Usapa lost!!!!!!!!!

[tie1on]

man up and let it go.. you are dragging the whole industry down

 

[Metrojet]

I feel the same way, and it's why many on the west consider it only a symbolic victory at this time. I wouldn't doubt that this very scenario has played through Judge Wake's mind many times. I hope that when he rules on remedies, he figures out a way to break the impasse you refer to.

How about this: The Judge knows that he can't impose a CBA on both parties, but he can and should make it expensive for the east to stonewall a single CBA. He could craft a solution where west F/Os will receive Capt pay when the first east pilot junior to them on the Nic upgrades. The difference in pay, of course, will not be paid by the company, but by USAPA through assessments.

No, come to think of it, I don't want west pilots who've joined USAPA to get the bill, and I don't think we could trust the rat bastards to pay the assessment anyway. Let's put the $70 million LOA 93 "snapback" into an escrow fund to pay for the above remedy. Git 'R Done!

OK -

Now I have to draw the line (because I know your joking) - $70 million LOA 93 "snapback" into an escrow account???????????

Why don't we just payroll deduct the profit sharing (from west pilots) that ALL pilots got the year before which was part of LOA 93 and negotiated by the east to pay for your hypothetical remedy? (Now I am joking).

Metrojet

 

[PHXFLYR]

I can't believe the dipstick easties that think the appeals court will let them show more of their bull******************** data. I think they've gotten brain damage from beating their heads againts the wall so many times.

No they don't. Gotta have a brain first before any of that could occur ...

PHXFLYR

Proud non-member

 

[BeCareful!]

[/I][/B]

Originally Posted by vetrider
I can't believe the dipstick easties that think the appeals court will let them show more of their bull******************** data. I think they've gotten brain damage from beating their heads againts the wall so many times.



No they don't. Gotta have a brain first before any of that could occur ...

PHXFLYR

Proud non-member

Gosh, I think you guys missed your callings. I thinkin' Tonight Show writers, maybe Late Night with DL.

I mean really....Family Guy's got nothing on you two and your shtick. Must be non-stop giggles at the dinner table. Impressive stuff.

 

[vetrider]

Gosh, I think you guys missed your callings. I thinkin' Tonight Show writers, maybe Late Night with DL.

I mean really....Family Guy's got nothing on you two and your shtick. Must be non-stop giggles at the dinner table. Impressive stuff.

I meant it literally.

 

[AutoBus]

It is obvious that the Nic award was a huge windfall for the AW pilots. Why else would SO much time, money, and energy be spent on implementing it intact. The west knows whats in the tea leaves. US Airways will retreat back east, as it has done in the past. Only base closures, mass furloughs, and displacements will be left in its wake.
The west guys know the Nic award is the ONLY life boat on the deck, and they're not about to let it go.

Windfall for the West? Sorry Dude the NIC is No windfall for the West!

The average West pilot lost relative standing (2 to 3%).

The West IS relieved that the EAST DID NOT get DOH and therefore allow the East to screww the west and get themselves a windfall.

The West is relieved they did not get screwed by the NIC

The East is angry that the NIC DID NOT screw the West to the East's benefit.

The East really wanted to screw the West.

The Judge and Jury spoke and said NO!

NOW the East is angry that ALPA, NIC, The Jury, would not let them SCREW the WEST.


The West simply want's to hold on to what it had,

The East want's to recapture what they lost premerger (since 1990) at the expense of the West. That's the ONLY REASON they are pushing DOH.
It ain't going to happen!

 

[PHXFLYR]

I meant it literally.

Yeah..., me too.

PHXFLYR

Proud non-member

 

[FR8mastr]

The West simply want's to hold on to what it had,

That is such BS, and I can prove it.

So you only want what you had huh?
OK how about a fence 10, 20 years high in which time an East pilot can NEVER bid to a West position? At the same time West can bid East using DOH unrestricted.

Sit back and watch the back peddling.

 

[Cowboy75]

So you only want what you had huh?

My life was just fine prior to Parker aquiring us air. You brought nothing to the table except furloughs.

Thanks for asking.

 

[AutoBus]

That is such BS, and I can prove it.

So you only want what you had huh?
OK how about a fence 10, 20 years high in which time an East pilot can NEVER bid to a West position? At the same time West can bid East using DOH unrestricted.

Sit back and watch the back peddling.

Fences don't work, they assume a static industry, things change.


What is so hard for you to understand? If you were in the 50% seniority range before the merger you should be about 50% after the merger.


A mid senority East guy before the merger should be a mid seniorty guy after the merger.

A upper senoirty West guy before the merger should be a upper seniorty guy after the merger.

A Lower senority East guy before the merger should be a Lower seniorty guy after the merger.


But nooooo!!, somehow this Lower senioirty East guy thinks he's entitled to be a mid seniorty guy after the merger. This is where the problem lies, always has.


Let me guess? you are a lower seniority East guy looking for a windfall?

 

[vetrider]

Fences don't work, they assume a static industry, things change.



Let me guess? you are a lower seniority East guy looking for a windfall?

Naw, he's in the top 100 just standing up for what's right.

 

[TWA Dude]

OK how about a fence 10, 20 years high in which time an East pilot can NEVER bid to a West position?

Are you still trying to argue seniority integration? Dude, that's so 2007. If you wanted fences you should've had your merger committee argue for it. Oops, you say that happened already and you agreed to binding arbitration? Well, then it's over. The Nicolau list is the new reality and that's all the West wants and yes, we're entitled to it.

 

[michael707767]

Are you still trying to argue seniority integration? Dude, that's so 2007. If you wanted fences you should've had your merger committee argue for it. Oops, you say that happened already and you agreed to binding arbitration? Well, then it's over. The Nicolau list is the new reality and that's all the West wants and yes, we're entitled to it.

He is right. The time to argue about the seniority list ended the minute the Nic award came out. It really doesn't matter what the award said. The east pilots agreed to arbitration and they agreed to live with the result. That should be the end of it. The east pilots are acting like a bunch of spoiled children.

 

[FR8mastr]

My life was just fine prior to Parker aquiring us air. You brought nothing to the table except furloughs.

Thanks for asking.

Oh I forgot, The AWE was hiring in 05, and everyone knows that if that was the case, that would continue for ever. I do remember seeing a documentary on the discovery channel about the little known fact of how the economy has no effect to an airline based only in PHX. It also went on to explain that if upgrades were happening in 3 to 5 years that would also hold true for ever. Very interesting.

So I am very sorry I simply forgot I saw that episode.

 

[FR8mastr]

I said I could prove it is not really about "we only want what we had"

 

[regionaltard]

I said I could prove it is not really about "we only want what we had"

What you are conveniently choosing to ignore is that the time for the argument that you are making, and it's not an unreasonable one IMO, was prior to the arbitration. Instead your delusional "leadership" went for the whole enchilada even after Nicolau did everything but paint a picture to indicate that he wasn't going to buy the DOH proposal. There is zero doubt in my mind that from day one the east figured that outnumbering the West by 2:1 would enable them to rescue their failed careers at Cactus' expense. You knew that winning the arbitration was a longshot; your fatal miscalculation was believing that you'd get another chance to trade pesos for dollars and convert useless longevity into seniority.

 

[reepicheep]

This is all a distraction from the real issue: At the time of the merger US Airways was roughly half the size it was in 1989. This is why Nic. came down the way it did, and would have in a merger with pretty near any other carrier. The fabled 20-year F/O's we keep hearing about today got that way because usair imploded.

 

[MCDU]

This is all a distraction from the real issue: At the time of the merger US Airways was roughly half the size it was in 1989. This is why Nic. came down the way it did, and would have in a merger with pretty near any other carrier. The fabled 20-year F/O's we keep hearing about today got that way because usair imploded.

Well, USair is not alone. Lets look at ATA, United, American, Midwest Express, Aloha, TWA and Delta. There are many more to list. Most are half their size and no longer have a pension. Some of them are gone. Its not only USAIR that have taken so many cuts.

I guess one of the few real strong carrier would have been AWA. They were a powerhouse back in 2005. And without the merger with USAIRWAYS, they would still be upgrading and would be flying 330's to Europe. I feel bad for all those AWA pilots that are working under the best contract they ever had.

M

 

[reepicheep]

Did any of them furlough back to '88? Do any of them today, have 20-year narrowbody F/O's; that's all they can hold?

The condition of AWA isn't the issue - usair would have had an ugly sen. integration with anybody.

 

[regionaltard]

The condition of AWA isn't the issue - usair would have had an ugly sen. integration with anybody.

True story. They would have taken that ridiculous sense of entitlement with them no matter where they went.