US West east coast bases

[Bringupthebird]

If US is forced to reduce the east headcount as a result of the filed injunction but cannot reduce the airframe count due to the TA, could we be looking at US opening east bases to crew east aircraft with west pilots? Absent any relief on the airframe reduction, that looks like the only feasible option to me.

 

[Ocity]

I would think they would just furlough in proper order and re-route West AC to the east system.

 

[Bringupthebird]

But they will have more aircraft than crews to properly staff them.

 

[Mr Hat]

I realize there are so many issues between both groups but when are you both going to realize that ALPA/USAPA or whatever you call yourselves, you ALL lose divided. I don't say this to slam anyone and I don't have a dog in this fight but it's truly sad to watch two great groups go down like this.

 

[Dr. Rumack]

I realize there are so many issues between both groups but when are you both going to realize that ALPA/USAPA or whatever you call yourselves, you ALL lose divided. I don't say this to slam anyone and I don't have a dog in this fight but it's truly sad to watch two great groups go down like this.

You are absolutely right in saying that we need to be united. Unfortunately, if the west was to 'unite' with the east that would leave a very 'united' east and not much would be left of the west. It would be a Kamikaze move which would result in career suicide. Do you really think that would be best for the west? Remember that before the east overthrew ALPA, based only on a significant advantage in numbers, we were one 'union' in the midst of contract negotiations. The mass on the east did not like the result of binding arbitration and created this chasm.

 

[Soulfly]

You are absolutely right in saying that we need to be united. Unfortunately, if the west was to 'unite' with the east that would leave a very 'united' east and not much would be left of the west. It would be a Kamikaze move which would result in career suicide. Do you really think that would be best for the west? Remember that before the east overthrew ALPA, based only on a significant advantage in numbers, we were one 'union' in the midst of contract negotiations. The mass on the east did not like the result of binding arbitration and created this chasm.

And walked out of negotiations... Never to be seen from again......

Wait, then USAPA arrives, shows back up to the table..... shocking!

Only to negotiate a new deal for their side. Our contract is far superior (sad) and the AWA pilots have nothing to gain. Glass is not going to go above or beyond the current AWA contract..

 

[Colonel Savage]

...Glass is not going to go above or beyond the current AWA contract..

Is that Jerry Glass? If so, prepare for a rough ride.

 

[Turtle21]

You are absolutely right in saying that we need to be united. Unfortunately, if the west was to 'unite' with the east that would leave a very 'united' east and not much would be left of the west. It would be a Kamikaze move which would result in career suicide. Do you really think that would be best for the west? Remember that before the east overthrew ALPA, based only on a significant advantage in numbers, we were one 'union' in the midst of contract negotiations. The mass on the east did not like the result of binding arbitration and created this chasm.

We were never one "union". We all paid tribute to the same oligarchs who peddled an apparition called the ALPA "union".

ALPA never provided any unity among its benefactors (the pilots benefitting the oligarchy).

ALPA is to blame for the virulent disunity and is relieved to have rid themselves of us until such a time as the chaos has subsided (finally the pilots hate someone besides ALPA, even it is themselves). In the future ALPA will be delighted to accept our tribute again.

For now pilots can scream about sour grapes all they wish while they cling to bitterness and the ALPA apparition. No one is going to force you to cast your vote, but unless/until ALPA returns you will find that a vote sways the reality we all live within.

 

[cactusboy53]

If US is forced to reduce the east headcount as a result of the filed injunction but cannot reduce the airframe count due to the TA, could we be looking at US opening east bases to crew east aircraft with west pilots? Absent any relief on the airframe reduction, that looks like the only feasible option to me.

Cool!! TDY in PHL. The first Cheese Steak Sandwich is on me. My guess is the Holiday Inn in Essington.

 

[PHXFLYR]

Is that Jerry Glass? If so, prepare for a rough ride.

We've already had the distinct "pleasure" of dealing with him. Your right. It wasn't fun.


PHXFLYR

 

[Bringupthebird]

Cool!! TDY in PHL. The first Cheese Steak Sandwich is on me. My guess is the Holiday Inn in Essington.

That would be the most expeditious way, but also very expensive. As easies were recalled, the number of westies assigned east could drop.

I am certain that USAPA (who by accepting any money) is working hard to represent those west pilots who stand to be hurt by this drawdown in flying and will tirelessly pursue strategies such as these to help mitigate such effects.

Don't laugh. They are.

Stop it.

Now you're making me laugh!

 

[weasel_lips]

If US is forced to reduce the east headcount as a result of the filed injunction but cannot reduce the airframe count due to the TA, could we be looking at US opening east bases to crew east aircraft with west pilots? Absent any relief on the airframe reduction, that looks like the only feasible option to me.

Seems like a lot of wasted money on lawyers.

The guys/gals marked for furlough are all going to get furloughed. The time frames may change, that’s all.

A successful lawsuit just means the company will be forced to accelerate the furloughs on the east side. Congrats on helping people out the door a little faster.

 

[Flybywire44]

You are absolutely right in saying that we need to be united. Unfortunately, if the west was to 'unite' with the east that would leave a very 'united' east and not much would be left of the west. It would be a Kamikaze move which would result in career suicide. Do you really think that would be best for the west? Remember that before the east overthrew ALPA, based only on a significant advantage in numbers, we were one 'union' in the midst of contract negotiations. The mass on the east did not like the result of binding arbitration and created this chasm.

Everything in the world is decided on majority or the more "significant numbers."

 

[Thebadcat1313]

Seems like a lot of wasted money on lawyers.

The guys/gals marked for furlough are all going to get furloughed. The time frames may change, that’s all.

A successful lawsuit just means the company will be forced to accelerate the furloughs on the east side. Congrats on helping people out the door a little faster.

And I'm sure if you were being furloughed out of seniority, you'd be fine with it. Riiiiggghhht.

You need to read the lawsuit documents before you make posts like this.

 

[ALGFLYR]

And I'm sure if you were being furloughed out of seniority, you'd be fine with it. Riiiiggghhht.

You need to read the lawsuit documents before you make posts like this.

Hummm... Out of seniority? Who's view of the seniority? ALPA certainly created a can of worms with the whole J4J and MDA issues...

But the facts remain in place. There were hundreds of US Air pilots that were NOT on furlough when this merger was announced. Yet these Hundreds of non-furloughed US Air pilots were placed below the most junior AWA pilot on the Nic list... even if your argument is relative seniority integration, this was not correct...

Wondering what will happen when this suit forces the re-opening of this can...

 

[Captzaahlie]

We were never one "union". We all paid tribute to the same oligarchs who peddled an apparition called the ALPA "union".

ALPA never provided any unity among its benefactors (the pilots benefitting the oligarchy).

ALPA is to blame for the virulent disunity and is relieved to have rid themselves of us until such a time as the chaos has subsided (finally the pilots hate someone besides ALPA, even it is themselves). In the future ALPA will be delighted to accept our tribute again.

For now pilots can scream about sour grapes all they wish while they cling to bitterness and the ALPA apparition. No one is going to force you to cast your vote, but unless/until ALPA returns you will find that a vote sways the reality we all live within.

Face it , it was not the union , it was your representatives! You should have thrown them all out, reelected new reps and sent them back to the table. Your pilot group was asleep at the wheel and let a handful dictate your future.... the same is happening again and in the mean time only Parker wins by saving money on your pay rates. Soon the lawyers will be winning too.....

 

[Captzaahlie]

Cool!! TDY in PHL. The first Cheese Steak Sandwich is on me. My guess is the Holiday Inn in Essington.

Or the s-hole Ramada down the street from Jims Steak and Cheese...

 

[Captzaahlie]

And I'm sure if you were being furloughed out of seniority, you'd be fine with it. Riiiiggghhht.

You need to read the lawsuit documents before you make posts like this.

Yeah, I'm totally comfortable with it.....uke:

 

[Thebadcat1313]

Hummm... Out of seniority? Who's view of the seniority? ALPA certainly created a can of worms with the whole J4J and MDA issues...

But the facts remain in place. There were hundreds of US Air pilots that were NOT on furlough when this merger was announced. Yet these Hundreds of non-furloughed US Air pilots were placed below the most junior AWA pilot on the Nic list... even if your argument is relative seniority integration, this was not correct...

Wondering what will happen when this suit forces the re-opening of this can...

Even if DOH was used, the furloughs are still out of seniority. Look at the lists yourself. You would'nt stand for it one second if even one person junior to you remained on the property while you lost your job, and you know it. The least you guys can do is be honest about this crap. I don't give a rats azz about your stupid MDA and J4J issues. Most of our furloughees are senior to you on a DOH list, as well, not to mention the Nic, which will prevail, by the way.

 

[Boeing747Driver]

Hummm... Out of seniority? Who's view of the seniority? ALPA certainly created a can of worms with the whole J4J and MDA issues...

But the facts remain in place. There were hundreds of US Air pilots that were NOT on furlough when this merger was announced. Yet these Hundreds of non-furloughed US Air pilots were placed below the most junior AWA pilot on the Nic list... even if your argument is relative seniority integration, this was not correct...

Wondering what will happen when this suit forces the re-opening of this can...

Lets clear this up once and for all.

MDA was not a mainline position. If that did not sink in I will say it again. MDA was not a mainline position.

If MDA was a mainline position then recalls were not handled correctly.

Again MDA was not a mainline position and the planes said USAIRWAYS Express when the operation started.

One last time MDA was not a mainline position.

 

[BeCareful!]

Oh, that's funny.....!.....you're going to "clear this up once and for all" by repeating something several times on the Internet.

Jerry Glass orders that the planes say Express on the side and somehow that makes MDA it's own airline. Funny, it never had a certificate other than Mainline's.

And, yes, the recalls were handled incorrectly, as were the LOA 91 holds and freezes and a whole host of other things. There was just a grievance heard on much of it (not all....yet.)

But, yeah, for now, just repeating it on FI.com should do the trick

 

[MCDU]

Kind of like Delta Express. That was Mainline. Well at least according to Delta pilots. Any Delta pilot want to confirm that Delta Express was mainline?

M

 

[OPECJet]

Lets clear this up once and for all.

MDA was not a mainline position. If that did not sink in I will say it again. MDA was not a mainline position.

If MDA was a mainline position then recalls were not handled correctly.

Again MDA was not a mainline position and the planes said USAIRWAYS Express when the operation started.

One last time MDA was not a mainline position.

What operating certificate were those Jungle Busses on? What was the callsign used during that operation? Where did every captain on those airplanes come from? Where are the guys who FLOWED from PDT / ALG to those 170's now?

 

[Boeing747Driver]

Ah the I was hired by default flow ups are now the experts. LOL

You guys are right. When I got my MDA offer letters they were really mainline recall letters in disguise.

 

[TWA Dude]

Everything in the world is decided on majority or the more "significant numbers."

On my morning jog today I came up with an almost-perfect analogy to describe what the East is doing.

Seniority is like a big jar of fresh-baked cookies.

Let’s say there’s a fourth-grade kid and his mom baked a big jar of cookies. He figured they were all for him but he was shocked when his mom invited his second-grade neighbor (whom he hates) over for a play date. She tells them, “These cookies are for you both to share. Now have a nice time and I’ll be back in two hours.” So what does the fourth-grader do? He’s bigger than his neighbor so he grabs the jar and eats almost all the cookies himself and gives the smaller boy just one. This is what most kids will do if left unsupervised.

But what if the mom had stayed in the room watching? In that case, the bigger boy would’ve shared the cookies equally because his mom was making him.

So obviously in this analogy the East is the bigger boy and the West is the smaller boy (and George Nicolau is mom). What’s actually occurred now is that the bigger boy anticipated what his mom was going to make him do so he grabbed the jar and ran away to hide and eat as many cookies as he could before his mom found him and made him share.

Of course, every parent knows what happens to greedy little children who eat too many cookies…

 

[charlie2]

What did you put in the cookies that you're eating?

 

[Bringupthebird]

No, the big boy wasn't satisfied with his own cookies so he beat on the little boy until he gave him all his lunch money and then forced him to bring the big boy more money to pay for his fighting lessons. When the big boy's mom sees what an extortionist he's become she regrets ever making cookies for him. The big boy says it's not about the cookies, it never was about the cookies it's about getting even for all the times he was beat on when he was younger. So the little boy who by now is beaten, poor and malnourished goes to the principal of the school. The big boy says that's a waste of the principal's time and that the boy should spend more time earning money to give the big boy. He threatens that if the hush money stops, then things will really get bad and that his parents might put him up for adoption.

The little boy never even liked cookies to begin with.

 

[charlie2]

What did you put in the cookies that you're eating?

.....