United outsourcing pilot jobs with codeshare

[Skippy]

at this rate-- we'll never get back---

maybe alpa can win one- but i highly doubt it-- it seems the company keeps exploiting the non negotiated "contract" and now the loopholes are presenting themselves-- woo ho0

they didnt even ask the furloughees if they wanted a job-- darnet


“The day after reporting one of its worst quarterly financial results in history and after furloughing an additional 254 pilots (bringing the total to 606 pilots), United Airlines announced today that it has entered into what it calls an “innovative” partnership with Aer Lingus.[/font]
[FONT='Arial', 'sans-serif'][/font]
[FONT='Arial', 'sans-serif']“Aer Lingus has advised the Irish press that this joint venture will operate an Aer Lingus aircraft with neither United nor Aer Lingus employees, under a separate operating certificate and under newly established wages and working conditions. Obviously, this partnership will be accomplished at the expense of United’s and Aer Lingus’ own pilots and other employees. This development, where United attempts to establish an airline operation without the use of United aircraft or employees, is nothing less than the outsourcing of jobs to an international company, and clearly demonstrates that this management continues to make business decisions without regard to its pilots and other employees. [/font]
[FONT='Arial', 'sans-serif'][/font]
[FONT='Arial', 'sans-serif']“The United pilots are exploring every option to put an end to the company’s blatant disregard and lack of loyalty to the United Airlines brand.” [/font][FONT='Arial', 'sans-serif'][/font]

ALPA: The Pilots Union​

 

[DrewBlows]

Very difficult to read. Do you have a link?

 

[MarineGrunt]

http://www.usatoday.com/travel/flights/2008-04-08-united-aer-lingus_N.htmhttp://aviationblog.dallasnews.com/archives/2009/01/ryanair-hissing-like-an-ex-wif.html

 

[Hamburger]

Here's a link:

http://aviationblog.dallasnews.com/archives/2009/01/ryanair-hissing-like-an-ex-wif.html

The statement is from the UAL MEC chairman. I cannot find where he got his information that there would be third party pilots flying Lingus Equipment.

 

[lookin4better]

Isnt all the flying done by Mesa, Skywest, RAH, TSA, etc... already outsourced flying? Seems so, most of it is mainline flying for sub-standard pay.

 

[Skippy]

sorry, i just cut and pasted the MEC blast email-- i too tried to find the info about third party pilots, but have been unable to confirm, but why woudl hte mec publish such drivel to the pilot group?

 

[contrail67]

This is exactly what they do at some regionals. Outsource on another certificate...especially during contract negotiations. Wonder is ALPA thought this would happen. They cannot do a thing about it.

 

[ArcherII]

Wow they've done it. Why try to get you to cave on an already poor scope clause when they can enter into an "innovative" codeshare. This makes me want to vomit and I hate vomiting.

Can't you guys strike? You've gotta fight back somehow. This once great airline is going downt he toilet in rapid fashion. This is so sickening.

 

[bluefin]

Isnt all the flying done by Mesa, Skywest, RAH, TSA, etc... already outsourced flying? Seems so, most of it is mainline flying for sub-standard pay.

As long as they are paying ALPA dues it is not outsourcing. I may have missed it somewhere, but I have yet to see ALPA say anything about the many Legacy pilots losing their jobs to lower paying regionals. If this is not a conflict of interest on ALPA'S part than I don't know what is.

 

[Whine Lover]

" going down the toilet in rapid fashion."

GOING?

LOL, as the Kids say....

YKMKR

 

[CitationLover]

don't listen to the midwest pilots who have been shouting bloody murder for the last three months. same shiite, different affected people.

 

[jayme]

As long as they are paying ALPA dues it is not outsourcing. I may have missed it somewhere, but I have yet to see ALPA say anything about the many Legacy pilots losing their jobs to lower paying regionals. If this is not a conflict of interest on ALPA'S part than I don't know what is.

SkyWest isn't ALPA. ALPA has nothing to do with this. It comes down to mainline pilots selling high-paying positions for percieved job security. When it didn't work out they say "They took our jobs!"

 

[Raoul Duke]

Will the pilots of the new company follow the hats on/hats off light switch?

 

[Ridgeback]

SkyWest isn't ALPA. ALPA has nothing to do with this. It comes down to mainline pilots selling high-paying positions for percieved job security. When it didn't work out they say "They took our jobs!"

I nominate for best post of the year....

this really does say it all

 

[Ridgeback]

This debate amazes me, I always hear "we;ll have to work on that the nest contract, or it's not the best economic time to work for that, or we'll never get that to pass, it will cost to much." Let's stop blamming ALPA for out local leaderships failures to get a water tight scope. Once the "major" airline pilots decide to use their leverage...while they still have it aka Midwest...and bring ALL flying under their company you will be worn down to nothing but a shell.

It's time for our local reps and our own pilot groups to say at all costs we will bring ALL brand flying under our contract, and we will fight another day to get back what we lost to get this done.

Isn't this what happened back when there was a b scale?

 

[saabservant]

Mainline MEC's give (alleged) management small jet flying for a few reasons, including pay and pension protection, furlough protection(flowbacks), or negotiating credit to be used elsewhere.
Central to the rationale by the mainline pilots was the perception that small turbo-prop or jet flying to small rural cities was beneath their status. Most of them came up through the squadrons, and had little or no small aircraft work in their backgrounds.

But I state the obvious...what can't be explained is why alpa lets it go on? Ask the negotiators and the alpa lawyers, I guess. I presume they do not want to make a stand and get the flying back, it would cost too much negotiating capital at section 6 time.

I've seen it from both sides now. At a regional for years, stuck there post 9-11, now furloughed from UAL. I can understand it when business slows down, but to lose your job to outsourcing? That is on alpa's shoulders.

The United bankruptcy is a classic case of what happens when you are unwilling to walk away from the table, and keep offering concessions.

I love alpa, but I hate it too...

 

[labbats]

I'm sorry, but I do blame ALPA. What is the point of a national union that is splintered? For crying out loud, create one payrate for each type and the whipsaw ends.

 

[bluefin]

I'm sorry, but I do blame ALPA. What is the point of a national union that is splintered? For crying out loud, create one payrate for each type and the whipsaw ends.

Exactly my point, how is it that ALPA has everyones best interest in mind. Although, ALPA only really helps the top 25% wage earners at the Legacy carriers. That's where the bigger chunck of dues comes from.

 

[A-V-8]

It says:


Industry analysts said the deal, which requires U.S. regulatory approval, will increase U.S. tourist and business traffic through Ireland at the expense of neighboring Britain, where increased security delays — and chronic problems at Heathrow Airport in particular — have made Europe-bound travelers seek a different hub.

Then it goes on to say:

Aer Lingus flies into four of United's U.S. hubs: Chicago, Los Angeles, San Francisco and Washington.

I hearby nominate the author for the dumba$$ of the year award.

 

[bluefin]

SkyWest isn't ALPA. ALPA has nothing to do with this. It comes down to mainline pilots selling high-paying positions for percieved job security. When it didn't work out they say "They took our jobs!"

No, your not. But if there wasn't SJS, wh%^$, and wh%^$ wages out there, then it wouldn't be problem would it?