LeonPhelps
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Unofficial SWA Hiring Mins
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TV9Driver
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1700 PIC turbine is what they told me - of course it was AFTER I just paid for my type rating. Also, you'd better be military - it's turned into a big military club now. Out of the 15 guys in my type class, half were military. Every one of the military guys got an interview - not 1 civilian got an interview. I guess 1,400 121 pic turbine and several years at a major airline don't mean much these days. Oh well, live goes on.
TV9Driver,
a. You didn't mention how many hours the military guys had PIC wise. Military flight commitments (at least for the USAF) have gone up from 6 years when I was in to about 9. So guys will have more PIC than before.
b. With all this war going on and other troubles for the past decade, the military guys fly more than ever, including the fighter jocks, so they are more competitive than before.
c. Not flame bait, but its hard flying downtown Iraq with AAA coming at you and converting that to 121 time. NOBODY in the military gets 121 time so your comment that you are the cat's meow because of 1400PIC 121 time and major carrier doesn't hold much water.
d. Just because half of your type class was military and they all got interviews is simple statistics and coincidence. Could be the pool has a boatload of civies with types already, so your comparison doesn't mean much. The hiring numbers show lots of civilians.
Good luck, but get a better attitude. If it makes you feel better, the military is a lot smaller than it used to be, so there will be fewer of us filling the ranks of the majors over the next decade and beyond.
a. You didn't mention how many hours the military guys had PIC wise. Military flight commitments (at least for the USAF) have gone up from 6 years when I was in to about 9. So guys will have more PIC than before.
b. With all this war going on and other troubles for the past decade, the military guys fly more than ever, including the fighter jocks, so they are more competitive than before.
c. Not flame bait, but its hard flying downtown Iraq with AAA coming at you and converting that to 121 time. NOBODY in the military gets 121 time so your comment that you are the cat's meow because of 1400PIC 121 time and major carrier doesn't hold much water.
d. Just because half of your type class was military and they all got interviews is simple statistics and coincidence. Could be the pool has a boatload of civies with types already, so your comparison doesn't mean much. The hiring numbers show lots of civilians.
Good luck, but get a better attitude. If it makes you feel better, the military is a lot smaller than it used to be, so there will be fewer of us filling the ranks of the majors over the next decade and beyond.
Phaedrus
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- Joined
- Mar 17, 2005
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- 932
TV9...whoa. The HR Dept must not have had that "military only" memo when I interviewed there a short while back. 2 out of 12 were hired from my group: 1 civ and 1 mil. I had my type, well over the PIC requirement, lots of good recs, blah, blah, blah and still got the .37 cent kick in the jimmies.
....what kelbill said.
....what kelbill said.
Whiskerbizkit
Inside her \|/
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- Sep 9, 2004
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- 373
Kelbill
When SWA starts going downtown Bagdad with a few MK83's slung under the wing let me know. I know military make good airline pilots, I also know civ's do as well. Its what I do now. Into the same airports, operating under the same 121 rules, etc.
Funny, looking at your profile, have you gone downtown in the 141 or the King Aire? The 141 took me to plenty of places as a Marine grunt, but it usually took an additional C130 or helo ride to get me to where the action was.
When SWA starts going downtown Bagdad with a few MK83's slung under the wing let me know. I know military make good airline pilots, I also know civ's do as well. Its what I do now. Into the same airports, operating under the same 121 rules, etc.
Funny, looking at your profile, have you gone downtown in the 141 or the King Aire? The 141 took me to plenty of places as a Marine grunt, but it usually took an additional C130 or helo ride to get me to where the action was.
Good Grief you knuckleheads, get a grip.
1. I never said "I" went downtown Iraq bombing the hell out of anyone. What I said and/or implied was that THE MILITARY DON'T FLY NO 121 OPS, SO IF YOU EXPECT THAT ON MILITARY RESUMES YOU ARE AN IDIOT.
2. That also goes for the statement implying I thought dropping bombs being better or as good as flying 121. According to your implication, NO MILITARY PILOT should ever fly at SWA unless going through another 121 op first. WE DON'T FLY 121 IN THE MILITARY, BUT WE DO FLY LOTS OF PLACES, UPSIDE DOWN, IN FORMATION, LOW LEVEL, AND YOU KNOW WHAT, TAXI AND APPROACH ISSUES AT THE LANDING FIELD ARE THE LEAST OF OUR CONCERNS. I'VE BEEN TO LAX A HUNDRED TIMES OR MORE NOW. I'M BETTER THAN A NEW GUY GOING THERE, BUT NOT 100 TIMES BETTER.
3. Did I bad mouth civilians even remotely? No, but here you guys come after me and my homies.
4. My Marine friend, thanks for serving, but you must have flown choppers or rented planes at the aero club to get where you are. Good for you, it shows determination. I did drop off some of you guys in Mogadishu, Somalia, so when American Eagle or Comair do that, let me know. When you fly approaches wearing a chem mask, let me know. When you fly cross cockpit in a '50s era T37, in the WX, taking off with min fuel to begin with, let me know. We all have our challenges don't we?
Damn, fellas, I hope everyone who is a good dude gets hired, but listening to the whining here, I think the DB is doing a good job. Hang in there, build your time, and quit pissing people off, even anonymously.
1. I never said "I" went downtown Iraq bombing the hell out of anyone. What I said and/or implied was that THE MILITARY DON'T FLY NO 121 OPS, SO IF YOU EXPECT THAT ON MILITARY RESUMES YOU ARE AN IDIOT.
2. That also goes for the statement implying I thought dropping bombs being better or as good as flying 121. According to your implication, NO MILITARY PILOT should ever fly at SWA unless going through another 121 op first. WE DON'T FLY 121 IN THE MILITARY, BUT WE DO FLY LOTS OF PLACES, UPSIDE DOWN, IN FORMATION, LOW LEVEL, AND YOU KNOW WHAT, TAXI AND APPROACH ISSUES AT THE LANDING FIELD ARE THE LEAST OF OUR CONCERNS. I'VE BEEN TO LAX A HUNDRED TIMES OR MORE NOW. I'M BETTER THAN A NEW GUY GOING THERE, BUT NOT 100 TIMES BETTER.
3. Did I bad mouth civilians even remotely? No, but here you guys come after me and my homies.
4. My Marine friend, thanks for serving, but you must have flown choppers or rented planes at the aero club to get where you are. Good for you, it shows determination. I did drop off some of you guys in Mogadishu, Somalia, so when American Eagle or Comair do that, let me know. When you fly approaches wearing a chem mask, let me know. When you fly cross cockpit in a '50s era T37, in the WX, taking off with min fuel to begin with, let me know. We all have our challenges don't we?
Damn, fellas, I hope everyone who is a good dude gets hired, but listening to the whining here, I think the DB is doing a good job. Hang in there, build your time, and quit pissing people off, even anonymously.
Easy guys,
I guess I can understand all the hostility going around, but, Let's not do this "Civ. versus Mil." thing any more. We all know pros and cons of both backgrounds. I personally have 3 types and 1800 pic 121 (and waiting since 08-04.)
With approx. 10,000 apps on file, SWA has the luxury of picking who they want to interview, and from what I understand, only 1 or 2 out of 5 are getting hired. My take is ...bottom line...even if you get the interview (CIV or MIL).... THEY HAVE TO LIKE YOU. If you don't give a good impression, you probably will not get the offer. My two cents....fire away.
I guess I can understand all the hostility going around, but, Let's not do this "Civ. versus Mil." thing any more. We all know pros and cons of both backgrounds. I personally have 3 types and 1800 pic 121 (and waiting since 08-04.)
With approx. 10,000 apps on file, SWA has the luxury of picking who they want to interview, and from what I understand, only 1 or 2 out of 5 are getting hired. My take is ...bottom line...even if you get the interview (CIV or MIL).... THEY HAVE TO LIKE YOU. If you don't give a good impression, you probably will not get the offer. My two cents....fire away.
Wesb737fo,
the voice of reason. Can't we all just get along? This is one tough market, and so tensions are high. I paid my $7500 or so for the type, and would have been damned pissed if I wasn't hired. I was hired, thank GOD, but a bunch of my military buds weren't, so you have to keep plugging away, ask your buds what might have turned the interviewer off, do some practice interviews with family and/or a pro, keep building hours, and try again next year (or two, whatever the rule). I believe the interview practice is a requirement for guys that are fairly shy or obnoxious. If you are what others consider a good people person, you can probably shoot the breeze with anyone. If not, that often shows, but can be improved upon. I'm not saying I'm Don Juan, but I do like yucking it up with my buds. Good luck to all.
the voice of reason. Can't we all just get along? This is one tough market, and so tensions are high. I paid my $7500 or so for the type, and would have been damned pissed if I wasn't hired. I was hired, thank GOD, but a bunch of my military buds weren't, so you have to keep plugging away, ask your buds what might have turned the interviewer off, do some practice interviews with family and/or a pro, keep building hours, and try again next year (or two, whatever the rule). I believe the interview practice is a requirement for guys that are fairly shy or obnoxious. If you are what others consider a good people person, you can probably shoot the breeze with anyone. If not, that often shows, but can be improved upon. I'm not saying I'm Don Juan, but I do like yucking it up with my buds. Good luck to all.
jimEJet
Well-known member
- Joined
- Apr 17, 2002
- Posts
- 90
Wow
We all need to chill!
The reality is the civil aviation market blows a$$.
Look around, United guys are getting paid $129 an hour to fly Airbuses.
Northwest, Delta, and just around everyone else will be filing for bankruptcy protection before October.
The management at those that don't will be asking for even more concessions (including SWA, in my humble opinion come next year)!
If you're in the market to get a job at SWA do some self-evaluation before you go to your interview. Get rid of the "I should and I earned and I paid $7500 crap." I have had several acquaintances call me up out of the blue for a recommendation to SWA. I am happy to oblige anyone whom I have flown with or have had a professional relationship with, however.
Based on all the complaining of guys who have not had an opportunity to interview, you would have expected anyone who gets an interview to be pumped up and willing to jump through all kinds of hoops to pass the interview process. Guess what! A good deal of our brethren are still under the assumption that when they get the minimums or competitive minimums for the interview the work is over.
Wake up call dudes and dudettes!! It's just the beginning. I am shocked by the apathy and lack of motivation of the people that call me. I ask them simple questions about their background before I offer them a recommendation. Just for C Y A purposes. I ask the simple questions like...
Is there anything in your background that SWA will find about that I need to know before I recommend you?
Have you ever busted a type ride and any rating check?
Do you have any DUI's?
Any criminal issues from your past?
Have you considered any interview prep?
Would you be willing to go get a type before you interview?
Well, guess what boys and girls...
A good deal of these people are wasting slots for interviews.
They are grossly unprepared. A good deal of them has not even done a background check on themselves. IF they have an issue, they do not have any clue how to turn it into a learning event during the interview.
You guys need to get prepared before you call your buds for a recommendation. Do some soul searching. Address the problem areas, no matter what they may be. And get some damned motivation. Go get interview prep, not that Cheryl Cage crap. Get some real interview prep.
Everyone has an issue in their past they need to address. Don't try to hide it because they will find out. And if you do not come clean to the person recommending you they cannot help you. And if you omit something on the app and SWA finds out, good luck on getting hired.
I may seem a little harsh guys, however. I had about fifteen people, mostly ATA guys, call me for a rec.
I asked all the guys the above questions and some had issues, one lied. But most did not have any clue how to address problem areas. Some could not even tell a basic resume format of their past in a chronological manner that flowed to me. Let alone a competitive interview.
I suggested to all to go get an interview prep from a person I highly recommended for a mere $150. Out of 15 guess how many took me up on my offer? 4 Guess how many out of the eleven that did not take my advice got hired. 0 Guess how many out of the 4 got hired? 3
Still not sure why he did not get hired but I know he will next time around.
My point is... Quit b1tching about not getting interviewed. Start preparing and do everything you can to be competitive.
As for military vs civilian:
The civilian guys simply do not interview as well as the military guys. Military guys are always going before a review board of sorts. They have been doing interview type presentations for their entire military careers.
Civilian boys and girls get interview prep!!
IF you are serious and want one of the best guys out their, PM me and I'll give you his name and number.
Good luck and ONLY POSITIVE ENERGY
J
We all need to chill!
The reality is the civil aviation market blows a$$.
Look around, United guys are getting paid $129 an hour to fly Airbuses.
Northwest, Delta, and just around everyone else will be filing for bankruptcy protection before October.
The management at those that don't will be asking for even more concessions (including SWA, in my humble opinion come next year)!
If you're in the market to get a job at SWA do some self-evaluation before you go to your interview. Get rid of the "I should and I earned and I paid $7500 crap." I have had several acquaintances call me up out of the blue for a recommendation to SWA. I am happy to oblige anyone whom I have flown with or have had a professional relationship with, however.
Based on all the complaining of guys who have not had an opportunity to interview, you would have expected anyone who gets an interview to be pumped up and willing to jump through all kinds of hoops to pass the interview process. Guess what! A good deal of our brethren are still under the assumption that when they get the minimums or competitive minimums for the interview the work is over.
Wake up call dudes and dudettes!! It's just the beginning. I am shocked by the apathy and lack of motivation of the people that call me. I ask them simple questions about their background before I offer them a recommendation. Just for C Y A purposes. I ask the simple questions like...
Is there anything in your background that SWA will find about that I need to know before I recommend you?
Have you ever busted a type ride and any rating check?
Do you have any DUI's?
Any criminal issues from your past?
Have you considered any interview prep?
Would you be willing to go get a type before you interview?
Well, guess what boys and girls...
A good deal of these people are wasting slots for interviews.
They are grossly unprepared. A good deal of them has not even done a background check on themselves. IF they have an issue, they do not have any clue how to turn it into a learning event during the interview.
You guys need to get prepared before you call your buds for a recommendation. Do some soul searching. Address the problem areas, no matter what they may be. And get some damned motivation. Go get interview prep, not that Cheryl Cage crap. Get some real interview prep.
Everyone has an issue in their past they need to address. Don't try to hide it because they will find out. And if you do not come clean to the person recommending you they cannot help you. And if you omit something on the app and SWA finds out, good luck on getting hired.
I may seem a little harsh guys, however. I had about fifteen people, mostly ATA guys, call me for a rec.
I asked all the guys the above questions and some had issues, one lied. But most did not have any clue how to address problem areas. Some could not even tell a basic resume format of their past in a chronological manner that flowed to me. Let alone a competitive interview.
I suggested to all to go get an interview prep from a person I highly recommended for a mere $150. Out of 15 guess how many took me up on my offer? 4 Guess how many out of the eleven that did not take my advice got hired. 0 Guess how many out of the 4 got hired? 3
Still not sure why he did not get hired but I know he will next time around.
My point is... Quit b1tching about not getting interviewed. Start preparing and do everything you can to be competitive.
As for military vs civilian:
The civilian guys simply do not interview as well as the military guys. Military guys are always going before a review board of sorts. They have been doing interview type presentations for their entire military careers.
Civilian boys and girls get interview prep!!
IF you are serious and want one of the best guys out their, PM me and I'll give you his name and number.
Good luck and ONLY POSITIVE ENERGY
J
Whoa, easy there tiger.
I simply tire of posts telling me about going downtown. I've been downtown before thank you.
"YOU ARE AN IDIOT"
Disagree without being disagreeable.
"Did I bad mouth civilians even remotely?"
You inferred it in bullet number four of your retort.
"I did drop off some of you guys in Mogadishu, Somalia, so when American Eagle or Comair do that, let me know"
I arrived in Mog in a C5 based in Dover I believe. I left there in civilian 747. The FE and Capt. came from a civil background, I asked. I asked simply looking for motivation for the course I was taking. I only now wish I had asked if they had come from Eagle or Comair.
Anyway, I've made my point. I yield the floor to you.
I simply tire of posts telling me about going downtown. I've been downtown before thank you.
"YOU ARE AN IDIOT"
Disagree without being disagreeable.
"Did I bad mouth civilians even remotely?"
You inferred it in bullet number four of your retort.
"I did drop off some of you guys in Mogadishu, Somalia, so when American Eagle or Comair do that, let me know"
I arrived in Mog in a C5 based in Dover I believe. I left there in civilian 747. The FE and Capt. came from a civil background, I asked. I asked simply looking for motivation for the course I was taking. I only now wish I had asked if they had come from Eagle or Comair.
Anyway, I've made my point. I yield the floor to you.
Russ,
You got me, somewhat. I actually expected the 747 example to show up after I submitted. Southern Air guys have some great stories too. Mogadishu is just one example, and whereas .1% of 747 civilian guys went, everyone in the military was eligible. Funny how you left in a 747 but arrived in a C5. Isn't that kind of like the Marines? You guys storm the beaches, then the Army comes in when you leave. That was a compliment, as my Dad was a Marine way back when. Sorry Army guys, don't want to offend you either. I've been to a few other places I never saw charter planes at, as they weren't allowed, let alone other airfields in Somalia as well. I'd have to kill you if I told you, but being you are a former Marine, I don't like the odds.
My fourth bullet was directed at you, not the rest, as it was you who questioned my background, which is posted, and hence my point. And my Eagle/Comair reference was just that, a reference, not a slam.
I probably shouldn't have used "idiot" in my statement, but then again, the implication was that military guys with no 121 time were getting hired over civilians with it. Come on now, even Rainman knows we don't fly 121, and never will, so the apples and oranges resumes won't line up quite the same.
Good luck.
You got me, somewhat. I actually expected the 747 example to show up after I submitted. Southern Air guys have some great stories too. Mogadishu is just one example, and whereas .1% of 747 civilian guys went, everyone in the military was eligible. Funny how you left in a 747 but arrived in a C5. Isn't that kind of like the Marines? You guys storm the beaches, then the Army comes in when you leave. That was a compliment, as my Dad was a Marine way back when. Sorry Army guys, don't want to offend you either. I've been to a few other places I never saw charter planes at, as they weren't allowed, let alone other airfields in Somalia as well. I'd have to kill you if I told you, but being you are a former Marine, I don't like the odds.
My fourth bullet was directed at you, not the rest, as it was you who questioned my background, which is posted, and hence my point. And my Eagle/Comair reference was just that, a reference, not a slam.
I probably shouldn't have used "idiot" in my statement, but then again, the implication was that military guys with no 121 time were getting hired over civilians with it. Come on now, even Rainman knows we don't fly 121, and never will, so the apples and oranges resumes won't line up quite the same.
Good luck.
All this interview discussion may be a moot point since I am sitting around on reserve with nothing to do and a fly me first preference in my display. I sat 4 days last week as the #1 guy to go out yet didn't get the call. We are fat on pilots after the loss of MSY and the strike at Boeing which has slowed deliveries. I have friends who are finishing their new hire checkrides this week and they were told they may be the last class this year. I hope this is wrong...
Mach Zero,
I think and hope it is wrong. We have seven deliveries to go this year or so I think. Boeing's strike, combined with MSY slowdown, could make it a wash, as we might not need all 7, but I think we will take them and put them to good use elsewhere. MSY is not our powerhouse station, so I don't expect it to ruin things for us. With retirements and even a little continued growth, you and your buds will be getting all the flying you want. Rule #1 to remember from guys just out of training is not to believe anything they were told. Seems to change weekly, like the yearly new domicile discussion.
I think and hope it is wrong. We have seven deliveries to go this year or so I think. Boeing's strike, combined with MSY slowdown, could make it a wash, as we might not need all 7, but I think we will take them and put them to good use elsewhere. MSY is not our powerhouse station, so I don't expect it to ruin things for us. With retirements and even a little continued growth, you and your buds will be getting all the flying you want. Rule #1 to remember from guys just out of training is not to believe anything they were told. Seems to change weekly, like the yearly new domicile discussion.
BYUFlyr
Well-known member
- Joined
- Aug 18, 2004
- Posts
- 106
kelbill said:
Wow!!! I was with you until you insulted one of MY homies!!! What's wrong with being a grunt, serving your country with mud in your face and then pursuing a career in aviation? Am I supposed to be ashamed because I chose to pack a seabag instead of a samsonite bag?
What do you have against my Marines? Do we not have a right to an aviation career just like you? Are my aero club hours not worthy to occupy the same industry as your military hours?
'72Gremlin
Well-known member
- Joined
- Nov 1, 2003
- Posts
- 179
Children! Don't make me pull over this....
Too late. This civilian vs military thing is SO old (the Marine aspect of it is a little more fresh).
A friend of mine just got back from a humanitarian/disaster relief mission into/out of New Orleans yesterday. He said it was like going into a third world country with no power and the runway lights on emergency power, barely visible. They were the only military flight going in at the time. However, when the sun came up, the military wasn't the only ones flying in and out of New Orleans. He saw jetBlue, America West, Southwest and other commercial airlines fly into that airport... not for revenue flights, but for disaster relief and emergency evacuation.
My point is: WE ARE ALL IN THIS TOGETHER.
This whole, "you gotta be military to get hired by SWA," is as old as the mil vs civ thing and a crock. I have 3 close military friends who spent the 7 grand on the type and didn't get hired this past year. Maybe mil guys have an advantage over civilian guys at a SWA interview... who knows? I, for one, haven't asked LL or RK if that is the case (but at least I have their numbers now, in case I get really bold).
I hope everyone gets what they want (and deserve). It's just frustrating to see this same old argument go around in circles and watch ourselves pit ourselves against each other. Good luck to you all...
Everyone back in the van...
Too late. This civilian vs military thing is SO old (the Marine aspect of it is a little more fresh).
A friend of mine just got back from a humanitarian/disaster relief mission into/out of New Orleans yesterday. He said it was like going into a third world country with no power and the runway lights on emergency power, barely visible. They were the only military flight going in at the time. However, when the sun came up, the military wasn't the only ones flying in and out of New Orleans. He saw jetBlue, America West, Southwest and other commercial airlines fly into that airport... not for revenue flights, but for disaster relief and emergency evacuation.
My point is: WE ARE ALL IN THIS TOGETHER.
This whole, "you gotta be military to get hired by SWA," is as old as the mil vs civ thing and a crock. I have 3 close military friends who spent the 7 grand on the type and didn't get hired this past year. Maybe mil guys have an advantage over civilian guys at a SWA interview... who knows? I, for one, haven't asked LL or RK if that is the case (but at least I have their numbers now, in case I get really bold).
I hope everyone gets what they want (and deserve). It's just frustrating to see this same old argument go around in circles and watch ourselves pit ourselves against each other. Good luck to you all...
Everyone back in the van...
ChinaClipper
Well-known member
- Joined
- Jul 4, 2002
- Posts
- 460
SWAPoolie
Well-known member
- Joined
- Apr 14, 2005
- Posts
- 101
Out of my interview group 3 out of 12 were hired and none were military. About 75% of that group were military. Out of my new hire class of 20 about 50% were military.
There is no favoritism on either side. Seems like the numbers game is over when you start the interview. Everyone who gets to the interview most likely is a good pilot. After that they just want to know if you are a SWA type of pilot. Whatever that is only they know.
There is no favoritism on either side. Seems like the numbers game is over when you start the interview. Everyone who gets to the interview most likely is a good pilot. After that they just want to know if you are a SWA type of pilot. Whatever that is only they know.
sf260pilot
Well-known member
- Joined
- Mar 6, 2003
- Posts
- 150
FR8mastr
Well-known member
- Joined
- Mar 4, 2002
- Posts
- 803
I have a question about the prep courses. WHY? I am not asking why pilots would do it, I am asking why would the airlines want it. What you get at the interview is a pilot who is very skilled at BSing his or her way into a job. You take the course so that you can give the answers and act a certain way that the airline is percieved to want. And according the the above posters 3 out of 4 record it works. So my reasoning is, would the airlines not want to see the real person, not the one who has been trained to behave in a certain way. Not flame bait, just very interested in why.
intel33
Well-known member
- Joined
- Jan 28, 2002
- Posts
- 46
As long as everyone is talking about time conversion, let me throw this out there:
You know what the helicopter conversion factor is?
0
Helicopter pilots don't do the same kind of flying as either civilian or military fixed wing, but ask any f/w guy whose gone for a ride in a helo and he will say "WOW".
Helicopters may not fly mach (although most of the twins will move with a purpose), but there is usually a lot going on and most helo guys have great situational awareness. Strap on a set of goggles, sling a load underneath or set down some where with about five or ten feet of clearance. Helo guys earn their keep, but rarely get credit for it. And, oh yeah, we can fly instruments, too.
There are a few Marines and Army guys out there. I know most of the Army guys go fractional. Maybe because there are more that have gone there before and recognize the experience that goes with the rating.
Having been in the civilian sector, I must say that there are indeed some great civilian pilots and I had to deal with a number of no personality and incapable military pilots as well. Everyone has to accept that different folks start off in different places, but doesn't mean that they shouldn't end up in the same place.
I have had an application WITH a type rating in for 3 and a half years.
I don't even bother with rotor time anymore (my profile includes the rating, but not the time), because while I enjoyed doing it, it might as well not have existed. At least I have a few stories I can convey if I ever get to an interview. My short helo career saw much more action and excitement than a VERY benign fixed wing career. (Two Air Medals flying Medevac in Mogadishu.) Benign is good, but not much to talk about in an interview!
You know what the helicopter conversion factor is?
0
Helicopter pilots don't do the same kind of flying as either civilian or military fixed wing, but ask any f/w guy whose gone for a ride in a helo and he will say "WOW".
Helicopters may not fly mach (although most of the twins will move with a purpose), but there is usually a lot going on and most helo guys have great situational awareness. Strap on a set of goggles, sling a load underneath or set down some where with about five or ten feet of clearance. Helo guys earn their keep, but rarely get credit for it. And, oh yeah, we can fly instruments, too.
There are a few Marines and Army guys out there. I know most of the Army guys go fractional. Maybe because there are more that have gone there before and recognize the experience that goes with the rating.
Having been in the civilian sector, I must say that there are indeed some great civilian pilots and I had to deal with a number of no personality and incapable military pilots as well. Everyone has to accept that different folks start off in different places, but doesn't mean that they shouldn't end up in the same place.
I have had an application WITH a type rating in for 3 and a half years.
I don't even bother with rotor time anymore (my profile includes the rating, but not the time), because while I enjoyed doing it, it might as well not have existed. At least I have a few stories I can convey if I ever get to an interview. My short helo career saw much more action and excitement than a VERY benign fixed wing career. (Two Air Medals flying Medevac in Mogadishu.) Benign is good, but not much to talk about in an interview!
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BYUFlyr,
damn fellas, you be readin stuff between the lines that ain't there. All my homies are in the military, not just the USAF. My comment to Russ was for him doggin me about implying I went downtown Baghdad which I never said, all I was doing was defending the military side of the hiring equation. Nothing wrong with toting a seapack, my Pappi was a jarhead enlisted troop. I think I can say that being the son of one. I put two and two together regarding his background, seeing I didn't notice any military jets under his name, so figured he took another route. His comments were not meant to compliment the military, shall we say, because now we are simply competition I assume.
"When SWA starts going downtown Bagdad with a few MK83's slung under the wing let me know."
Sounds like a military slam to me, and from a military guy to boot. You guys are too sensitive. Do whatever you need to do to get the job you want, but remember, I didn't start this thread whining about the civies taking jobs away from my buds who interviewed and didn't get hired. Seems like it was the other way around.
damn fellas, you be readin stuff between the lines that ain't there. All my homies are in the military, not just the USAF. My comment to Russ was for him doggin me about implying I went downtown Baghdad which I never said, all I was doing was defending the military side of the hiring equation. Nothing wrong with toting a seapack, my Pappi was a jarhead enlisted troop. I think I can say that being the son of one. I put two and two together regarding his background, seeing I didn't notice any military jets under his name, so figured he took another route. His comments were not meant to compliment the military, shall we say, because now we are simply competition I assume.
"When SWA starts going downtown Bagdad with a few MK83's slung under the wing let me know."
Sounds like a military slam to me, and from a military guy to boot. You guys are too sensitive. Do whatever you need to do to get the job you want, but remember, I didn't start this thread whining about the civies taking jobs away from my buds who interviewed and didn't get hired. Seems like it was the other way around.
intell33,
my best ride in the military, bar none, was in a MH-53 at Osan AB Korea. Bought the guys a case of beer the next day. Took off at dusk, flew to the coastal plains and landed next to a MH60 (we had NVGs in the back with the ramp down), then off again for some SAR practice, night repelling simulation over a building, hot refueling, and more low level. I loved it and was impressed as hell. I don't go tooting my own horn about my military flying unless it is questioned, and I don't have much to toot about in front of guys like you, but then again, I wouldn't expect to be getting grief from a comrade. Unfortunately there is usually no conversion factor for rotary, although there should be something. Good luck. I've flown with 3 ex-nam helo guys (one later became the first 2Lt F15 pilot) and they were good dudes. That F15 guy apparently had more medals than Saddam Hussein.
FR8mastr,
I think you are missing the point regarding the prep classes/training, at least from what I got out of them. All they really do is help put you at ease during the interview so you can be yourself. Sometimes I like to give PAs standing up in the galley when on the ground for a delay or just a welcome, because the more you do it, the more comfortable you get. Thats it from my standpoint. I learned little if anything about canned answers. All I got was the ability to take a deep breath and shoot the bull a little without seeming too dull or shy. Remember, they want to pick people they figure they can converse with on those long hauls, not some wet blanket. Human nature. Your technical qualifications got you to the interview, so if you feel comfortable being yourself at an interview, you are set.
my best ride in the military, bar none, was in a MH-53 at Osan AB Korea. Bought the guys a case of beer the next day. Took off at dusk, flew to the coastal plains and landed next to a MH60 (we had NVGs in the back with the ramp down), then off again for some SAR practice, night repelling simulation over a building, hot refueling, and more low level. I loved it and was impressed as hell. I don't go tooting my own horn about my military flying unless it is questioned, and I don't have much to toot about in front of guys like you, but then again, I wouldn't expect to be getting grief from a comrade. Unfortunately there is usually no conversion factor for rotary, although there should be something. Good luck. I've flown with 3 ex-nam helo guys (one later became the first 2Lt F15 pilot) and they were good dudes. That F15 guy apparently had more medals than Saddam Hussein.
FR8mastr,
I think you are missing the point regarding the prep classes/training, at least from what I got out of them. All they really do is help put you at ease during the interview so you can be yourself. Sometimes I like to give PAs standing up in the galley when on the ground for a delay or just a welcome, because the more you do it, the more comfortable you get. Thats it from my standpoint. I learned little if anything about canned answers. All I got was the ability to take a deep breath and shoot the bull a little without seeming too dull or shy. Remember, they want to pick people they figure they can converse with on those long hauls, not some wet blanket. Human nature. Your technical qualifications got you to the interview, so if you feel comfortable being yourself at an interview, you are set.
Shooter38
Well-known member
- Joined
- Feb 5, 2002
- Posts
- 60
I can't believe I'm getting drawn into this, but....
Having closely watched the hiring process since 2001, and particularly watching new hire classes, it is almost exactly 50/50 military/civilian mix. This is not to mention the almost perfect spread of ages 30-50 (+-2). The HR dept has their model of what works and follows it to a T.
Good luck to all....it's a great company!
Having closely watched the hiring process since 2001, and particularly watching new hire classes, it is almost exactly 50/50 military/civilian mix. This is not to mention the almost perfect spread of ages 30-50 (+-2). The HR dept has their model of what works and follows it to a T.
Good luck to all....it's a great company!
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