UAL Liquidation?

[b19]

Mr. Merchant a national seniority list is a good idea, I just can't see how it would ever happen. But as an alternative, think Europe with the JAA ATP. Pilots have to take something like 14 exams from a 16,000 question test bank for their ATP. This severely reduces the pilot pool and that shortage makes qualified people much more valuable.

If ALPA lobbied for the same testing as the JAA for all future ATP's, with those that already have an ATP and a couple thousand PIC, grandfathered in. It would make us as pilots a lot more valuable in the future, in this horribly uncertain industry.

It's not a national seniority list but it might make starting over a little less painful if the pilot supply is restricted, and all in the name of safety.

 

[Secret Squirrel]

Wrong, Look what is happening in Europe. People are buying jobs with 300 hours and a wad of cash. The multicrew pilot license is being brought in to allow people with even less experience fly big airplanes.

 

[b19]

I agree that the multicrew is a sham, they did that to get away from their own ATP requirements. I was talking about an extremely difficult ATP written exam, not an easy multicrew/commercial ticket, that would have the long term effect of shrinking the pilot pool.

Have you looked at what it takes to convert your license to a JAA ATP.

 

[ACL65PILOT]

I agree that the multicrew is a sham, they did that to get away from their own ATP requirements. I was talking about an extremely difficult ATP written exam, not an easy multicrew/commercial ticket, that would have the long term effect of shrinking the pilot pool.

Have you looked at what it takes to convert your license to a JAA ATP.

Yes, and it took me three and a half years to take all the tests and go take the practicals. Well worth it, but a true pain in the butt.

 

[glasspilot1]

>> At the time, airlines would go years without hiring. You could be highly qualified and pass age 32 and you had NO chance at being an airline pilot, period. <<

I have a good friend who got burned by that very "rule"! It's hard to believe companies could get away with that back then.

My friend John grew up in NC and all he ever wanted to do was fly for Piedmont. They weren't hiring and he waited. He knew a lot of people there, had the inside info! Finally he interviews, gets hired and the guy asks at the end: "Oh, how old are you?" "I just turned 32". "Oh, I'm sorry, we can't make an exception for you."

 

[SFR]

i feel terrible

 

[Colonel Savage]

You sold out to save your own in a de-regulated airline world. It's that simple- funny how the 'right' believes in absolutes- but can't take responsibility for this.

Your generation sold out when you took the job. You didn't really think you could borrow the easy money, attend the academies, and fly the replacement jet for pennies on the dollar and have everything work out fine in the end, did you?

Seemed too good to be true didn't it?

 

[waveflyer]

the academies, huh? By that standard- every person who ever attended college and got a degree is some sort of sell out.

I chose a career. You act like it was my decision to outsource jets. Was that the case? Did my generation want, as an end goal, to fly RJ's? 90% of us simply chose a career, trained hard for it, and want to fly for a major airline. We've had no vote in outsourcing ever.

So, nice try. Keep ducking your responsibility. I don't duck mine- i've been at my major for some time now- And i will not support outsourcing. It's that simple. I'm not here to blame you- more than get you to realize the damage you do to EVERYONE's career when you concede to outsourcing routes that were yours. Including your own. I hope you see the pressure that outsourcing puts on your own wages.

Regional pilots are dis-enfranchised. Decisions get made by major airline pilots that affect their career- yet they get NO VOTE. If their own unions ever get too strong- flying is simply transferred to a weaker group.

Major airline pilots are the only ones who can solve this.

 

[b19]

Age 65 and a global slowdown has created a horrible situation for pilots; an oversupply with no jobs and no reason for management to properly value experience. Something should be done now to have the long term effect of making the testing and experience requirements such that we are not ever again faced with an oversupply of cheap labor, otherwise we as pilots will never get off this roller coaster ride of boom and bust. Restrict the supply just like the diamond companies, and we will all have better jobs.

No multicrew, just a JAA style ATP exam. Do it now while there is an oversupply of pilots, because no one will care, and ten years from now we will be better off.

 

[Yuppyguppy]

since amr,cal, soon to be ual contracts are open why don't we all just strike at once??? Just shut it down.

 

[Dumb Pilot]

Your generation sold out when you took the job. You didn't really think you could borrow the easy money, attend the academies, and fly the replacement jet for pennies on the dollar and have everything work out fine in the end, did you?

Seemed too good to be true didn't it?

You vote by 60% plus margins to give your flying away and then blame those that take the jobs YOU gave away? Talking about hypocrisy

 

[Turtle21]

Your exactly right...what is your point?

How can you say someone is "exactly right" if you're unaware of their point?:cartman:

 

[Turtle21]

I have to throw the BS flag here Mr. aaflyer. I realize that SWAPA is the most influential pilot organization around but...

You all have to admit that once alpo got on board, age 65 was a done deal. Quit blaming SWAPA.

Even if SWAPA started the age 65 thing it is ALPO's fault. If the ALPO clowns had established a national seniority list there never would have been a need for legitimate unions.

 

[800Dog]

You vote by 60% plus margins to give your flying away and then blame those that take the jobs YOU gave away? Talking about hypocrisy

And my pilot group is as guilty as any out there. Remember our "line in the sand" at 70 seats? Delta guys keep giving it away!

 

[Colonel Savage]

You vote by 60% plus margins to give your flying away and then blame those that take the jobs YOU gave away? Talking about hypocrisy

I always voted NO on every concessionary T/A placed before me.