US Airways snap-back?

[get2flyin]

And a pony too. :laugh:

I was thinking they'll probably get the snapback AND a unicorn. I'm sure USAPA could comfortably make that promise. What a wonderful day that will be for everyone.

 

[doh]

There is no explicit "snap back" provision. The arbitration decision hinges on whether a "snap back" was implied in contract language which specifies that the concessionary rates have an expiration date of December 09. The actual legaleze is not something I am qualified to discuss, but to me the "implied" snap back is there, but perhaps not legally enforceable.

Does it actually say expires or becomes amendable? If it uses the word expire, then you should win.

 

[ackattacker]

The rates of pay specified in Section 3 of the Agreement, as modified by the Restructuring Agreement, will be revised as follows:
1. Freeze current rates effective 5/01/04 through 12/31/09
2. Reduce rates as frozen by 18.0%
3. Reduce International pay override,............. etc

In my mind, vague enough to tie up a few lawyers for a good while.

 

[Crzipilot]

Hence why it's tied up waiting for the arbitrator.

As most people understand, Airline contracts become amendable at a certain date, and do not "expire" Same with LOA's, UNLESS there is a definitive drop dead date stated.

LOA's and contracts continue into perpetuality until they are replaced with another agreed upon contract.

So, LOA 93 doesn't have an "expiration" date on it, BUT the pay freeze has a specific time frame listed. Why was that?

I believe that's the argument. Inherited management (who wasn't involved) says the dates mean nothing. USAPA says it's a drop dead date.

I suppose when the arbitrator is done with his hip surgery and moving his son to Russia, we will find out....

 

[MCDU]

Well said

M

 

[get2flyin]

Hence why it's tied up waiting for the arbitrator.

As most people understand, Airline contracts become amendable at a certain date, and do not "expire" Same with LOA's, UNLESS there is a definitive drop dead date stated.

LOA's and contracts continue into perpetuality until they are replaced with another agreed upon contract.

So, LOA 93 doesn't have an "expiration" date on it, BUT the pay freeze has a specific time frame listed. Why was that?

I believe that's the argument. Inherited management (who wasn't involved) says the dates mean nothing. USAPA says it's a drop dead date.

I suppose when the arbitrator is done with his hip surgery and moving his son to Russia, we will find out....

Well, if USAPA said it you can take it to the bank. They certainly wouldn't be giving the majority group of the membership (*that they exclusively represent) little more than lip service. Besides, the true beauty of the situation is that if the membership thinks the ruling is "unreasonable", just blow it off. Tell anyone who will listen that the company may have beaten USAPA but those scoundrels never honestly represented the poor average East pilot. Hell, have an election and vote in the "ALPUSA" (Air-Line Pilots of USAir) and then say nothing is legally binding. That would TOTALLY work...at least that's what I heard.

 

[Crzipilot]

A little sore on the 9th and the Supreme not hearing your case?!?!?!

What's that legal bill up to yet. 2.75million???

Starting to squirm yet. How long you guys going to let your lawyers to continue billing ya for losing, before you cut him off?

 

[St. Nic]

The westies are finished-once the snap back kicks in we have no reason to even keep the desert boys around. There days are numbered

 

[JetMonkey]

The westies are finished-once the snap back kicks in we have no reason to even keep the desert boys around. There days are numbered

It's good to have dreams. Keep dreamin a$$wipe..

 

[Guppiedriver]

The westies are finished-once the snap back kicks in we have no reason to even keep the desert boys around. Their days are numbered.

There, I fixed it for you. I still think you and MCDU are one and the same. You both make the same grammatical/spelling errors.

 

[abefly]

There, I fixed it for you. I still think you and MCDU are one and the same. You both make the same grammatical/spelling errors.

It's hard for them to type while they are blowing eachother.

 

[charlie2]

One of the strategies concerns the word "freeze". When you bid and are awarded a seat in an aircraft there sometimes is a "freeze" where you can't bid for something else until the end of that time limit to save the company the training costs. But at the end of the "freeze" you don't have to renegotiate the right to bid a new aircraft, you just do it. "Freeze current rates effective 5/01/04 through 12/31/09" we think means at the end of the freeze we don't have to negotiate new rates.

 

[ackattacker]

Makes sense to me. When something is "frozen" for a specified duration that implies that at the end it becomes "thawed". But I'm no contract lawyer.

 

[2ndGenPSA]

Forecast to report a $448M profit for 2010. What's that per pilot... $89,600.
Wow! So when is a new contract going to be negotiated? A $20,000 per pilot raise would cost US Airways about $100M. Less than a quarter of the 2010 profits.
So, (if you're capable) without East vs. West, when is USAPA going to get things moving and negotiate a new contract? WTF???
Question:
Is the rank and file happy with their USAPA leadership?

 

[get2flyin]

A little sore on the 9th and the Supreme not hearing your case?!?!?!

What's that legal bill up to yet. 2.75million???

Starting to squirm yet. How long you guys going to let your lawyers to continue billing ya for losing, before you cut him off?

I'm not trying to start a pissing match with you or anyone else. You have your opinions on the matter and I have mine. Regardless, I can't help but wonder if YOU are a little sore at the fact that USAPA hasn't accomplished ANY of the promises they made about contract implementation prior to the representation election (*unless you consider continuous separate ops a fulfillment of that promise). Furthermore, how long are you going to let USAPA continue billing YOU for losing before you cut THEM off?

The westies are finished-once the snap back kicks in we have no reason to even keep the desert boys around. There days are numbered

First off, exactly who is the "we" that you refer to when you say "we have no reason to even keep the desert boys around". Are you suggesting that the East pilots or USAPA hold West jobs in the balance? That is a somewhat laughable conclusion...about the same as West pilots suggesting they somehow have a say in East pilot employment. What I think should be obvious even to your bitter mind is that in the event you actually DID get some fabulous pay increase, the expansion would suddenly move Westward. All growth international trips would start in Phoenix, if not with West pilots dead heading to CLT and PHL. The bottom line, you'll get choked out.

It's hard for them to type while they are blowing eachother.

Almost spit coffee on my computer. Thanks for laugh..this might be the quote of the day.:laugh: