US Airways Management and America West Pilots to Open Separate Negotiations

[Flybywire44]

*deleted to preserve professionalism*

 

[jbDC9]

We are blessed to have a true know-it-all on this forum.

There is nothing PCL doesn't know everything about.

Just let it go man... I asked a simple question, PCL responded with a simple answer. What's wrong with that?

 

[waveflyer]

Joe-
the point still stands that most recent hires at AWA are far more experienced than those at the bottom of AAA's list were when they got hired in the mid and late 80's. Again, noone has looked out for young pilot's seniority as scope has been released time and again- but then AAA want's credit for their time when they flew Fokker's and 146's? ? Guess what? Most AWA guys flew those a/c too (or their replacements)- they just had to fly them for "regional" airlines where they didn't have a right to any seniority grab. Excuse us, if, after 9/11, BK, scope, and age 65 if no young pilot feels that bad for pilots who failed time and again to think long term. Maybe you should have been leading. In the meantime- seniority is how YOU created it. Now you want to mold it to fit your needs b/c you've been on the losing end of it?- Piss off. It doesn't work that way.

You'd do much better to use your credibility and lead this country towards a national list.

 

[JoeMerchant]

Joe-
the point still stands that most recent hires at AWA are far more experienced than those at the bottom of AAA's list were when they got hired in the mid and late 80's. Again, noone has looked out for young pilot's seniority as scope has been released time and again- but then AAA want's credit for their time when they flew Fokker's and 146's? ? Guess what? Most AWA guys flew those a/c too (or their replacements)- they just had to fly them for "regional" airlines where they didn't have a right to any seniority grab. Excuse us, if, after 9/11, BK, scope, and age 65 if no young pilot feels that bad for pilots who failed time and again to think long term. Maybe you should have been leading. In the meantime- seniority is how YOU created it. Now you want to mold it to fit your needs b/c you've been on the losing end of it?- Piss off. It doesn't work that way.

You'd do much better to use your credibility and lead this country towards a national list.

I think a national seniority system is absolutely necessary....however your post shows why it will never happen.....YOUR vision of seniority and MINE don't match.....

Look at the AWA/USAIR, DAL/NWA, and AA/TWA seniority issues.....FAIR is only in the eyes of the beholder.....

Of course as long as we have this problem we will be divided.....

 

[PCL_128]

Very true. Each pilot has a different definition of when seniority should start on a hypothetical NSL. This is why it will never happen, no matter how much you want it to, waveflyer.

 

[JoeMerchant]

Very true. Each pilot has a different definition of when seniority should start on a hypothetical NSL. This is why it will never happen, no matter how much you want it to, waveflyer.

....on that we agree.....However keeping that in mind.....don't expect much "unity" when there are corporate deals that involve 2 separate pilot groups.....

 

[Tejas-Jet]

I guess the voting starts today? Good luck to all of you....I hope you get what you want.

Wonder what the actual percentage of pilots who do vote will be?

We all know that pilots have a poor record of union participation.

 

[PCL_128]

....on that we agree.....However keeping that in mind.....don't expect much "unity" when there are corporate deals that involve 2 separate pilot groups.....

I don't expect much unity in those situations. Each side is looking out for their own best interests. That's why ALPA merger policy requires binding arbitration if the two sides can't reach a compromise. But apparently there is a dictionary shortage in the land of AAA, because no one there seems to understand the definition of the term "binding."

 

[PCL_128]

I guess the voting starts today? Good luck to all of you....I hope you get what you want.

Wonder what the actual percentage of pilots who do vote will be?

We all know that pilots have a poor record of union participation.

I expect that the West pilots will have something approaching 95% participation, because they stand to get completely raped if uSAPa wins. That's providing some good motivation. I think you'll find that a lot less of the East pilot group actually goes through with it, though. It will be a close vote.

 

[JoeMerchant]

I don't expect much unity in those situations. Each side is looking out for their own best interests. That's why ALPA merger policy requires binding arbitration if the two sides can't reach a compromise. But apparently there is a dictionary shortage in the land of AAA, because no one there seems to understand the definition of the term "binding."

....wasn't the Alaska arbitration "binding"....I guess ALPA can't find the dictionary either....

Face it....people and organizations are going to use every means to "look out for their own best interests".....Lawsuit, decertification, recall......We will all do what is in our own best interests....

This is something you ALPA cheerleaders seem to want to ignore in your cheers.....But you can't ignore it....