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USAPA thinks it can control ALL jumpseats in US

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m80drvr

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 28, 2002
Posts
429
Here is a cut and paste from the TRO. You will notice that USAPA it trying to take away the captains authority for jumpseats FROM EVERY COMMERCIAL OPERATOR IN THE USA. See Item Number 3

That's right, USAPA thinks it can force UAL, SWA CAL, AAA...........captains to take then in the jumpseat.


This is absolutely mind blowing. After this gets out I'm sure it will be even worse for their commuters.

Quote:
WHEREFORE, Plaintiff prays that this Court grant its Motions for Temporary Restraining Order and Preliminary Injunction, and:
I. Issue a Declaratory Judgment that the actions complained of herein are unlawful, and;
II. Issue a Temporary Restraining Order, lasting in duration from the date of the Order until the earlier of either ten (10) days from the Order or until a hearing upon Plaintiff’s Motion for a Preliminary Injunction is held, that orders all Defendants, and any of their officers, agents, or employees, be prohibited from the acts listed in ¶ III below, and;
III. Issue a Preliminary Injunction, the same to be made permanent on final judgment, that orders all Defendants, and any of their officers, agents, or employees, be prohibited from the following acts:
1. From making, sending, or causing to be sent telephone calls to any of USAPA’s telephone numbers, including or any "Safety Hotline" telephone
- 2 -
number, that are frivolous in quality or quantity, or that are knowingly false, or that needlessly contain indecent and profane language, and that are either intended to, or have the effect of, imposing burden and cost on the resources of said telephone lines or on USAPA;

2. From making, sending, or causing to be sent e-mails or other electronic transmissions to any USAPA or USAPA officer’s e-mail addresses that are frivolous in quality or quantity, or that are knowingly false, or that needlessly contain indecent and profane language, and that are either intended to, or have the effect of, imposing burden and cost on the resources of said USAPA or its officers;

3. From denying, conspiring to deny, or instigating denial of, access to "jump seats" on aircraft operated by any commercial carrier because of suspected membership in, or support of, USAPA, or status as an "East pilot," or because of any pretextual excuse to hide such anti-USAPA animus, or animus against East pilots;

4. From conveying or communicating personal threats of retaliation against the safety of individual pilot-employees of US Airways, or engaging in telephonic or other unlawful harassment, in order to prevent, deter or intimidate them from paying membership dues to USAPA or from paying non-membership agency fees required by law;

5. From making, sending, or causing to be sent e-mails using altered e-mail addresses falsely attributed to be, or appear nearly identical to, e-mail addresses employed by USAPA officers;

6. From causing or arranging USAPA officer’s e-mail addresses to be subscribed to internet web or e-mail subscriptions, whether of an adult nature or not, without their knowledge and permission;

7. From sending, or causing to be sent, injurious articles or other nonmailable matter to USAPA or USAPA’s officers through the U.S. Postal Service, or deceptive use of the U.S. Mail in order to impose, or which has the effect of imposing, unnecessary costs on USAPA, or from other unlawful abuse of the U.S. Postal Service designed to sabotage USAPA’s operations.

8. From taking, or conspiring to take, concerted action designed to tortiously interfere with US Airways’ contractual obligations to USAPA under Section 29 of the Collective Bargaining Agreement, provided that no party shall be enjoined from filing an appropriate grievance under the contractual grievance procedures




Note to every flight crew in America. USAPA thinks they can run your airline into the ground also. They believe that YOUR jumpseat is THEIR god given right. They think they have the ability to tell YOU who can and cannot fly on your jumpseat. UNFRIGGING BELIEVABLE!!
__________________
 
Kinda ironic that they would take that approach since they were right in the fray with numerous other carriers to deny the CAL scabs the jumpseat in the past. :laugh:
 
Kinda ironic that they would take that approach since they were right in the fray with numerous other carriers to deny the CAL scabs the jumpseat in the past. :laugh:

CAL, welcome ANYTIME usappy NEVER!!!!:angryfire

WD.
 
Have many people been denying the Airways guys jumpseats. I thought it was just an in-house thing. It sounds like they are circling the drain fast. This industry is great isn't it.
 
***************
You need to ban this user. Constant name calling, using the term scab in almost every post.
***************

Com'on weasel don't hate, the shoe fits you soo well!! But do like the rest of your kind does and sue or cry to the mods but no matter what you or your ussapy friends attempt the smell will never wash off of you;)

WD.
 
Kinda ironic that they would take that approach since they were right in the fray with numerous other carriers to deny the CAL scabs the jumpseat in the past. :laugh:

Well said, over the years it's not like USAir guys never turned down a jumpseater because of who he flew for. What a flaming bunch of idiots.
 
I guess when you think about it, what would you expect from a group of pilots that think the whole world revolves around them.
 
Red Herring Alert!!!

:smash: Disinformation Warning!!!

Ya know, sounds to me like a west guy is bent out of shape about something, since the cut and paste neatly avoided the list of defendants!

Let me guess, the defendants are the people, property and corporation formerly known as America West?

They aren't trying to take control of everyone's jumpseats, children-they are trying to keep someone else (from out in the desert I would guess) from taking them away!

What a sham of a smokescreen! Saw right through it, cactus, I'm not Airways, but I've been around the patch a couple of times and you're really going to have to do alot better...you should be ashamed of yourself! In fact I would be given to wonder how you could survive a night out with the crew-perhaps you are a slamclicker!

If you take the time to read the thing and understand the egregious verbosity of the leagaleese you would understand that the injunction is against the following:

III. Issue a Preliminary Injunction, the same to be made permanent on final judgment, that orders all Defendants, and any of their officers, agents, or employees, be prohibited from the following acts:

Ah, there's that Defendant word...perhaps America West methinks.

3. From denying, conspiring to deny, or instigating denial of, access to "jump seats" on aircraft operated by any commercial carrierbecause of suspected membership in, or support of, USAPA, or status as an "East pilot," or because of any pretextual excuse to hide such anti-USAPA animus, or animus against East pilots;

Perhaps west pilots control the Jumpseat committee...

Perhaps west pilots are childlishly denying jumpseats to east pilots. Perhaps west pilots are making comments like the one I saw earlier "uscaba" and "those east guys shouldn't be getting a ride on aaa" while sitting in the cockpit of an aaa airplane.

What this is really saying is that "West pilots are not to interfear with East pilots jumpseat travel"

It's really not that hard to understand...unless you like the desert I guess.

Well, I tell you what. One of the two people that denyed me a jumpseat pre-911 was an America West pilot. I have never had a problem with any of the US Air crews. They've put my wife and I in First Class, done anything they could to accomodate me when I was jumpseating. Even some of the Airways gate agents have gone out of their way for me.

I've had a great time with the East guys and if you guys from out west have a problem, too bad. Any old US Air/Airways/Piedmont or whomever, you're welcome aboard as long as I have anything to say about it!
 
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Well I know that our O2 always seems to be just a bit too low everytime a USAPA scab asks for a ride. Cactus is always welcome.
 
Well I know that our O2 always seems to be just a bit too low everytime a USAPA scab asks for a ride. Cactus is always welcome.

You guys give rides on the U2? I had no idea!

Pretty sure thing since we will be above the WX an all.

What's the flight sched?

;)
 
You are all welcome on my jumpseat, I don't play the jumpseat game, its stupid. You don't like someone, FINE, but don't take it out on them by refusing a jumpseat. It works both ways, AirTran refuses a USAPA guy, USAPA guy refuses an AirTran guy that had nothing to do with the first event, and then you have a full on jumpseat war which helps no one and hurts everyone. The ironic part is, I am guessing its the guys that don't commute that start this $hit.

PS, I don't commute.
 
:smash: Disinformation Warning!!!

Ya know, sounds to me like a west guy is bent out of shape about something, since the cut and paste neatly avoided the list of defendants!

Let me guess, the defendants are the people, property and corporation formerly known as America West?

They aren't trying to take control of everyone's jumpseats, children-they are trying to keep someone else (from out in the desert I would guess) from taking them away!

What a sham of a smokescreen! Saw right through it, cactus, I'm not Airways, but I've been around the patch a couple of times and you're really going to have to do alot better...you should be ashamed of yourself! In fact I would be given to wonder how you could survive a night out with the crew-perhaps you are a slamclicker!

If you take the time to read the thing and understand the egregious verbosity of the leagaleese you would understand that the injunction is against the following:

III. Issue a Preliminary Injunction, the same to be made permanent on final judgment, that orders all Defendants, and any of their officers, agents, or employees, be prohibited from the following acts:

Ah, there's that Defendant word...perhaps America West methinks.

3. From denying, conspiring to deny, or instigating denial of, access to "jump seats" on aircraft operated by any commercial carrierbecause of suspected membership in, or support of, USAPA, or status as an "East pilot," or because of any pretextual excuse to hide such anti-USAPA animus, or animus against East pilots;

Perhaps west pilots control the Jumpseat committee...

Perhaps west pilots are childlishly denying jumpseats to east pilots. Perhaps west pilots are making comments like the one I saw earlier "uscaba" and "those east guys shouldn't be getting a ride on aaa" while sitting in the cockpit of an aaa airplane.

What this is really saying is that "West pilots are not to interfear with East pilots jumpseat travel"

It's really not that hard to understand...unless you like the desert I guess.

Well, I tell you what. One of the two people that denyed me a jumpseat pre-911 was an America West pilot. I have never had a problem with any of the US Air crews. They've put my wife and I in First Class, done anything they could to accomodate me when I was jumpseating. Even some of the Airways gate agents have gone out of their way for me.

I've had a great time with the East guys and if you guys from out west have a problem, too bad. Any old US Air/Airways/Piedmont or whomever, you're welcome aboard as long as I have anything to say about it!

I'm not sure, but I'm guessing ALPA is a defendant....so there ya go.
 
If I were still flying I probably wouldn't deny a jumpseat because you don't know who the good guys are and who the scumbags are. I do know a few SW, AK, and UA guys that deny to anyone East however.
 
The funny thing is that this so-called injunction would be completely unenforceable. All the captain of a flight would have to say is "Under the authority vested in me by the Federal Aviation Regulations, I am denying the jumpseat in the interest of the safety of flight." End of story. If an East guy complained that he was being discriminated against, all the captain would have to say is "prove it." Bottom line is, he's the PIC and the authority is his.

Having said that, I do NOT believe the jumpseat should ever be used as a political tool.
 
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:smash: Disinformation Warning!!!

Ya know, sounds to me like a west guy is bent out of shape about something, since the cut and paste neatly avoided the list of defendants!

Let me guess, the defendants are the people, property and corporation formerly known as America West?

They aren't trying to take control of everyone's jumpseats, children-they are trying to keep someone else (from out in the desert I would guess) from taking them away!

What a sham of a smokescreen! Saw right through it, cactus, I'm not Airways, but I've been around the patch a couple of times and you're really going to have to do alot better...you should be ashamed of yourself! In fact I would be given to wonder how you could survive a night out with the crew-perhaps you are a slamclicker!

If you take the time to read the thing and understand the egregious verbosity of the leagaleese you would understand that the injunction is against the following:

III. Issue a Preliminary Injunction, the same to be made permanent on final judgment, that orders all Defendants, and any of their officers, agents, or employees, be prohibited from the following acts:

Ah, there's that Defendant word...perhaps America West methinks.

3. From denying, conspiring to deny, or instigating denial of, access to "jump seats" on aircraft operated by any commercial carrierbecause of suspected membership in, or support of, USAPA, or status as an "East pilot," or because of any pretextual excuse to hide such anti-USAPA animus, or animus against East pilots;

Perhaps west pilots control the Jumpseat committee...

Perhaps west pilots are childlishly denying jumpseats to east pilots. Perhaps west pilots are making comments like the one I saw earlier "uscaba" and "those east guys shouldn't be getting a ride on aaa" while sitting in the cockpit of an aaa airplane.

What this is really saying is that "West pilots are not to interfear with East pilots jumpseat travel"

It's really not that hard to understand...unless you like the desert I guess.

Well, I tell you what. One of the two people that denyed me a jumpseat pre-911 was an America West pilot. I have never had a problem with any of the US Air crews. They've put my wife and I in First Class, done anything they could to accomodate me when I was jumpseating. Even some of the Airways gate agents have gone out of their way for me.

I've had a great time with the East guys and if you guys from out west have a problem, too bad. Any old US Air/Airways/Piedmont or whomever, you're welcome aboard as long as I have anything to say about it!

"Facts are stubborn things" -- John Adams
 
Com'on weasel don't hate, the shoe fits you soo well!! But do like the rest of your kind does and sue or cry to the mods but no matter what you or your ussapy friends attempt the smell will never wash off of you;)

WD.


Your posts are just hate filled garbadge. The kind of stuff you might see on a bathroom wall. Someone needs to clean it up, so I flag it for the mods.
 
Oh geezzzz.....Aunt Mabel beating up Uncle Harold again...a private family matter...that should be kept ...private.
 
This is so damn childish.

The whole time I was reading that legal brief I couldn't help but envision the little boy on the playground that is getting his butt kicked and goes crying to the teacher.

It's called LIFE. Sometime you're the windshield sometimes you're the bug.

What a total waste of the limited resources ASAPA has. Has anyone here ever heard the term what you resists persists? The more USAPA tries to play this game, the more fuel they add to the fire.

I totally understand the East pilots' concerns. Niclau doesn't seem fair, but these types of motions don't do a thing to bolster any support for you on a national level.

East pilots are more than welcome at NWA. I agree wholeheartedly that using the jumpseat for political reasons is totally out of line and unbecoming of an airline pilot. Anyone that denies a jumpseat for anything other than safety is a doorknob and needs to get a life.
 
The funny thing is that this so-called injunction would be completely unenforceable.

I agree Morgoth. What worries me is that if this goes far enough the politicians (FAA, Congress) might throw up there hands and declare jumpseats are only for FAA inspections, AND THAT'S IT!
 
Yes thay are good to go, as are Skywest pilot (voted ALPA down) AA pilots (Dumped ALPA) and all USAir pilots on each coast. The jumpseat is not a political forum.

How conveniently unrelated. Apples....Meet Oranges!

USAPA pilots will ALWAYS be banned from my cockpit.

Period. The end. That's it. Scabford and his nerdy band of pseudo tough guys; along with his walking STD of an attorney can try and sue me.

It's not a political statement, It's not safe.
 
I agree Morgoth. What worries me is that if this goes far enough the politicians (FAA, Congress) might throw up there hands and declare jumpseats are only for FAA inspections, AND THAT'S IT!
Nope. The only way the FAA or Congress would get involved is if there was a series of violations, crashes, or safety issues. Some pilots whining about not being able to use the jumpseat wont endanger the jumpseat privilige.

If you complain to the FAA they will say it's the captain's authority and he can deny access for any reason. If he denies the jumpseat because he doesn't like your haircut...well tough crap.
 
How conveniently unrelated. Apples....Meet Oranges!

USAPA pilots will ALWAYS be banned from my cockpit.

Period. The end. That's it. Scabford and his nerdy band of pseudo tough guys; along with his walking STD of an attorney can try and sue me.

It's not a political statement, It's not safe.

You must rule that cockpit with a real chip on your shoulder. Maybe you should take some time off to cool down a little bit. Seriously.

Let the poor commuter take a seat in the back at least. Like someone said earlier...you don't have to like the guy/gal. Just give them the ride they need to get home to their family. If the shoe were on the other foot you would want the same level of respect.
 
Yup that's the rule, and I'm sure USAPA agrees with that rule too. You see the nice cut and paste from the law suit hides the bigger picture here. You see, the lawsuit is/was basically a shot across the bow to the west guys who banded together and decided to attempt to derail/run up costs/block phone lines (including false calls to a safety line)/attempt to screw up mail system, and postings that came around calling for friends and other carriers to deny the j/s to east pilots, for the whole reason that they are east pilots. I.E. interfere with someone trying to commute.

Now I know you west guys could careless about a east guy trying to commute, but I guess OUR union does. Now if you read the whole lawsuit, it basically says, We want the West guys to stop with the childish games, and sending feces through the mail, calling an update number 2500 times in a 2 week period (or some crap like that, believe it was the previous MEC chairman for America West doing that????)
In no way do I read that lawsuit, and see it saying, prevent any captain at any carrier from denying the jumpseat, but more like saying, keep the west guys from starting a political jumpseat war.
 
Oh, posted on another board, in case some would like some info on the lawsuit.

Fellow pilots,

The following is an update with regard to USAPA's current legal action.

AWAPPA and its directors have submitted a Motion to Dismiss that will be considered by the federal court this Friday in the context of USAPA's injunction request.

Significantly, AWAPPA's motion actually assumes the truth of USAPA's allegations. In other words, AWAPPA takes the position that the lawsuit should be dismissed even if it is true that AWAPPA and others unlawfully conspired to send excrement through the mail, engage in threats of physical violence, and engage in criminal telephonic and electronic sabotage.

The gist of AWAPPA's motion is that, due to alleged technical defects relating to USAPA's federal cause of action, that cause of action should be dismissed. And, if the federal cause of action is dismissed, then the multiple state law causes of action should be dismissed based on the federal court's lack of jurisdiction over state law claims..

AWAPPA's motion, therefore, is nothing more than a technicality-based delay tactic. In the event the motion is successful, USAPA will simply re-file the action in North Carolina state court. In our view, nothing will have been accomplished for the defendants other than the generation of additional attorneys' fees. The defendants' "success" will merely result in the allegations of criminal and otherwise unlawful misconduct being evaluated by a North Carolina state court jury.

In the meantime, certain individual defendants have inquired with USAPA concerning the possibility of settlement. Due to the fact that the litigation is in its early stages, USAPA has responded -- depending on the conduct of the particular defendant -- with either low-cost or no-cost offers of settlement contingent on the individual's commitment to refrain from future unlawful conduct.

We are aware that certain of the defendants are soliciting money from their fellow pilots to finance their defense against the allegations of criminal and otherwise unlawful conduct. In our view, the better economic and moral decision would be to admit their wrong-doing and make a commitment to refrain from future criminal and unlawful activity. As the litigation progresses, however, USAPA will become more reluctant to agree to a low-cost or no-cost settlement.

USAPA is aware that certain individuals have represented that the lawsuit seeks the compromise the defendants' position regarding seniority integration. That is untrue. The current litigation does not seek to diminish the ability of any pilot to assert his or her position on seniority integration and/or to take legal action in defense of that position. The focus of this litigation is the unacceptability of criminal and otherwise unlawful tactics.




--------------------

USAPA, the union for USAirways Pilots
 
How conveniently unrelated. Apples....Meet Oranges!

USAPA pilots will ALWAYS be banned from my cockpit.

Period. The end. That's it. Scabford and his nerdy band of pseudo tough guys; along with his walking STD of an attorney can try and sue me.

It's not a political statement, It's not safe.

I'd even let you with all your ranting and raving ride. I guess you don't have enough self control to keep it safe.
 
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