UAX Letter to UAL Pilots over jumpseat dispute.

[XPOO]

So this must make you a SAPA chest thumber. Thump-a-way!

I love this. Your argument lacks substance so you resort to name calling. How classy.

Sorry, I called you an ALPA chest THUMPER. Not a chest THUMBER. Although, I can see how if I had, you would consider what said to be calling you names. But, I clearly labled you and did not name call you.

 

[Formula 1]

Sorry, I called you an ALPA chest THUMPER. Not a chest THUMBER. Although, I can see how if I had, you would consider what said to be calling you names. But, I clearly labled you and did not name call you.

Accepted.

 

[BigLebowski]

And you point is what? You agree that the SkyWest Pilots did not sign this letter? That SkyWest Pilots enjoy substandard wages and 401K matching and contribution limits? They are at will employees and can be terminate without cause? What is your point?

substandard wages? Terminate without cause? Funny I used to work at an ALPA carrier; was paid less, treated worse, and firings were a weekly event.

 

[Formula 1]

substandard wages? Terminate without cause? Funny I used to work at an ALPA carrier; was paid less, treated worse, and firings were a weekly event.

Your MEC lacked leadership. How is that my fault?

 

[bmpilot2003]

And you point is what? You agree that the SkyWest Pilots did not sign this letter? That SkyWest Pilots enjoy substandard wages and 401K matching and contribution limits? They are at will employees and can be terminate without cause? What is your point?

Contributions limits!? So you can contribute more than the Federal Limit huh? Can't wait for the IRS to show up at your house.

 

[XPOO]

Contributions limits!? So you can contribute more than the Federal Limit huh? Can't wait for the IRS to show up at your house.

LOL! But back to the subject here, it is sad that it is going down this road. I hope for a quick solution to this one.

 

[Speedtape]

Sorry, I called you an ALPA chest THUMPER. Not a chest THUMBER. Although, I can see how if I had, you would consider what said to be calling you names. But, I clearly labled you and did not name call you.

Hypothetical: When there is no ALPA:

1. To which standard will your company match your pay and work rules? The answer could be to the standard of J.O.'s airline!

2. Did you have any say in bringing on PBS? Did you know that the company saved anywhere from 6-12% in labor costs when they forced PBS down your throats? Did you know that most of these savings came out of your pocket? And you are worried about 1.95%! With ALPA, you would have had access to number crunchers who represent you to at least allow you to make financial decisions that affect you!
This is only one of the many things that will affect your pay and work rules over your career. By the way, PBS is considered concessionary! What do you call it and why did you need to make concessions at such a company that only looks out for your best interest?

 

[Flip]

Formula 1 This message is hidden because Formula 1 is on your ignore list.

 

[Formula 1]

Contributions limits!? So you can contribute more than the Federal Limit huh? Can't wait for the IRS to show up at your house.

Of course not, but all employees are subjected to even distribution according to the rules of the SEC. A 18 year captain can only contribute within a certain limits relation to a part time ramper Butte, MT. making minimum wage. SkyWest discovered this error 6 years ago and the most senior pilots received checks in the mail refunding the overstated amount minus interest and was taxed. These captains had to report this on their tax returns and pay the difference. Some of these guys got 6 years of 401K money refunded. The company kept the differnce of course. Before that the company switched 401k managers and the pilots lost monies in tranfer fees. I knew one pilot who lost 80k. The 401K is pathic, you have to wait one year to get in. You only get a 2% match for the first 5 yrs. Then 4% from 5-10 and then a whopping 6% match after 10 years. The pilot group have no control over the plan. They are completely up to the whimes of management. Everyone knows that you have to contribute early and alot to have something for retirement. If the company can get a better deal somewhere else to save acouple of bucks they will transfer the 401k to a different company and there is nothing you can do about it, but pay the fees.

No contract, no protections.

 

[Caspian27]

Being unionized or not has absolutely no relevance to the discussion at hand.

Can we get back to the letter?

 

[dispatchguy]

substandard wages? Terminate without cause? Funny I used to work at an ALPA carrier; was paid less, treated worse, and firings were a weekly event.

Must've been at Uncle Hulas's work farm...

 

[No.W.]

This is going to be ugly. Unfortunately, it's the only way.

 

[XPOO]

Hypothetical: When there is no ALPA:

1. To which standard will your company match your pay and work rules? The answer could be to the standard of J.O.'s airline!

2. Did you have any say in bringing on PBS? Did you know that the company saved anywhere from 6-12% in labor costs when they forced PBS down your throats? Did you know that most of these savings came out of your pocket? And you are worried about 1.95%! With ALPA, you would have had access to number crunchers who represent you to at least allow you to make financial decisions that affect you!
This is only one of the many things that will affect your pay and work rules over your career. By the way, PBS is considered concessionary! What do you call it and why did you need to make concessions at such a company that only looks out for your best interest?

I'm a dispatcher. So, answer to question number 1. Do SkyWest Dispatchers want to be the highest paid in the regional industry? Sure we do. But are we? Yes, and no. There are a lot of factors to weigh when answering any question like this. However, SADA goes to great lengths to contact every comparable regional dispatch center to compare work rules and rates and negotiate accordingly. We have very good working relationships with the dispatch heads at most comparable regionals and freely exchange information in order to continually "raise the bar."

Number 2. Dispatchers do not use PBS. We have set up our own system of line bidding internally. the rules of which were determined by SADA and approved by management. Was this bidding system something every dispatcher wanted? Probably not, but it does have the backing of the majority of the dispatch office. I am not qualified to talk about PBS and so I will not.

 

[Formula 1]

Being unionized or not has absolutely no relevance to the discussion at hand.

Can we get back to the letter?

Yes it dose. The letter is invalid. The SkyWest Pilots did not sign the letter. A SkyWest pilot may have as a SAPA rep with no powers and/or authority. Now because of someone narrowmindedness (SAPA) SkyWest Pilots might get bumbed off of United jumpseats, because of a jumpseat war. SkyWest Pilots have no contract with thier management, but do have a ever changing policy manual that contains no Commuter Protection Policy. Way to go SAPA! What is SAPA going to do for you if you get terminated for a failed commute?

 

[XPOO]

Yes it dose. The letter is invalid. The SkyWest Pilots did not sign the letter. A SkyWest pilot may have as a SAPA rep with no powers and/or authority. Now because of someone narrowmindedness SkyWest Pilots might get bumbed off of United jumpseats in because of a jumpseat war. SkyWest Pilots have no contract with thier management but a ever changing policy manual that contains no Commuter Protection Policy. Way to go SAPA!

SkyWest does about 80% of the UAX flying, and does about 100 less flights a day as UAX than UA does as Mainline. SkyWest is the single most important regional on that sheet of paper.

 

[pilotlbs]

Yes it dose. The letter is invalid. The SkyWest Pilots did not sign the letter. A SkyWest pilot may have as a SAPA rep with no powers and/or authority. Now because of someone narrowmindedness (SAPA) SkyWest Pilots might get bumbed off of United jumpseats, because of a jumpseat war. SkyWest Pilots have no contract with thier management, but do have a ever changing policy manual that contains no Commuter Protection Policy. Way to go SAPA! What is SAPA going to do for you if you get terminated for a failed commute?

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[bmpilot2003]

Yes it dose. The letter is invalid. The SkyWest Pilots did not sign the letter. A SkyWest pilot may have as a SAPA rep with no powers and/or authority. Now because of someone narrowmindedness (SAPA) SkyWest Pilots might get bumbed off of United jumpseats, because of a jumpseat war. SkyWest Pilots have no contract with thier management, but do have a ever changing policy manual that contains no Commuter Protection Policy. Way to go SAPA! What is SAPA going to do for you if you get terminated for a failed commute?

How is the letter invalid when 5 other union carriers signed their Airlines name?

 

[Formula 1]

How is the letter invalid when 5 other union carriers signed their Airlines name?

That's fine. Let those count, but leave SkyWest out of it.

 

[Speedtape]

In regard to the J/S issue:

It appears that this is being handled in a very fair and open communications way. If you want to call it a Jumpseat war, then do as you may! AMR and WN are very firm in the terms and application of their "RECIPROCAL" Jumpseat Agreements.

After reading the issues, it does not appear, under current practice, that the application is RECIPROCAL OR FAIR! Furthermore, it does not appear that other reasonable attempts have reconciled the concerns of the affected parties. Maybe, thus far, it has not been in the best interest of the UAL MEC to pursue equity in the matter, since UAL pilots have enjoyed an advantage under the current practice. Obviously,
with the number of airlines petitioning the UAL MEC, there is disparate and unfair treatment.

One could speculate, that this solicitation or petitioning of the UAL MEC will resolve this issue. If I were a commuting UAL pilot, I would be voicing my concerns--STRONGLY to my MEC. This is not a Jumpseat War! It is a request to resolve an issue in a timely manner or face the consequences. Maybe, the UAL MEC, will now HELP resolve the issue so that a Fair and Reciprocal agreement exists for all parties.

Stay tuned! I guess Skywest could call it a "Friendly Petition."

 

[Caspian27]

Well Forumula1, you seem a little bitter. I don't know if you got denied a job at SkyWest, or used to work there and maybe it didn't end amicably...but since you are adding nothing but to this conversation:

Welcome to my ignore list.