UAL Capt in DEN- December 2010

[cheyflyer]

LXApilot: You should have got off the plane. Captain's authority is going away because too many captains are doing selfish, stupid things. You seriously rode around for two days with him before this?! Unbelieveable. When retirements resume, we need to pass a resolution that the company no longer sponsor any expense in celebrating a retirement flight. That money shoulde be set aside for furlough assistance or put into a group sick bank to fund some legitimate need.

It sounded like the story teller Was going to get off the plane.... but also, it sounded like the guy trying to get home was being a total dick about the jumpseat from the start. Maybe he should have actually spoken to the Captain first, explained His situation and desire to get home to his girls, then maybe the outcome would have been a little different. If the guy did in fact act the way portrayed in the story, then it probably would not have mattered if the son removed himself from the jumpseat, Im sure the Captain would have denied him access anyway based on his actions.

 

[IBNAV8R]

If the guy did in fact act the way portrayed in the story, then it probably would not have mattered if the son removed himself from the jumpseat, Im sure the Captain would have denied him access anyway based on his actions.

He wouldn't have rode in MY jumpseat either. Any word as to this guy's current employment status?

 

[Mud Eagle]

That should have been his ride home and his family will never get that christmas back.

LXApilot: You should have got off the plane.

I guess I'm just a dumb military guy who is obviously missing something here...

Why is it that he should have gotten off the JS on his father's retirement flight?

I get it that people are getting to work, getting home after work, etc, and how critical JSs are to that process. Seems to me that there are lots of jumpseats on lots of different flights, and to be fair there are lots of Christmases in a guy's career (I've missed plenty in my military career, so I get that....)...but there is only one retirement flight.

How was the needs of that one pilot, who could have jumped on any other aircraft going to his destination, and if he didn't make it home for that particular Christmas morning would have had plenty of others in the future, more pressing than a son being with his father on the singular last flight of his career? How is that jumpseater's "need" to be with his family any more important than the son's "need" to be with his father on that day?

 

[Flopgut]

It's simple Mud Eagle, the son should have had a seat in the back in case someone else would have needed the jumpseat. If it was truly so important to be with his Dad during his retirement flight then that should have been a neccessity. What if a fed showed up? Was his dad going to deny a fed the jumpseat as well? If he had to be on the jumpseat, then father and son could have offered the arranged for seat to the jumpseater they were bumping. The jumpseater blew his top, but both father and son dropped the ball and missed a chance to display real professionalism and do the right thing.

The captain's seat and captain's authority are institutions and are should be less about the actual individual. This thread highlights two UAL captains who made selfish needs their priority.

 

[zonker]

Who in their right mind is going to allow a progressively rude, then hostile, and then physically threatening person in the cockpit jumpseat?

His dad did the right thing by telling the jumpseater to take a hike.

 

[Flopgut]

Anybody who sets up this situation, and then can not de-escalate it, is at least partially to blame.

If the jumpseater got canned, then the captain should have lost a month's pay. That would be consistent.

With as many retirements as we have coming up, we're going to have to freshen up the protocols on this sort of thing. If the retiring pilot wants to dictate who is going along they can buy them a ticket.

BTW: I would feel somewhat different about this if it were the captain's last leg. You've got to draw the line somewhere or you'll have guys celebrating [exaggerating] their retirement flight into their retirement month....

 

[27 driver]

LXApilot: You should have got off the plane. Captain's authority is going away because too many captains are doing selfish, stupid things. You seriously rode around for two days with him before this?! Unbelieveable. When retirements resume, we need to pass a resolution that the company no longer sponsor any expense in celebrating a retirement flight. That money shoulde be set aside for furlough assistance or put into a group sick bank to fund some legitimate need.

Ya, thats perfect!!!!!! Lets just screw all those guys who have put in 20 or 30 years somewhere. They don't deserve ********************!

 

[Varmint]

Captain's authority plain and simple. The Captain should decide who gets to ride in his office as long as there are no regulatory agencies requesting a check flight. When you work in this industry you understand that guarantees of being home for christmas or any holiday are slim to none. When you chose to commute you make your odds of being home worse. After spending years and years accommodating the passengers, peers, and company this guy chose to make himself and his son happy and proud on his last trip. Good for him and good luck in retirement.

 

[HA25]

Everyone should take the time to send UAL a customer service message on how unacceptable it is for them to create culture that would cause the delay of a flight over a dispute with a gate agent and a captain regarding when a single bag was going to go.. the fact that UAL's corporate culture places the same value on the captain's authority over this trivial item as the gate agents shows why the company is failing as a business.

 

[Sluggo_63]

I guess I'm just a dumb military guy who is obviously missing something here...

Why is it that he should have gotten off the JS on his father's retirement flight?

I get it that people are getting to work, getting home after work, etc, and how critical JSs are to that process. Seems to me that there are lots of jumpseats on lots of different flights, and to be fair there are lots of Christmases in a guy's career (I've missed plenty in my military career, so I get that....)...but there is only one retirement flight.

How was the needs of that one pilot, who could have jumped on any other aircraft going to his destination, and if he didn't make it home for that particular Christmas morning would have had plenty of others in the future, more pressing than a son being with his father on the singular last flight of his career? How is that jumpseater's "need" to be with his family any more important than the son's "need" to be with his father on that day?

Well, I'll tell you... it wasn't the singular last flight of his father's career. This guy had jumpseated with his dad for the past two days, then went to Hawaii with him, and back to SFO, then back to IAD. SFO to IAD was the "singular last flight" of his dad's career. That's why if I was his dad, I would have told him to catch the next flight to Hawaii, or to wait at SFO for me on the way back.

I wouldn't have a problem with this guy using his Captain's authority to keep his son on the flight from SFO to IAD, for the last flight. This kid wanted to be on daddy's jumpseat for the entire last trip.

Also, I highly doubt the incident played out exactly as described... I have a hard time believing anyone asking for a jumpseat would start out like that. I'm sure there was a conversation that was a little less confrontational that the one described. There's three sides to every story, and I'm betting that this guy didn't burst into the cockpit pointing fingers, laughing, and saying "you're outta' here buddy... THIS JUMPSEAT IS MINE!!!" I'm not saying there isn't a fair share of jerks out there, but there is something fishy about the beginning of this story.