Usapa lost!!!!!!!!!

[AnimalTale]

West rules>>>awa rules>>> cactus rules!!!

Binding arbitration b! T che $!!!!!


Cya

 

[Scope out RJ's]

No one out East will vote for a contract that includes the Nic. No joint contract=no Nic.
Once again the majority is getting screwed by the minority.

3500 against 1600. I wonder who controls the votes?


M

Hey McDoosh:
What ever will your boyfriend do now that he's lost? Looks like you're going to have to pick up more overtime at Gulfstream Int'l. to help pay damages.
Don't worry, I'm sure if you just do more of your "special favors," and skip the "gay outings," you'll be just fine!:laugh:

 

[General Lee]

MCDU, the court of appeals only rules on if there were serious errors in matters of law, not the merit of your argument. Of course since Judge Wake was soooo inexperienced in matters legal, I'm sure the Appellate Court will no doubt see the error of his ways....


On this I agree with you... kinda made me throw up a little writing that.

The AZ judge was an appellate judge prior to this, and knows the system. I bet he covered his bases. Too bad.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[grog_sit_reserv]

Come on General! Why would an Appellate Judge just move down to the circuit court. He obviously must've been demoted and all of his decisions on the Appellate been overturned.

I can't believe the injustice of this ruling. I mean after all USAPA was clearly founded in the interests of serving all US Airways pilots, they clearly state that within the Bradford letter.

I'm certain that the Court of Appeals has been waiting for this and will take it up immediately and find many errors in matters of law.....

Then again, probably not. F-Off USAPA-ites!!! That's twice, in two different types of impartial settings, that your cause has been shown to be B.S.

 

[Andy Neill]

Come on General! Why would an Appellate Judge just move down to the circuit court. He obviously must've been demoted and all of his decisions on the Appellate been overturned.

Perhaps the General was saying the guy was a state appellate court judge before becoming a federal disctrict court judge.

 

[Sandhawk]

Perhaps the General was saying the guy was a state appellate court judge before becoming a federal disctrict court judge.

I think Grog was being sarcastic and talking in an Eastwipe point-of-view.........

 

[Andy Neill]

I think Grog was being sarcastic ........

Thanks for the wakeup on that. After some checking, I found the following on Judge Wake:

A Phoenix native, Mr. Wake, 55, had been in private practice, specializing in commercial, administrative and constitutional litigation, appellate practice and Indian law. He served as a judge pro tempore on the Arizona Court of Appeals in 1985, 1992 and 1996-98, and is co-author of the Arizona Appellate Handbook.

Mr. Wake earned his undergraduate degree from Arizona State University, graduating with distinction in 1971. He received his J.D. from Harvard Law School, graduating cum laude in 1974. While at Harvard, he was a member of the Civil Liberties Law Review.

Mr. Wake is a fellow of the American Academy of Appellate Lawyers and former member of the State Bar of Arizona’s Committee on Civil Practice and Procedure.

 

[Hamburger]

No one out East will vote for a contract that includes the Nic.

They already voted for Binding Arbitration.

It's a shame that Integrity is a concept that has to be Court Ordered on the East.

 

[Raoul Duke]

keep in mind that the court of appeals does not review the "facts" found by the jury, only the law. Evidence rulings by the trial judge are virtually impossible to overturn because the court of appeals will uphold those decisions if there is any factual basis whatsoever to support them. Court of Appeals almost never overturn jury verdicts. USAPA better work up a plan B.

 

[grog_sit_reserv]

I was being sarcastic, but guess it didn't come through.


http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/24/us/24maricopa.html

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Seeham loves in house unions... what a cash cow!

 

[UpNDownGuy]

If I were an Eastie I'd start getting used to the Nic. Someone mentioned that Sully testified. Think about that for a minute. He clearly had zero relevence to a DFR case, but the judge allowed him (and others) to testify. I've talked to pilots who sat through the whole trial, and they agreed that the judge gave USAPA enormous latitude to defend themselves, including Sully et all. I think appealing to a higher court isn't going to get the East very far. The chances of this being overturned are slim and none.

 

[iflyhigh]

MCDU:

I understand this is a public board and you are entitled to your views.

First you have no first hand knowledge that the East will not vote for a contract witht the NIC, only speculation. Alot of people out West might not vote for the contract with the work rules suck and pay sucks.

Secondly, please do not claim to work for US Airways, as you were already busted on another thread. I am sure, at least I hope, you have friend on the East that feed you information. Everyone's views are biased to how the current situation affects them. I can honestly say a vast majority of the pilots can not look at the situation from a company's perspective, everything is the company's fault nor from an outside point of view.

I have been on the inside of the operation and now on the outside of the operation. I can honestly say I don't know how things are going to turn out. If I did I would not have to work. Yes, I was on the West side and NONO I don't expect my job back anytime soon with the verdict.

All I expect is for a union to live by their word, tell me the truth, (ALPA Lied to) and not waste unions dues on fighting fellow company pilots. This union was wasted more money on legal fees, (Suing 18 pilots for RICO, this DFR lawsuit and appealling both cases in court). The only people getting anything out of this is the lawyers and management. I would be happy if I were managment.

Time to put the union dues to proper use getting a pilot contract, bringing the pilot group together and moving forward to pilots in a position to fight the company not each another.

I have said enough. Your opinion are for the sole purpose of starting fights like the EAST and are useless.

 

[Fly-n-hi]

If I were an Eastie I'd start getting used to the Nic.

If I were an Eastie I'd quit.

Seriously. Whatever you easties think is gonna happen or whatever was promised to you isn't going to happen. You'd be better off leaving at this point. Besides, you have placed so much hope in these futile attempts to push around the west that, because that didn't happen, you are just gonna be miserable as long as you stay here. That was the whole reason you voted for USAPA...and now USAPA can't deliver on its promises.

Easties, quit and go somewhere else. Its over. Either get on board or get the heck outta here. Everybody is sooo tired of your BS. We're sooo tired of your arguing, your lack of intergrity, your bad attitudes, your devisiveness, and your wasting of our time. Just do us all a favor and leave.

A NMB arbitrator, a Judge/Jury, and just about the rest of the professional aviation community have already seen right through your garbage arguments.

If you wanna stay then shut the heck up and quit making things worse. All your doing is hurting yourselves and taking us down with you. Quit acting like fools.

USAPA = FAIL

 

[johnsonrod]

Great job Westies! You saved their ARSES from near liquidation after 9/11 and then they $crewed you over. It's payback time for their complete stupidity...

 

[DrewBlows]

The Addington case ended today with the jury deciding that USAPA failed in its duty to fairly represent all of its members. Today’s decision, while disappointing, was not unexpected. Since we were required to argue our case with limited time and evidence and were hamstrung by questionable rulings and incorrect instructions, USAPA, quite literally, fought this battle with both hands tied behind its back. Given the circumstances, we have a hard time accepting the idea that we encountered truly unbiased impartiality. Although this is a setback, we are very confident that the errors of law we encountered in this venue will be corrected.

Really? Literally? The judge made USAPA tie their hands behind their backs? I'm not sure how this helps or hurts their cause, but I'm certain it's unprecedented.

 

[hockeypilot44]

Great job Westies! You saved their ARSES from near liquidation after 9/11 and then they $crewed you over. It's payback time for their complete stupidity...

They did not do anything. We are pilots. Even if it is true that America West saved US Airways from liquidation, the America West pilots had nothing to do with it just as the US Airways' pilots had nothing to do with US Airways failing. It is obvious now that the Nicolau award was extremely unfair. It might have been fair at that point in time, but now it has been proven that NIC did not account for the East attrition and recalls. The East had merger protection in their contract saying DOH while the West had no merger protection. I have no idea why the East pilots even agreed to arbitration. The East pilots do not want the West positions. They just want what they brought to the merger.

 

[MK82Man]

From where I sit on furlough from AWA, it is a very small victory. The bench trial for remedy is underway but damage assesment won't occur until August and most West Furloughees think we will be stuck on Furlough for quite some time.

We've argued from the beginning that we just wanted what all of us agreed too. Binding Arbitration. I and 174 other AWA pilots were furloughed out of seniority at great personal and financial cost. The idiot in the room is just that and nobody should give him the time of day. For the Easties reading these posts, now is the time to really think about the way forward. It is soul searching time, if you still have one. Stuck on your LOA for 10 more years or work in good faith and embrace your fellow US Airways West pilots. Maybe you'd just rather take the company under and milk it for whatever it is worth until the day the golden goose dies? From where I sit on the street, that is not advisable, as the economy really sucks out here.

Cheers to AWAPPA, Leonidas, and the West pilots who opened their wallets and hearts to achieve this victory. I wish it was the end of the road; but if the trackrecord of East US Airways pilots is factored in, we are just moving out on the highway to destination unknown. What a tremendous waste of time, money, and resources that would have been better served in a joint fight aganist management.

For all fellow Professional Airline Pilots, thank you for your support and please continue to pay attention to the 1700 AWA pilots who are far from goal line. Always, Always, Always remember, Out West, Integrity matters!

 

[hockeypilot44]

You and the other Easties are IDIOTS. It doesn't matter what the majority think, it is what was AGREED upon initially. TOO BAD SO SAD. USAir was close to liquidation, and AmWest had the CREDIT to get a mortgage and buy and save your arses. Your East pilots may have had more years, but they didn't HAVE TO STAY at USAir. They could have bailed and gone to Jetblue or some other airline. Nobody said you HAD to stay at the sinking ship called USAir. AmWest bought you, and saved you, and you are babies.

Great job WESTIES!


Bye Bye--General Lee

I'm glad things worked out for you at Delta. You did nothing different than the pilots that accepted US Airways as their employer in the 80's. Your SLI favored you at the expense of the NWA pilots. I am not sure you would be "singing the same tune" if you were on the losing side of your SLI.

 

[michael707767]

I'm glad things worked out for you at Delta. You did nothing different than the pilots that accepted US Airways as their employer in the 80's. Your SLI favored you at the expense of the NWA pilots. I am not sure you would be "singing the same tune" if you were on the losing side of your SLI.

IMHO Gen Lee was on the losing side of the SLI. But we agreed to the result and will live by it.