USAPA Runoff election

[BeCareful!]

Be Careful-

So you think that the east pilots should not be held responsible for their votes on USAPA, their votes for leadership(?), and their behavior towards west pilots (requiring separate crew vans)? Should we ignore USAPA's advice to "Watch what they do, not what they say" when it actually applies to USAPA?

The comments about east pilots may be unnecessary and counter-productive, but they aren't un-earned.

Bird,

I'm not sure what you are referring to here. Something I said? In any case, I see that you are now claiming some unprofessional conduct or behavior that requires separate vans. Not aware of this, but I have seen a photo of a mural in a west airbus that was for the benefit of our passengers while they were boarding. I've seen aggressive and just utterly stupid moves by west pilots in CLT. And...the funniest!....was one of your guys having a loud conversation with the guy who tries to get passengers to sign up for the credit card in the terminal. OMG it was hilarious listening to this fine aviator attempting to educate the credit card guy about union this and arbitration that. What an absolute tool.

Anyway dude, I don't have time for this crap today. Take care.

 

[PHXFLYR]

A non member is a non member, how can they be subject to the C&BLs of an Association they are not members of? Contract maintenance fees, sure, representational costs sure, but assessments due to a failure to properly represent them? That's a stretch.

That's what I thought , too and is why I posted " I'm not sure'" at the end of my post. But then again this is USAPA we're talking about where anything is possible...

PHXFLYR

A Proud Non-Member

 

[PHXFLYR]

USAPA doesn't represent the "east" or "west". It represents the pilots of US Airways.

That's funny.........

PHXFLYR

A Proud Non-Member

 

[PHXFLYR]

No, that's only your view of the problem. I think your use of the word "pathetic" is the problem. That pilot, whoever he is, doesn't deserve to be referred to that way. Nor does the guy one number senior to him who didn't get furloughed. Their both human beings who fly aircraft for an airline. Neither one did anything "wrong" and your characterization of this guy as pathetic says a lot about you and your group.

I can't wait till the next merge when masses of you change your tune and start screaming DOH.

..and lower ourselves to your level ??? YGTBSM.

PHXFLYR

 

[PHXFLYR]

Oh...big letters.....must be true, and important. Your take on this is laughable. USAPA is in fact conducting day-to-day business in much the same way any union does. (Witness the recent screw up in the west schedules and the resulting action.) You can take them just as non-seriously as you wish, but it doesn't make your allegations true, nor does it change anything. Yeah, it's a new organization and a work in progress. So-the-f&%#-what? You boys are so g'damn critical of everything USAPA does, totally ignore the hard work that's been done and continues (yes, even on your hateful behalf) and yet you're telling me to open my eyes? Whatever, we all know why you behave like that; if I had an un-cashed winning lottery ticket, I'd be squirrly too.

Corruption? Collusion? With the pension investigation gaining momentum, we'll soon see who's corrupt, and my strong suspicion is that ALPA has a lot of dirt on its hands in this one.

But whatever, you probably know best since you're west and all. That's how it goes here on FI.com

Hellloooo.......Hate to break it to you but the PBS Chairman is a West Pilot who joined USAPA under much duress so as to oversee the proper running and management of the PBS system by the company. The reason he chose to is because no one at USAPA took the time to fully understand the pros and cons of PBS or how it worked, nor did they make any attempt to learn , and as a result he was afraid USAPA was going to let things slide as far as west scheduling isues were concerned. He filled the same position while ALPA was on the propertyfor us on the west side prior to the merger. Sure,your boy joined him when they went to PHX the other week to sort out the west scheduling mess ,but from what we've been told, he kind of sat there like a puppy watching TV ( ie. He knew he was looking at something but couldn't figure out exactly what it was ) and as a result didn't have much to say. So once again, it was more a west pilot who joined USAP under duress looking out for west pilot's interests who corrected the problem, and not the moral victory you USAPA -types are trying to make it out to be.

PHXFLYR

A Proud Non-Member

PS. By the way, nice language....

 

[BeCareful!]

..and lower ourselves to your level ??? YGTBSM.

PHXFLYR

Lower yourselves? This coming from a group that has actual strikebreakers? No, PHX, YGBSM!

 

[cactusboy53]

Oh by the way, DOH MEANS NOTHING!-Screams the PFT crowd of the 90's. Its all about Me, Me, Me and how a Westhole can leapfrog 20 years of service. A probation pilot being senior to someone who has 17 years of service will not fly. Sorry PFTrainers.

When the Nic list came out, it was not even close to relative seniority. 1/3 of the pilot list was not included. Active USAIR pilots were listed as furloughed.

M

Marty;
The list is the list. If we could do it all over again, I would rally to make Captain Randy McNerlin #1....oh well....final is final and binding is binding.

BTW,
You must have missed my question directed to you earlier in this thread:

Okay Marty. Are you or are you not a pilot for US Airways? If not, are you married to a pilot or related to a pilot for US Airways?

Well?? You have been quoted several times that you do not work for LCC. If so, why would you care??

 

[reepicheep]

Lay off Marty.....his comments are at least entertaining and God knows there's no job or interview info right now to read about on FI.

 

[PHXFLYR]

Lower yourselves? This coming from a group that has actual strikebreakers? No, PHX, YGBSM!

Maybe so, but the last 2 left on the property are senior to you on the NIC list......

PHXFLYR

 

[BeCareful!]

Maybe so, but the last 2 left on the property are senior to you on the NIC list......

PHXFLYR

Wow, so you're a proud non-member, and apparently proud of your strikebreakers, too. Jeeze I hope those rumors about Doug selling the west to CAL are true!

 

[PHXFLYR]

Nope, not proud of the strikebreakers at all. Just a proud non-member of USAPA. By the way, I meant to ask you a question a while back but I forgot. Are you an east flight attendant or an east pilot ? The way you take all these rumors to heart that you keep posting on this board makes me think that your the former of the two and not a pilot at all....Could that be ?


PHXFLYR

A Proud Non-Member

 

[BeCareful!]

Ha...you caught me. I used to be a pilot but went FA instead. After the operation it just made sense. What rumors are you refering to?

 

[PCL_128]

Who do you think is smarter: Judge Wake or counselor Seham?

That's like asking "who do you think is smarter: Judge Wake or a rock?"

Actually, I take that back. That's offensive to the rock.

 

[eaglesview]

Man this crap is getting old. The nic is as ridiculous as was the USAir's atttempt at negotiating. Neither side has one you both lost. I hope cooler heads than are hear at FI prevail.

 

[cactusboy53]

Man this crap is getting old. The nic is as ridiculous as was the USAir's attempt at negotiating. Neither side has one you both lost. I hope cooler heads than are hear at FI prevail.

Eagle;
Of what attempt at negotiating do you speak? Surely not negotiating the merged seniority list? I believe the East "negotiating" tactic was DATE OF HIRE. Cooler heads did prevail when the West tactic was not to STAPLE, but to seek some sort of relative seniority.

Is your opinion of the Nicolau award the result of having read the transcripts to see what was argued, and how Mr. Nicolau and the two neutrals came to their decision? My bet is NO.

You are right, this crap is getting really OLD. We will not quit, we will not go away, and we will not go silently into the night. We will continue any and all legal avenues available to us to complete the merged seniority list that was delivered by Mr. Nicolau.

 

[TWA Dude]

The nic is as ridiculous as was the USAir's atttempt at negotiating.

What's "ridiculous" about Nicolau's decision? Why is it wrong to say the bottom active pilots of two airlines are equivolent in seniority? Don't forget, years of service is called longevity. Seniorty is based on how many pilots are junior to you.

Neither side has one you both lost.

That was true until the Easties tried to tip things in their favor. We're trying to stop that underhanded attempt.

I hope cooler heads than are hear at FI prevail.

Judge Wake seems to have a pretty cool head. I say let him decide.

 

[eaglesview]

What's "ridiculous" about Nicolau's decision? Why is it wrong to say the bottom active pilots of two airlines are equivolent in seniority? Don't forget, years of service is called longevity. Seniorty is based on how many pilots are junior to you.That was true until the Easties tried to tip things in their favor. We're trying to stop that underhanded attempt.Judge Wake seems to have a pretty cool head. I say let him decide.

Like I said getting really old. Both sides have their point of view and are not listening to the other side. In the end your both $crewing yorselves.

 

[TWA Dude]

In the end your both $crewing yorselves.

I'm sorry, but did you forget which side withdrew from joint contract negotiations in 2007 to begin this war? The West did not start this. Is it your contention that the we should just give in? I don't think you would do that yourself in the same situation so it's rather disingenuous for you to lecture us.

 

[AutoBus]

Eagle;
Of what attempt at negotiating do you speak? Surely not negotiating the merged seniority list? I believe the East "negotiating" tactic was DATE OF HIRE. Cooler heads did prevail when the West tactic was not to STAPLE, but to seek some sort of relative seniority.

Is your opinion of the Nicolau award the result of having read the transcripts to see what was argued, and how Mr. Nicolau and the two neutrals came to their decision? My bet is NO.

You are right, this crap is getting really OLD. We will not quit, we will not go away, and we will not go silently into the night. We will continue any and all legal avenues available to us to complete the merged seniority list that was delivered by Mr. Nicolau.

Thank you!

 

[AutoBus]

Like I said getting really old. Both sides have their point of view and are not listening to the other side. In the end your both $crewing yorselves.

OK dude what would you do? Let me guess, let a third party dicide? Well we did that already and guess what? the EAST DID NOT LIKE WHAT THEY SAID, their poor little egos were hurt! So now what?

After all they all had expectations of being wide body captains, well maybe in the late 90's under gangball, certainly not in April of 2005 under lakewood when they were weeks from doing a EAL, PanAm or Braniff.

Any Doubts? when a certain CEO was asked why we did not get a PREP-NUP like DAL-NWA in a SEMI PUBLIC CREW NEWS VIDEO, He emphatically said "we didn't have time! US AIRWAYS WAS JUST WEEKS FROM GOING AWAY!"

Well Sir, You don't get a prize for being weeks from going away!

Conspiracy Theirists proceed!

 

[eaglesview]

OK dude what would you do? Let me guess, let a third party dicide? Well we did that already and guess what? the EAST DID NOT LIKE WHAT THEY SAID, their poor little egos were hurt! So now what?

After all they all had expectations of being wide body captains, well maybe in the late 90's under gangball, certainly not in April of 2005 under lakewood when they were weeks from doing a EAL, PanAm or Braniff.

Any Doubts? when a certain CEO was asked why we did not get a PREP-NUP like DAL-NWA in a SEMI PUBLIC CREW NEWS VIDEO, He emphatically said "we didn't have time! US AIRWAYS WAS JUST WEEKS FROM GOING AWAY!"

Well Sir, You don't get a prize for being weeks from going away!

Conspiracy Theirists proceed!

Yeah ok, Weeks from going away. Aint buying that. Airlines hang around for years when they are "weeks from going away." How many years was TWA going out of business next week. My statemant stands, your both $crewing yourselves.

 

[PHXFLYR]

If so,what concern is it of yours ? I believe on some other post you made mention of the fact that youre a United pilot. If that's the case, I think you would be more concerned about your own problems over there rather than what's going on between the east and west pilots of USAir; don'tcha think ??? I know I would be. Unless of course you have the poor misfortune of being married to and/ or dating a USAir goon.....

PHXFLYR

A Proud non-member

 

[TWA Dude]

Notice how not one Eastie or East-sympathiser/apologist has chimed in to say he believes USAPA will win the DFR trial on its legal merits? For those who are unfamiliar the trial beginning April 28 is exclusively on the issue of DFR. Is there anybody who actually believes a union can legally alter an established seniority list to advantage one pilot group over another? Stay tuned to what the jury decides in early May.

 

[PHXFLYR]

Yeah ok, Weeks from going away. Aint buying that. Airlines hang around for years when they are "weeks from going away." How many years was TWA going out of business next week. My statemant stands, your both $crewing yourselves.

...and the only reason why they hung around for as long as they did,especially in the case of TWA and Pan Am is because they had a multitude of non-core assets that they were able to sell. International routes,unused route authority,hotel chains,flight catering kitchens , meterological services, hell, in the case of Pan Am, a space services Company that did NASA contract work during the Gemini and Apollo moon shots. In other words, they were burning the furniture to keep the house warm. And guess what? Once there was no more furniture left to burn (ie. no more assets to sell ) those companies were gone. Now compare those lingering deaths to Braniff 2 , Midway 1 and 2, Air Florida, People Express , Vanguard and a host of other carriers with no assets to sell when they started losing coin, and you can very well see that those Bankruptcy filings and eventual liquadations were much more immediate than the Pan Am and TWA scenarios you indirectly refer to. I'm hoping I'm wrong about this, but I truly believe that the current financial condition of USAirways places us squarely in the latter of the 2 airline groupings in that if we file Chapter 11 ,liquidation won't be very far behind.




PHXFLYR

A Proud non-member

 

[BeCareful!]

Notice how not one Eastie or East-sympathiser/apologist has chimed in to say he believes USAPA will win the DFR trial on its legal merits? For those who are unfamiliar the trial beginning April 28 is exclusively on the issue of DFR. Is there anybody who actually believes a union can legally alter an established seniority list to advantage one pilot group over another? Stay tuned to what the jury decides in early May.

Yeah, I noticed that.

Probably has more to do with a guy's view of the importance of Internet ramblings than with whether or not he feels one side or the other will win round one.

Established list? Not without a single contract.
Advantage to one group? From what starting point? The as yet unused list? Good thing the court of law isn't conducted on an anonymous web board, where there's no accountability for the use of inflammatory and bogus terms that serve only to skew opinion (and to appease the writers sense of righteous self-importance).

 

[Colonel Savage]

...and the only reason why they hung around for as long as they did,especially in the case of TWA and Pan Am is because they had a multitude of non-core assets that they were able to sell. International routes,unused route authority,hotel chains,flight catering kitchens , meterological services, hell, in the case of Pan Am, a space services Company that did NASA contract work during the Gemini and Apollo moon shots. In other words, they were burning the furniture to keep the house warm. And guess what? Once there was no more furniture left to burn (ie. no more assets to sell ) those companies were gone. Now compare those lingering deaths to Braniff 2 , Midway 1 and 2, Air Florida, People Express , Vanguard and a host of other carriers with no assets to sell when they started losing coin, and you can very well see that those Bankruptcy filings and eventual liquadations were much more immediate than the Pan Am and TWA scenarios you indirectly refer to. I'm hoping I'm wrong about this, but I truly believe that the current financial condition of USAirways places us squarely in the latter of the 2 airline groupings in that if we file Chapter 11 ,liquidation won't be very far behind.




PHXFLYR

A Proud non-member

Is there talk about a Chap 11?

 

[captfred]

No talk of Chapter 11. "Scooter" Kirby recently said he expects us to make a profit for the year 2009.

 

[Colonel Savage]

No talk of Chapter 11. "Scooter" Kirby recently said he expects us to make a profit for the year 2009.

I heard he had said that, that's why I checked. Who'd you fly the Whale for?

 

[PHXFLYR]

deleted -duplicate

PHXFLYR

A Proud non-member

 

[Colonel Savage]

Who do you think he flew the Whale for ?

PHXFLYR

A Proud non-member

Ah ha, AWA...Been so long I forgot.