USAPA's Real Motivation

[JoeMerchant]

Boy doesn't this make ALPA look even worse now.....They are employing the same tactics that management uses.....Power corrupts.....

This is almost as good as watching Hillary and Obama attack each other......

 

[JoeMerchant]

BINGO!!!


So really ALPA is no different than say..... our own democractic gov't..... which is built on our founding fathers democratic ways....

I'll agree that ALPA is very similar to our own "democratic gov't"....Both are broken.....possibly beyond repair....I'm not a big fan of the way the country is headed either...I'm not jumping on the Obama "change" bandwagon....Our founding fathers were not big fans of "democracy".....That is why we are a democratic republic.....See my quote at the bottom of my posts.....If the masses are a$$e$....democracy can be very dangerous.....

Sure Joe big..problems....but you have no pragmatic plan to inplement!! So quit making others responsible for what you can't even do....

I realize its tough..but stick with it...don't be a quitter...

The status quo ALPA politicians say these solutions aren't "pragmatic".....I don't see any real solutions from your side of the aisle.....Let's see here are some from your side of the aisle....

1. More participation: Well that only works if you are unified towards a common goal.....With regards to age60, scope, and merger/seniority issues, we are DEEPLY DIVIDED....more participation will simply result in an even bigger food fight.....

2. Wear your hat: If this is one of the big solutions from the Herndon elite.....we are even more doomed than I thought.....

3. Vote for Hillary or Obama: Regardless of the political implications for our country that many of us believe would make things even worse for our country and for our industry.....This simply divides us even more....Most of us aren't going to support these two, so when ALPA does....it turns even more off to ALPA.....

Any other great ideas to solve the division within ALPA......

 

[JoeMerchant]

SIZE generates revenue! So a 727 crew flying 20,000lbs of trash from CVG to MEM should make the same coin as an MD-11 crew coming from CDG with 100,000lbs of trash...naaa!

Those of you on the cargo side are really in a whole different industry.....On the PAX side, when times are tough those big airplanes flying empty are a bigger drag on the business.....Over here on the passenger side, most years are money losers....

That issue aside, your point is exactly why ALPA won't work under the current paradigm....You are looking at it from YOUR perspective.....nothing wrong with that, but it doesn't build a cohesive unit that is ready to take on a much more unified management team....

Your point is exactly why we have the divides in this union over age60, scope, and mergers....."Right" or "fair" are in the eyes of the beholder....

 

[BeCareful!]

WELL, Never mind....Turtle, thank you for posting that....


GREEN...shame on you for starting this thread based on a false post/email.

Moderator -

Thank you for intervening in the obvious miss use of FI.com as an extension of ALPA's misinformation campaign.

USAPA has no intention of stealing anything, seniority or otherwise, from any pilot. The integration is in dispute for good reason. All this talk of "integrity" and "abiding by the process" is just typical Internet spin. The whole process was tainted by ALPA's agenda as well as the East ALPA's incompetence. USAPA is going to clean up the mess, but West pilots will be just fine in all of this. No one is going to be stapled or forced out or downgraded. You'll all likely have 1200 former furloughed guys as furlough cushion. Is that not enough? So, enjoy the ride guys, and if you see a post that is blatantly fake, why not just keep it to yourself, rather than posting it here and destroying any credibility this site might still have?

BC

 

[SaturnPilot]

Boy doesn't this make ALPA look even worse now.....They are employing the same tactics that management uses.....Power corrupts.....

once again, if you think the quoted piece that started this thread was printed by ALPA, you need to have your head examined. This is obviously done by an individual, not the organization.

The whole process was tainted by ALPA's agenda as well as the East ALPA's incompetence.

please tell me what this "ALPA agenda" is that tainted the process? Oh, and I guess you mean "...as well as the incompetence of the east pilots who already govern themselves", rather than "East ALPA"

USAPA is going to clean up the mess, but West pilots will be just fine in all of this. No one is going to be stapled or forced out or downgraded.

yeah, the west is going to be fine...just their binding arbitration stalled and challenged endlessly in an attempt to change it while they are prevented from ANY chance whatsoever at getting any contract improvements...great deal!

 

[waveflyer]

I'm also curious why you'd think that ALPA national has an agenda favoring America West. ??

If ALPA is guilty of favoring UAL/DAL b/c of the revenue they bring in- as they are often accused -wouldn't it stand to reason that ALPA national if it were to pick sides would have chosen AAA as the larger carrier and one who paid more dues over more time?

Seems to me USAPA folks are upset b/c national chose NOT to pick sides using this reasoning... That you've had a perception that ALPA national has chosen sides in the past and that now should have been your turn to benefit as the "legacy" carrier.

 

[TWA Dude]

USAPA has no intention of stealing anything, seniority or otherwise, from any pilot.

What in the sam hill do you think DOH means? It means stapling 2/3 of the AWA group and making us your furlough-fodder. Nicolau didn't staple any East pilots employed when the merger closed.

The integration is in dispute for good reason.

The East not getting what it wanted isn't a good reason. Did you ever stop to think for a second about why Nicolau decided the way he did?

The whole process was tainted by ALPA's agenda ...

The buck stopped at Nicolau. His only agenda was a fair integration.

...as well as the East ALPA's incompetence.

So do you mean to tell me the East Merger Committee didn't do exactly what the constituency wanted? If your Merger Committee had veered one degree from seeking DOH they would have been replaced with pilots who would. This means the only fault lies not with East ALPA but with the East pilots. The proof: you didn't get DOH so now you want a new union that promises (surprise, surprise!) DOH. Well guess what, bubba, you didn't get DOH from Nicolau and you're not going to get it from USAPA either. The law is not on your side.

No one is going to be stapled or forced out or downgraded.

Thanks for nothing. Parker already stated this.

You'll all likely have 1200 former furloughed guys as furlough cushion. Is that not enough?

Really? So you're straying from the DOH mantra? Or do you just not understand what USAPA is promising?

 

[OB1]

Awappahoe= one who truly believes that seniority can be attained by "climbing over the backs of others"

do your own time - bass-terds

 

[waveflyer]

Really OB1- no dog in this fight- but the East is flat out wrong in this. You don't understand what seniority is. And the only thing i want all of you easties to think about is how you got your number at USAirways. Most of you got it flying Fokkers around in your twenties-- well now that Fokker is called an RJ and you have to fly it for sh!t!y mesa or skywest - where you have no seniority rights at all with the company that provides your passengers. The average new hire at Cactus is well into their 30's because of all the outsourcing- ie: not kids.
You want our generation to respect DOH- when you've committed the ultimate in seniority sins- FURLOUGH Pilots and then OUTSOURCE their jobs. If you had taken a stronger stance at that, you might have some credibility. But you didn't as a pilot group. If USAPA had done anything credible in support of the west pilots you might be closer to your objective- but you actually allowed West pilots with 4 years of longevity get furloughed 7-8 months before a new hire with 18 months on the east. So much for the sanctity of DOH. wtf?? I don't care who you are- you're objective is totally clear. Screw the west at any cost. And all it will do is create a bunch of wet dreams for AAA management as parker takes your bankruptcy contract to the bank.