Welcome to Flightinfo.com
- Register now and join the discussion
- Friendliest aviation Ccmmunity on the web
- Modern site for PC's, Phones, Tablets - no 3rd party apps required
- Ask questions, help others, promote aviation
- Share the passion for aviation
- Invite everyone to Flightinfo.com and let's have fun
USA JET PILOTS: Now what?
- Thread starter clansinclair
- Start date
- Watchers 29
Welcome to Flightinfo.com
- Register now and join the discussion
- Modern secure site, no 3rd party apps required
- Invite your friends
- Share the passion of aviation
- Friendliest aviation community on the web
asipilot
Well-known member
- Joined
- Jan 13, 2002
- Posts
- 70
Hey Clansinclair,
How about we act like professionals instead blaming others for our company's problems. I'm not happy about my paycut, but I have enough tact not to attack Ameristar, even though some of what you said may be true. I mean come on, this is on demand cargo, anyone who has done this job knows the best you can hope for is everyone getting screwed equally. At least this is the case within the pilot group at USA Jet right now. Last time I was one of those who got furloughed, which is not an equal screwing!!! IMHO. The question I have right now is whether our management took pay cuts??? There was no specific mention of it during our Tuesday meeting, I didn't make it to yesterday's COO/VP meeting so I can't say for sure. Anybody go to that meeting yesterday that might want to PM me with the meat & potatoes??
How about we act like professionals instead blaming others for our company's problems. I'm not happy about my paycut, but I have enough tact not to attack Ameristar, even though some of what you said may be true. I mean come on, this is on demand cargo, anyone who has done this job knows the best you can hope for is everyone getting screwed equally. At least this is the case within the pilot group at USA Jet right now. Last time I was one of those who got furloughed, which is not an equal screwing!!! IMHO. The question I have right now is whether our management took pay cuts??? There was no specific mention of it during our Tuesday meeting, I didn't make it to yesterday's COO/VP meeting so I can't say for sure. Anybody go to that meeting yesterday that might want to PM me with the meat & potatoes??
clansinclair
Well-known member
- Joined
- Oct 25, 2004
- Posts
- 53
OK, OK! For the facts I got mixed up with Grand Aire, I sincerely apologize. If I'm wrong on anyother points, I apologize for that too.
However, the flight log pencil-whipping was told to me by a one of our former captains that used to work for Ameristar before coming to USA Jet. The "C" check issue was related to me by one of our senior management.
I failed to mention the "plant" in our customer service department that was discovered, fired, and if not mistaken again, legally pursued at one point.
I have no problem with "fair" competition. If Ameristar can operate legally, safely, on a "level playing field", then more power to them. That's not been the case for a long time, and everyone in the industry knows it.
I don't blame Ameristar for our fiscal issues. I said at the beginning that they were only part of the problems with the industry. Can anybody honestly say that they are the shining example of what's "right" in the industry?
Equal screwing? Are you serious? How's it equal screwing? Guys that have been here for years, endured layoffs, frozen pay raises, stayed with the company through thick and thin, worked their bums off, some even had to go through bankruptcy due to the previous layoffs, are taking the lion's share of the paycuts. The most senior Falcon 20 captains are losing almost $1500/mo vs. the most junior losing only around $660/mo. After taking our turn at being the junior pilot on the seniority list and accepting whatever came with that, staying with the company and building our seniority, enduring the downside of this business for years, and now we have to bear the lion's share of the paycuts to save the jobs of the most junior pilots who haven't had to endure any of the previous? How's that equal screwing? What's the point of having a seniority program then?
Don't get me wrong. I wouldn't relish anyone losing their job, but most of the guys who would've been laidoff haven't paid their "dues" at this company. Most of them haven't even comparitively paid their relative "dues" in aviation. Most of them are young and have several decades of career left to recover any losses they might have had to endure. While most of us senior guys have less than a decade left in our careers, and we'll never recover the losses. Now how is that equl screwing in anybody's book? Not to mention the fact that most of the junior pilots are only here long enough to build enough time and resume to move on to bigger and better things. For the rest of us, this is probably our last job in aviation!
However, the flight log pencil-whipping was told to me by a one of our former captains that used to work for Ameristar before coming to USA Jet. The "C" check issue was related to me by one of our senior management.
I failed to mention the "plant" in our customer service department that was discovered, fired, and if not mistaken again, legally pursued at one point.
I have no problem with "fair" competition. If Ameristar can operate legally, safely, on a "level playing field", then more power to them. That's not been the case for a long time, and everyone in the industry knows it.
I don't blame Ameristar for our fiscal issues. I said at the beginning that they were only part of the problems with the industry. Can anybody honestly say that they are the shining example of what's "right" in the industry?
Equal screwing? Are you serious? How's it equal screwing? Guys that have been here for years, endured layoffs, frozen pay raises, stayed with the company through thick and thin, worked their bums off, some even had to go through bankruptcy due to the previous layoffs, are taking the lion's share of the paycuts. The most senior Falcon 20 captains are losing almost $1500/mo vs. the most junior losing only around $660/mo. After taking our turn at being the junior pilot on the seniority list and accepting whatever came with that, staying with the company and building our seniority, enduring the downside of this business for years, and now we have to bear the lion's share of the paycuts to save the jobs of the most junior pilots who haven't had to endure any of the previous? How's that equal screwing? What's the point of having a seniority program then?
Don't get me wrong. I wouldn't relish anyone losing their job, but most of the guys who would've been laidoff haven't paid their "dues" at this company. Most of them haven't even comparitively paid their relative "dues" in aviation. Most of them are young and have several decades of career left to recover any losses they might have had to endure. While most of us senior guys have less than a decade left in our careers, and we'll never recover the losses. Now how is that equl screwing in anybody's book? Not to mention the fact that most of the junior pilots are only here long enough to build enough time and resume to move on to bigger and better things. For the rest of us, this is probably our last job in aviation!
Clan as said before you really need to relax. No Ameristar crews are sabotaging your airplanes, and I for one am seriously insulted by that statement. If I saw ANYONE screwing with ANY airplane, I and all of my co-workers would be there to stop that from happening.
It sucks that your pay has been cut, it is slow everywhere in the on demand business. Just dont attack Ameristar pilots personally for something that is going on at your company.
Hopefully everything will start to pickup for all of us soon.
It sucks that your pay has been cut, it is slow everywhere in the on demand business. Just dont attack Ameristar pilots personally for something that is going on at your company.
Hopefully everything will start to pickup for all of us soon.
clansinclair
Well-known member
- Joined
- Oct 25, 2004
- Posts
- 53
Alright, I'll relax now.
You're right, it's probably true that 99.9% of Ameristar's pilots are decent and honorable guys just trying to eek out a living like the rest of us. To those 99.9%, I salute you. I've offended you. Please accept my sincerest apology, and I really mean that.
Please just don't try to feed me the cock and bull about how honest and efficient Ameristar the company is. Deep down in their hearts, I'm sure their pilots know that isn't the case, but hey, we all gotta work to feed our families right? I've had to work for shady scumbag outfits in the past myself, but at least we were honest and called it a shady scumbag outfit. Although we didn't say it to the management's face because we needed the job, among our peers we called the scumbag duck a "scumbag duck"!
Even though I am not happy with what the management here at USA Jet has done in the current case, I can honestly say with a firm conviction that USA Jet is a "stand up" company, a company with integrity that far surpasses any of our competitors. There are many things I wished they'd do differently, i.e. not depend on the auto industry for our survival as an airline, but I've never doubted that their intentions were anything but honorable.
I've said it before. If I was so smucking fart and had all the answers, I'd own my own airline. Well I'm not, and I don't. However, I'm not stupid nor clueless. I've been around long enough to recognize a shady scumbag outfit when I see one. As far as I'm concerned Ameristar the company is a shady scumbag outfit, and for that I offer no apology whatsoever!
You're right, it's probably true that 99.9% of Ameristar's pilots are decent and honorable guys just trying to eek out a living like the rest of us. To those 99.9%, I salute you. I've offended you. Please accept my sincerest apology, and I really mean that.
Please just don't try to feed me the cock and bull about how honest and efficient Ameristar the company is. Deep down in their hearts, I'm sure their pilots know that isn't the case, but hey, we all gotta work to feed our families right? I've had to work for shady scumbag outfits in the past myself, but at least we were honest and called it a shady scumbag outfit. Although we didn't say it to the management's face because we needed the job, among our peers we called the scumbag duck a "scumbag duck"!
Even though I am not happy with what the management here at USA Jet has done in the current case, I can honestly say with a firm conviction that USA Jet is a "stand up" company, a company with integrity that far surpasses any of our competitors. There are many things I wished they'd do differently, i.e. not depend on the auto industry for our survival as an airline, but I've never doubted that their intentions were anything but honorable.
I've said it before. If I was so smucking fart and had all the answers, I'd own my own airline. Well I'm not, and I don't. However, I'm not stupid nor clueless. I've been around long enough to recognize a shady scumbag outfit when I see one. As far as I'm concerned Ameristar the company is a shady scumbag outfit, and for that I offer no apology whatsoever!
T-REX
Well-known member
- Joined
- Dec 16, 2002
- Posts
- 402
It just took a couple clicks and keystrokes to find some facts rather than just some second-hand info regarding one particular "scumbag" outfit.
There are numerous filings by USA Jet against Ameristar attempting to restrict growth based on lack of financial resources, flight following, record keeping, administration,....etc. Basically just an attempt to cost your competitor $$ by delaying growth into larger aircraft.
See for yourself:
http://dmses.dot.gov/docimages/p78/281318.pdf
http://dmses.dot.gov/docimages/p80/324416.doc
Im not getting into a holier than thou arguent, Im sure we'd do the same to you. My point is we both fly the same 30 yr old aircraft to the same POS towns in Michigan and Texico. We are all scumbags in the eyes of RJ gear slingers making 20K a year but we continue to do it for necessity or pride in getting a descent check.
Keep it civil. We're both just pilots doing our jobs.
PS: If an Ameristar pilot tried to sabotage your plane we'd kick his arse for you.
There are numerous filings by USA Jet against Ameristar attempting to restrict growth based on lack of financial resources, flight following, record keeping, administration,....etc. Basically just an attempt to cost your competitor $$ by delaying growth into larger aircraft.
See for yourself:
http://dmses.dot.gov/docimages/p78/281318.pdf
http://dmses.dot.gov/docimages/p80/324416.doc
Im not getting into a holier than thou arguent, Im sure we'd do the same to you. My point is we both fly the same 30 yr old aircraft to the same POS towns in Michigan and Texico. We are all scumbags in the eyes of RJ gear slingers making 20K a year but we continue to do it for necessity or pride in getting a descent check.
Keep it civil. We're both just pilots doing our jobs.
PS: If an Ameristar pilot tried to sabotage your plane we'd kick his arse for you.
Clyde
Well-known member
- Joined
- Feb 18, 2004
- Posts
- 660
T-REX said:
"We are all scumbags in the eyes of RJ gear slingers making 20K a year but we continue to do it for necessity or pride in getting a descent check."
T-Rex,
Having been there, done that, you have a thankless job. You also have one of the toughest jobs that many pilots won't even go near with a 10-foot pole. With that being said, let me be one of the first to say thank-you. Let me also mention that you guys are good sticks, you would be dead if you didn't know what you are doing. And there aren't too many people out there who would know the right things to do in that type of environment.
You all deserve a cold one, and I'll also be the first to buy the first round.
Be safe and be careful, it gets better.
- Clyde
clansinclair
Well-known member
- Joined
- Oct 25, 2004
- Posts
- 53
For some reason I am unable to access the referenced documents.
But tell me why shouldn't your company have to abide by all the rules and regulations regarding the type of operations we all work under? Why shouldn't you have to have all the supporting elements required by law regarding your aforementioned areas, such as flight following, record keeping, adiministration, etc.
Why shouldn't USA Jet seek legal redress when you attempt to gain an illegal, unsafe, and unethical advantage in a business that is customer service oriented, when ultimately you end up doing the industry a tremendous diservice as well as the customer?
You say our motive was to price you out of the competitive market and prevent your growth. I say our motive was an attempt to keep the "playing field" level in the interest of safety, the industry as a whole, and quality, reliable service to the customer.
But tell me why shouldn't your company have to abide by all the rules and regulations regarding the type of operations we all work under? Why shouldn't you have to have all the supporting elements required by law regarding your aforementioned areas, such as flight following, record keeping, adiministration, etc.
Why shouldn't USA Jet seek legal redress when you attempt to gain an illegal, unsafe, and unethical advantage in a business that is customer service oriented, when ultimately you end up doing the industry a tremendous diservice as well as the customer?
You say our motive was to price you out of the competitive market and prevent your growth. I say our motive was an attempt to keep the "playing field" level in the interest of safety, the industry as a whole, and quality, reliable service to the customer.
clansinclair
Well-known member
- Joined
- Oct 25, 2004
- Posts
- 53
Share this page
Latest resources
-
-
-
-
-
AC 90-89C - Amateur-Built Aircraft and Ultralight Flight Testing HandbookAmateur-Built Aircraft and Ultralight Flight Testing Handbook
- Neal
- Updated:
