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Virgin America provokes fare wars at LAX

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Big Slick

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 18, 2004
Posts
284
For years, JetBlue Airways Corp. turned up its nose at flying out of Los Angeles International Airport, saying that LAX was too big, too crowded and, well, that it just preferred to operate out of smaller hubs.

Then out of the blue last month, the low-cost carrier stunned LAX officials by asking for gates there. Moreover, it wanted them in Terminal 6 next to Virgin America, the airline started by eccentric British billionaire Richard Brabson.

It was no surprise to industry observers. Branson is once again shaking up the industry with an airline that is offering low fares and unusual onboard amenities.

The repercussions have been particularly visible at LAX where the airline has heated up the kind of competition the airport hasn't seen in recent memory.

LAX passengers flying to popular domestic destinations such as San Francisco and New York are enjoying some of the lowest fares in years despite record fuel prices.

"We've become a hotbed of competition," said Paul Haney, the airport's deputy executive director. "I don't know if we could say that without Virgin America."

Since Virgin America began flying out of LAX in August with fares as low as $44 one-way, competitors have been beefing up flights and lowering fares and even JetBlue has been prompted to enter the market.

Southwest, United and Alaska airlines, long LAX mainstays, added flights to routes served by Virgin America. And they either matched or lowered fares closer to that offered by the airline.

When Virgin America announced it would begin flying between LAX and Seattle, Alaska quickly responded by adding three more flights between the two cities.

The additional flights would begin in April, a month before Virgin America had planned to enter the Seattle market. Not to be outdone, Virgin America changed the start of the service, pushing it up to April and announced it would offer one-way $77 fares, or about half of the prevailing rate.

Forest Hills, N.Y.-based JetBlue, which has had its part in shaking up the industry with discount fares since it started flying in 2000, said last month that it would begin serving LAX passengers with four daily flights to New York and Boston beginning in May.

The sudden flurry of choices for flights to some of the more popular destinations has been a boon for LAX consumers, who are seeing fares as much as half of what they had been used to paying.

"It's been awesome," said Brandon Brown, a San Francisco State University student whose family lives in Westchester and was flying down from San Francisco on a Virgin America flight. "Sometimes it's now cheaper for me to fly than drive."

And analysts don't expect much of a letdown in competition as Virgin America looks to expand at LAX.

The airline said that over time its operations at LAX would be "relatively equal in size" to its main hub in San Francisco where it has its headquarters.

"We'd love to grow there," Virgin America Chief Executive David Cush said. "It's a huge travel market."

The airline said it was talking to LAX officials about expanding, including the possibility of moving from Terminal 6, where it has two gates to Terminal 3, where it would like to eventually have as many as six gates.

The airline currently operates 12 flights at LAX, flying to three cities: San Francisco, New York and Washington. That will grow to five cities by this summer. In all, the airline envisions flying to 30 cities within three years.

But some analysts questioned whether the airline could sustain the growth or even survive amid record fuel prices and a slowing economy that is expected to reduce air travel.

"It's a tough environment," said Ray Neidl, an aviation analyst with Calyon Securities.

Cush said that the airline didn't expect to be profitable for two more years, taking longer than planned because of high fuel prices. But Cush said the airline was well positioned financially to weather any downturn.

"If we had started two years ago when fuel was half the cost we would have been able to reach profitability a lot faster," Cush said, noting how regulators had twice killed plans to launch the airline because of concerns with foreign ownership.

The airline got approval to fly after Branson's Virgin Group lowered its stake in the airline by half to 25%.

Virgin America is hoping that passengers will be drawn to not only its low fares but also to its amenities at a time when most airlines are slashing service to cut costs.

Trying to project the image of a hip airline, it has mood-lighting in the cabin and personal video screens at every seat with which passengers can order meals, watch on-demand movies and engage in an "in-flight chat room."

But analysts have questioned whether such amenities can draw the more lucrative business traveler who typically flies major U.S. carriers such as United and American because of their frequent-flier programs.

Cush said the airline was looking at various marketing and other frequent-flier tie-ins with major airlines, a move that would appeal to business travelers like Scott Vigil, director of sales at Kensington Computer Products Group.

"I fly United and American because of all the frequent-flier miles I have with them," the Carlsbad, Calif., resident said. But he added that a Virgin America tie-in with a major airline "would be exceptionally compelling."
 
Why is Branson said to be "eccentric"? All he has done is make a fortune with successful businesses and endeavors. The media sucks.
 
competition isn't going anywhere- we will always be under cost pressure- our industry is and always will be thrown under the bus so that cheap fares will get the public traveling and stimulate the economy.
 
The reason Jet Blue wants into LAX is to kick VAs @ss
 
It's amazing how well a company can do when its pilots will work for less than a living wage.

VA pilots, you are the scum of the earth. The hottest level of hell is reserved for you a-holes that undercut the rest of the industry.

How's your kid's college fund looking on those wages?

How about this month's grocery bill?

Not a big deal, I guess...as long as your wife or daughter is a prostitute.

Like father, like daughter.
 
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You forgot about Skybus....and Delta (after paycuts).

Sybus thank God is in the process of getting killed. VA will cause alot more troubles flying out of such large cities. VA must go. Branson is a child molester. Dont believe me? Just look at him, look close. Is that the face of somone you would want to watch your kids.
 
It's amazing how well a company can do when its pilots will work for less than a living wage.

VA pilots, you are the scum of the earth. The hottest level of hell is reserved for you a-holes that undercut the rest of the industry.

How's your kid's college fund looking on those wages?

How about this month's grocery bill?

Not a big deal, I guess...as long as your wife or daughter is a prostitute.

Like father, like daughter.


Jeez, tell us how how you really feel! Just finished Flying The Line book, and all of this is just more of the same, just a different year. In this industry it has always been an us versus them mentality whether it is pilot group vs management or pilot group vs pilot group. Until we all stand together we will have issues that continue to divide and conquer the pilots.
 
It's amazing how well a company can do when its pilots will work for less than a living wage.

VA pilots, you are the scum of the earth. The hottest level of hell is reserved for you a-holes that undercut the rest of the industry.

How's your kid's college fund looking on those wages?

How about this month's grocery bill?

Not a big deal, I guess...as long as your wife or daughter is a prostitute.

Like father, like daughter.

Year 1 fo pay 44/hr...Higher than more than a few in the industry... year 6 capt..higher than usair... the difference is the va did not vote for a paycut.

Do you also think the most senior SWA guys are scum b/c they once worked for below industry std?
 
Do you also think the most senior SWA guys are scum b/c they once worked for below industry std?

in a word, yes.

I am one of the most anti-union dudes on this forum, so don't quote "flying the line" on me, fella.

but I will ask how that "higher than industry standard" wage is treating you in the most expensive region to live in the US?

how about those work rules?

adjusted for cost of living in the bay area, WTF are you thinking? raise the bar, don't lower it, junior.

scum.
 
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Sure,

Most certainly not trying to paint it like its industry leading or anything. Just made the comparison to UsAirways due to the fact that approximately 35% of VA is former UsAirways pilots. These guys have put in their dues for a long time; the East guys especially. Most of them were proud ALPA members for a long time too. They chose to leave UsAirways to come to VA b/c they saw something for themselves and their families. To be called scum by some constant flamer, who is probably a real life flamer. Is unfair.. These guys have put in their dues in this industry, and are making a choice they is right.
 
Guys- you're dumb if you think the ship sinks or swims on pilot pay. Southwest has been the highest for how long? And still profitable. They're profitable b/c they give a damn and actually try to make the company money-- If pilots have any stake in taking down a company- like UAL was accused of- it's b/c management doesn't keep their promises - therefore the summer of hell- and the leftover "F- you, United" mentality. We can save so much $$ if we cared to.

So i don't care what VA works for-= that's on them. And Joevollers has a point. Right now VA is fighting for their existence. So pay is low. USAir is profitable now- yet the bankruptcy contract is still in place??? Who's the bigger scum by your logic?

I will say though that you are forgetting Joe that you start over at year 1 scale when you upgrade at VA.
 
Pilots are willing to fly for that b/c for so many- it is a step up. You're seeing the result of the unions across the industry looking out for only the senior- and selling out the young and junior and voiceless. If you looked out for the junior-didn't release your scope and have them fly your more fuel efficient dc9's/partial 73/ab replacement jets without even getting a seniority number- there wouldn't be all those RJ pilots for whom VA is a step up. You want to complain- do it to a mirror. Maybe you should have thought more long term, instead of selling out at every chance... If one of the major airlines had held the line on pay and risked their company going out of business you all could talk about what VA is working for. Until then- I don't get the whole lot of you.
 

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