USAPA Runoff election

[Metrojet]

Its true becket. Did you consider yourself a USAIR pilot when you flew for MetroJet under a different contract.? Can West pilots bid East positions now?

M

Not sure what you mean by that statement - Pilots on the Metrojet operation flew under the mainline contract via a side letter -

 

[AutoBus]

I hope that's true. If so, USAPA will be dead and buried in 12 months.

I hear the USAPA decert process has already been started, believe it or not by EAST pilots! Go figure that one out.

 

[Tejas-Jet]

Has Judge Wake already ruled on this lawsuit?

Some of the comments here would lead one to believe that has already happened.

 

[MCDU]

Not sure what you mean by that statement - Pilots on the Metrojet operation flew under the mainline contract via a side letter -

Yes, the side letter meant that the contracts were different. Different pay, different work rules etc for same equipment etc..

M

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Isn't democracy great.... you get to elect your own representatives.... the problem is... you get to elect your own representatives....

 

[abefly]

Yes, the side letter meant that the contracts were different. Different pay, different work rules etc for same equipment etc..

M

Just out of curiosity lets say that judge wake does rule in favor of the west and let's say he orders immediate implementation of the Nic Award. What then MCDU? What will you do then. Have you thought about that possibility? Just curious

 

[BeCareful!]

DOH MEANS NOTHING

Well now, there's an intelligent comment. DOH means nothing. So, AutoBus, you're telling us that you don't want your DOH considered in any merger scenario, ever again......ever? Means nothing? Really?

That's as stupid a statement as anything ever said here on Flight Misinfo dot Com. Trust there's a merger scenario that would have you changing your story quicker than an out of work westie can hop on a flight to Australia. You're a g'damn liar.

 

[AutoBus]

Well now, there's an intelligent comment. DOH means nothing. So, AutoBus, you're telling us that you don't want your DOH considered in any merger scenario, ever again......ever? Means nothing? Really?

That's as stupid a statement as anything ever said here on Flight Misinfo dot Com. Trust there's a merger scenario that would have you changing your story quicker than an out of work westie can hop on a flight to Australia. You're a g'damn liar.

I'll say it again DOH means nothing!

It's your relative standing that matters in a merger, sorry to dissapoint you, Look at the NIC, Look at DAL/NWA, Look at ALPA Merger policy. Are you blind man?



The only people clinging to this tired DOH line are the angry FO's from the east and their little purpose built sham union. Even the East Captains are getting a little impatient with the angry FO club.

 

[cactusboy53]

Still hoping to cash in on that windfall that placed 650 active East pilots below your bottom pilot plus all the East Newhires in 2007. Thats 900 pilots below Odell. Thats what happened when the list came out. Your relative seniority bumped you 35% up the list when the Nic list was posted back in May 2007.
The Nic will never be implemented. Trust me.

M

Okay Marty. Are you or are you not a pilot for US Airways? If not, are you married to a pilot or related to a pilot for US Airways?

To answer your question about my "windfall", well yes....I plan on making the move out to Philly or CLT depending on which move is best for my commute & quality of life.

The bottom line is that it is a utter shame that the west pilots had to take our "union" to court for DFR. This should have been over with a new contract better than a year ago. Regardless of the outcome of the trial, the only real winner is LCC and Doug Parker. If the west prevails, the east will have fruitlessly waved goodbye to legal fees, wages, time off and benefits that will NEVER be recovered.

Simply pitiful.

 

[BeCareful!]

Oh, I thought none of the west pilots wanted to come east....that was their story for so long. Now, you're coming. OK. Wow, great.

How many contracts have any of you guys seen negotiated? Because it cracks me up how you all think if not for our E vs W fight, then there would surely be a contract in place. Do any of you pay attention to how long other airlines, even those represented by the mighty and beloved ALPA, go past their amendable dates before getting a contract? My guess is that you do, but it's just so convenient to act like the fight over your potential windfall is the only reason we don't have one. Did it ever occur to you that Parker and the boys have no intention of negotiating in good faith until the NMB forces them to? Why should we expect that they would behave any differently than any other airline? Our fight has nothing to do with it; they are using it as an excuse, because it suits them, and it causes even more hatred between the groups, but you're dilusional if you think that a contract would be in place without all this fighting.

 

[AutoBus]

Oh, I thought none of the west pilots wanted to come east....that was their story for so long. Now, you're coming. OK. Wow, great.

How many contracts have any of you guys seen negotiated? .

Oh Yeah, LOA 93 is wonderfull example of a great contract.

 

[Scope out RJ's]

Yes, the side letter meant that the contracts were different. Different pay, different work rules etc for same equipment etc..

M

Mcdoosh:
you're off your meds again.
What happened? That last outing too much for you and your LCC boyfriend?:blush: :laugh:
Come mcdoosh. Get back to that 152 and flight instructing. Stop pretending to be a Us Airways pilot. I know your man tells you how great it is.

 

[AutoBus]

The East refuses to accept the responsibility for anything that they’ve done. Like they did with USAPA.

They decided to play God, create USAPA. When USAPA turned against Them, They comforted themselves in the knowledge that it really wasn’t their fault, not really.

You cannot play God then wash your hands of the things that you’ve created. Sooner or later, the day comes when you can’t hide from the things that you’ve done anymore

 

[Crzipilot]

Strange, Haven't met one capt. on the east side that's sorry that alpa is gone. Oh your on the west, I'm sure you have the inside scoop of what's really going on...sorry

 

[cactusboy53]

Oh, I thought none of the west pilots wanted to come east....that was their story for so long. Now, you're coming. OK. Wow, great.

BC;
I you will look back 1.5 years or so, we all had this discussion. There are about 150 to 200 west pilots that live on the east coast OR can commute to the east coast with as much ease as we can to PHX or LAS. By the same token, there are many east pilots (100 or better?) that live closer to the PHX and LAS bases and would avail themselves of the shorter commute.

How many contracts have any of you guys seen negotiated? Because it cracks me up how you all think if not for our E vs W fight, then there would surely be a contract in place. Do any of you pay attention to how long other airlines, even those represented by the mighty and beloved ALPA, go past their amendable dates before getting a contract? My guess is that you do, but it's just so convenient to act like the fight over your potential windfall is the only reason we don't have one. Did it ever occur to you that Parker and the boys have no intention of negotiating in good faith until the NMB forces them to? Why should we expect that they would behave any differently than any other airline? Our fight has nothing to do with it; they are using it as an excuse, because it suits them, and it causes even more hatred between the groups, but you're delusional if you think that a contract would be in place without all this fighting.

Well brother, we had one contract proposal that was offered by Scott Kirby (and that was his offer, and that was when times were "good"). It was essentially the AWA contract with a couple of scheduling improvements and about 3% $$ for the west crew. If we would had said yes and put it to a vote, it would have been DONE. I believe that would translate to an increase of $40 to $60 K in wages and time off for the east (minimum). Had the East MEC remained at the negotiation table, there is no telling how much more we may have negotiated in that contract offer.

I am trying very hard to not pin my hopes on what Judge Wake and the jury plan on should the AWA group win this lawsuit.

I know that many east pilots have stated that they will NEVER vote in a contract that includes the Nicolau. What if the AWA pilots win and the Judge take that wind out of your sails? The list and direction that the courts can do for remedy is far and varied.

I'm on reserve in April and plan on attending some of the sessions. We will all see where this will take us. In my previous post I just mentioned that it was a shame and had all parties abided by the agreements, we would not have gone down this road. By these actions "we" have easily eclipsed the Northwest / Republic acrimonious merger.

 

[johnnyb]

Just out of curiosity lets say that judge wake does rule in favor of the west and let's say he orders immediate implementation of the Nic Award. What then MCDU?

Then LOA 93 will be the surviving contract and you will have sued yourselves into concessions.

 

[TWA Dude]

By what legal mechanism?

 

[Carl S.]

Does any East pilot take any blame for LOA 93, Nic. Award or the Usapa Clown Show or is it everyone but the East's fault(Prater,Nic. or Parker and Co.)that they find themselves painted into a corner. The East has to be at fault for at least some of the mess they live in today! I love the constant blame of an outside force that has created their environment, never one percent of responsibility for their dilemma from within. If(and nothing is a lock in Federal Court) Wake rules against USAPA in May, who is to blame then,let me guess, anyone but USAPA right?

 

[johnnyb]

By what legal mechanism?

You really need to pay attention.

 

[TWA Dude]

Thank you for that detailed explanation. I assure you I pay very close attention to the details. This isn't my first merger, don'tcha know. So far, USAPA has not been following the law which is why there's a trial in April. So based on your response I can conclude there's no legal mechanism by which LOA93 can or shall be imposed on the West, Hemenway letter or not.