty of Fair Representation to the CMR and ASA pilots. It has nothing to do with leaving ALPA and all of the RJDC leaders and members at Comair are also ALPA members in good standing.

There's nothing worse than running your mouth when you don't know what you're talking about or to deliberately spread false information. SKYW pilots will never see anyone from the RJDC asking them not to join ALPA. That just isn't true!

Stop spreading false propaganda! Now go back into your hole and STFU.

 

[Texx]

I'm in the "CMR camp" ...

Stop spreading false propaganda! Now go back into your hole and STFU.

For the Skywest pilots, as you can see he is truly a professional.

 

[No Delay]

I posted this on another thread but I thought it would fit here also. I am posting this not to fight but because I really don't understand...



I am having a hard time understanding what the big deal is in having a different pay scale for different size airplanes. I know some of you are passionate about it...and that's definately your right. I just don't get it. To me, it is the same amount of work to fly a 40 and a 50 seat...I can't see the 70 or 90 being that much more work????

Do mechanics have a different pay scale for the airplanes they work on? F/A? What about the rampers (it definately more work for them)???

I think pay should be based on experience...maybe an increase in the upper ranges in longevity scale. I think there is more value in an experienced pilot versus a pilot who can fly a 50 or a 90 seat airplane. (Any I am way at the bottom of the experience ladder, so I am not trying to give myself a raise).

Scheduling issues and QOL issues just seems like it would be so much more important to fight about. I would like to see major improvement in QOL, a slight pay raise across the board, and maybe a bigger spread (increase) in the longevity payscale.
Usually the senior guys get the bigger airplane...so essentially, they are being paid more on the bigger airplane. But in reality, they are getting paid more because they are more experienced...that just makes sense to me.

 

[synchoff]

I am having a hard time understanding what the big deal is in having a different pay scale for different size airplanes. I know some of you are passionate about it...and that's definately your right. I just don't get it. To me, it is the same amount of work to fly a 40 and a 50 seat...I can't see the 70 or 90 being that much more work????

It's very simple, really. It has NOTHING to do with workload.

Senior guys run the union. Senior guys want more pay. It's to their advantage to have different payscales, as their senority gives them the ability to bid schedules that have the larger aircraft/payscales.

A single payscale would be MUCH fairer for the group, but the senior boys insist "we've paid our dues" and carve out a little bit extra for themselves.

Ocam's razor, baby