United Takes Action to Protect Customers

[SennaP1]

Google "democrat". THAT scares the hell out of me.

Gup

How about we stop Googling everything.

Is Google making us dumb?

 

[waveflyer]

It'll be interesting to see what their excuse is when the Dems throw the RLA back in their face...

it's just as ....(cough cough) "interesting" .... watching you guys hold on to the party lines when we've all seen and felt what the Republicans have done to our career.

 

[Fubijaakr]

Listen, its not a coincidence that the McCain Campaign uses a non-Union Airbus operator for the campaign plane, "Straight Talk Express."

The message isn't even subliminal.

 

[FlyingSig]

Didn't Anderson scare Delta ALPA back into the basement when they did something similar?

Nope.

Leo sued 49 pilots back during contract 2000 and won. Now there's a disclaimer every time you sign into the ALPA board you have to click through.

 

[Draginass]

Listen, its not a coincidence that the McCain Campaign uses a non-Union Airbus operator for the campaign plane, "Straight Talk Express."

The message isn't even subliminal.

Here's an article about the campaign 737 from end of June. BTW, I support neither candidate.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/06/29/us/politics/29plane.html?ref=politics

 

[Hvy]

Obama would cut taxes for 95% of Americans, including you.

PCL,

I have some waterfront land in Florida...Cheap. Would you be interested?

 

[Poahi]

The last post that was on topic was 23 posts ago. Somethings about United protecting its passengers from pilots.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Rez,

What is ALPA's plan if Obama is elected along with a Dem controlled House & Senate in terms of passing legislation that would drastically modify or even eliminate the RLA?

They DO have a plan, right?? This 2 yr window is crucial to have a chance to pass legislation.

Does the RLA need to be modify? Or just interpreted favorably?

 

[CopilotDoug]

it's just as ....(cough cough) "interesting" .... watching you guys hold on to the party lines when we've all seen and felt what the Republicans have done to our career.

Are you assuming that I'm voting for McCain?

 

[Rough67]

http://www.911dude.com/jesseventura.jpg

 

[PCL_128]

Does the RLA need to be modify? Or just interpreted favorably?

Modified. Favorable interpretations only last as long as you've got a labor-friendly administration. More stringent language would last no matter who's in office.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Modified. Favorable interpretations only last as long as you've got a labor-friendly administration. More stringent language would last no matter who's in office.

what do we need to change and what can we realistically change?

 

[SoCentralRain]

The last post that was on topic was 23 posts ago. Somethings about United protecting its passengers from pilots.

::sigh:: Yeah, pretty much.

I wish those on this thread that would like to discuss and debate the Dem vs. Rep crap would take it to the "non-aviation topics" forum.

This thread is about UAL and how they are absolutely ruthless in fcuking over all of the employees of a once-great airline. Sadly, they decided to pick on the pilots first.

Everyone on this board should be furious about this. If you don't think it could happen with your airline, you're way, way wrong.

SCR

 

[waveflyer]

Are you assuming that I'm voting for McCain?

No.

But the reasons most conservatives don't like mccain are not reasons that will support our career. Mccain's view on unions are one aspect where he actually is in line w/ the Republican party.

 

[saabservant]

REZ:

How about a change to non-political appointees to the NMB?

A national seniority list, which would allow you to retain seniority when leaving a job, and to take only openings where they occur...

A change to the RLA, which enslaves us, or a new code to operate under...

A new, invigorated, courageous alpa leadership, willing to engage in civil disobedience. Willing to actually take a risk to fight for this profession. Willing to lock the lawyers up in a closet....for only 30 minutes....

You have no idea how unified this nations pilots could become, with only a little leadership...

some of these things may be attainable with a democratic admin., or maybe not.

A vote for McCain is a looming disaster for U.S. airline pilots... and if anyone thinks McCain is better at defence or security, look at Bush and his crew- all the stellar resumes, and they still fu**** up Iraqistan....

 

[timmay]

what do we need to change and what can we realistically change?

That is the reason I am so happy to be saving my 2% that I was giving alpa. Every time the regional I worked for violated the contract I would go bitch to the union reps and that was there response "well we can't do anything about that until the next contract". It made me sickuke:

 

[Superpilot92]

Listen, its not a coincidence that the McCain Campaign uses a non-Union Airbus operator for the campaign plane, "Straight Talk Express."

The message isn't even subliminal.

McCain doesnt fly in an airbus. He now flies in a 737-400 it was parked in DTW not long ago. we flew right over it. Its white and blue with a gold stripe and says Mcain in big letters on the side. FWIW

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/06/29/us/politics/29plane.html?_r=1&oref=slogin

 

[Captzaahlie]

The last post that was on topic was 23 posts ago. Somethings about United protecting its passengers from pilots.

let em go they are on a roll.........

 

[Captzaahlie]

That is the reason I am so happy to be saving my 2% that I was giving alpa. Every time the regional I worked for violated the contract I would go bitch to the union reps and that was there response "well we can't do anything about that until the next contract". It made me sickuke:

Regionals never pumped enough money into alpa to get any satisfaction. Especially when they fell in the shadows of being wholly boned, I mean owned by a legacy.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

REZ:

How about a change to non-political appointees to the NMB?

How would the selection process occur?

The other way is vote in a pro pilot pro labor POTUS.

A national seniority list, which would allow you to retain seniority when leaving a job, and to take only openings where they occur...

A NSL in my opinion is good for regressive times like the last seven years but bad in growth times...

Plus what about pay? Why would management pay 10 year pay for a new hire?

A change to the RLA, which enslaves us, or a new code to operate under...

It is all about negotiations.. what are we willing to give up...

A new, invigorated, courageous alpa leadership, willing to engage in civil disobedience. Willing to actually take a risk to fight for this profession. Willing to lock the lawyers up in a closet....for only 30 minutes....

Not sure the public is ready for civil disobedience... it didn't work for PATCO and the APA...

UAL is already suing the Marvin Mainliners.... a pre-emptive strike on labor before Bush goes away??

You have no idea how unified this nations pilots could become, with only a little leadership...

I do and I agree.. it seems though that we put our hopes for a better career solely on the the ALPA president.

What if the ALPA prez isn't effective. What if for the next election, there are no real leaders running?

The ALPA Prez is THE leader but we are leaders too.

Problem is... if 20,000+ Air Line Pilots march the DC mall, the union leaders would not have to say anything. They could just look at the WH and CapHill and say... We the leaders of APA, IPA, NAP, ALPA are in control...

But too many pilots function as independents. Too many pilots will not show up to LEC meetings, to vote, to demonstrations because they have their pet issues, like 401k dues, Age 65, or whatever... that is not leadership...

some of these things may be attainable with a democratic admin., or maybe not.

A pro pilot/pro labor Admin is just one piece of the puzzle. There are no silver bullets...

A vote for McCain is a looming disaster for U.S. airline pilots... and if anyone thinks McCain is better at defence or security, look at Bush and his crew- all the stellar resumes, and they still fu**** up Iraqistan....

The RLA is just a part of the puzzle.. we don't need a re-write but changes are in order... keep in mind though that changes to the RLA in labors favor is going to be met with harsh resistance.. from gov't, consumer groups and most of all the Corporati's...

gov't, consumers and Corporati's have more money and numbers than a couple of 100,000 union workers...


There is no quick solution... but check out these quotes from Vince Lombardi...

People who work together will win, whether it be against complex football defenses, or the problems of modern society.

The achievements of an organization are the results of the combined effort of each individual.

A big problem is too many pilots don't want to do any work or effort to their career success, but they want the rewards....

What has never been done before in ALPA is pilots taking a leadership role themselves... no clear answers...

but as we demand that the RLA change, that elected leaders change, that gov't change and CEO's change... we never think much about changing ourselves...

 

[Captzaahlie]

How would the selection process occur?

The other way is vote in a pro pilot pro labor POTUS.



A NSL in my opinion is good for regressive times like the last seven years but bad in growth times...

Plus what about pay? Why would management pay 10 year pay for a new hire?



It is all about negotiations.. what are we willing to give up...



Not sure the public is ready for civil disobedience... it didn't work for PATCO and the APA...

UAL is already suing the Marvin Mainliners.... a pre-emptive strike on labor before Bush goes away??



I do and I agree.. it seems though that we put our hopes for a better career solely on the the ALPA president.

What if the ALPA prez isn't effective. What if for the next election, there are no real leaders running?

The ALPA Prez is THE leader but we are leaders too.

Problem is... if 20,000+ Air Line Pilots march the DC mall, the union leaders would not have to say anything. They could just look at the WH and CapHill and say... We the leaders of APA, IPA, NAP, ALPA are in control...

But too many pilots function as independents. Too many pilots will not show up to LEC meetings, to vote, to demonstrations because they have their pet issues, like 401k dues, Age 65, or whatever... that is not leadership...





A pro pilot/pro labor Admin is just one piece of the puzzle. There are no silver bullets...



The RLA is just a part of the puzzle.. we don't need a re-write but changes are in order... keep in mind though that changes to the RLA in labors favor is going to be met with harsh resistance.. from gov't, consumer groups and most of all the Corporati's...

gov't, consumers and Corporati's have more money and numbers than a couple of 100,000 union workers...


There is no quick solution... but check out these quotes from Vince Lombardi...






A big problem is too many pilots don't want to do any work or effort to their career success, but they want the rewards....

What has never been done before in ALPA is pilots taking a leadership role themselves... no clear answers...

but as we demand that the RLA change, that elected leaders change, that gov't change and CEO's change... we never think much about changing ourselves...

Whens the march?
I'll be there!

 

[PCL_128]

what do we need to change and what can we realistically change?

I think most of the problems can be solved with one simple addition to the current law: time limits. The RLA needs to include specific time limits for each phase of the process. Limit direct negotiations to 6 months. If the parties can't come to an agreement by then, then the process automatically moves into the mediation stage, which lasts for another 6 months. If no agreement has been reached by then, then a cooling off period is automatic and not subject to the whims of the NMB overlords. Simple time limits will solve these problems.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Whens the march?
I'll be there!

FYI

There was a March in May of 06. Problem was.. only about 100 pilots showed up.. and they were mostly committee members and officers... IOW the Choir.

Only until individual pilots who stop thinking about themselves and more about the profession will we start to see change...

See you at the next one..

I think most of the problems can be solved with one simple addition to the current law: time limits. The RLA needs to include specific time limits for each phase of the process. Limit direct negotiations to 6 months. If the parties can't come to an agreement by then, then the process automatically moves into the mediation stage, which lasts for another 6 months. If no agreement has been reached by then, then a cooling off period is automatic and not subject to the whims of the NMB overlords. Simple time limits will solve these problems.

Agreed!

Why haven't we seen changes?

With PAC participation % consistently around less than 20% it might take time.. In addition the RALPs make it difficult...

Finally, management who loves the ability to keep the operation going loves their ability to stall... they will fight hard to keep it...

Nonetheless I think we should press the idea...

 

[T-Bags]

Oh dear....Funny thing, furloughs at UAL came about when OIL went to about $140 a barrel. It had NOTHING to do with a "crazy" pro bill of rights (IOW conservative) judge or a PEB by Bush. Lucky for us, the dems are looking out for us. when the evil rascally republicans tried to force a vote on drilling (you know, supply and demand.....) Fancy Nancy pants had the lights and cameras turned off. Way to go Nancy!! Save the planet, ************************* the pilots!! Of course she then spewed a few tons of carbon out the back of her private jet on the ride back home!

Not to be outdone, Sen "I'm a moderate" Salazar blocked all attempts in the senate to get a vote on drilling. A deal was even offered to have the "trigger point" for new drilling be $10 a gallon of gas. Salazar said that still wasn't high enough. Way to go Dems!! you really look out for labor!! We can sit around and read our great contracts....because we sure won't be working with fuel continuing to climb.

 

[PCL_128]

You're stuck in a fantasy world if you believe drilling for oil will solve our problems.

 

[T-Bags]

You're stuck in a fantasy world if you believe drilling for oil will solve our problems.

No offense, but if you have that much of a lack of understanding of supply and demand, you need to go back to high school...

This "drilling won't fix our problem" crap is the biggest bunch of BS ever perpetrated on our idiotic leftist voters. It's like saying a nice steak won't fix your hunger problem. It's pretty F'n simple. If the world will demand 80 million barrels a day @ $100 a barrel, then the price will be LOWER if 90 million barrels a day are put on the market. MUCH lower. Oh yeah, it's the speculators...

Do we need to work on alternatives? Absolutely. Seems to me the longer we can delay being forced to go to new technologies, the better those technologies will be. We have MORE oil in Colorado, Wyoming and Utah than all the middle east combined, yet we aren't allowed to bring it to market. We don't want to screw with the prebbles meadow jumping mouses habitat....it's OK for YOU to lose your habitat (ie your HOUSE), but not the rat. I still find it incomprehensible that you could be that stupid or that indoctrinated.

 

[CopilotDoug]

No.

But the reasons most conservatives don't like mccain are not reasons that will support our career. Mccain's view on unions are one aspect where he actually is in line w/ the Republican party.

I don't think either candidate would benefit our career. Big Business has the money, and that's what talks on Capitol Hill.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

I don't think either candidate would benefit our career. Big Business has the money, and that's what talks on Capitol Hill.

Aside from reading the paper... what do you know about "what talks on CapHill?"


Just asking...

 

[CopilotDoug]

Aside from reading the paper... what do you know about "what talks on CapHill?"


Just asking...

I know that ALPA is conitnually asking for donations to their PAC. Money must play an important role...