Trickle down economics and the airlines

[ACL65PILOT]

I had the business before I was a pilot.

 

[Dan Roman]

Trickle down works when the money stays in the country, but that isn't the case anymore.

Our GDP is collapsing and the money that once flowed to the American house holds now goes abroad. We are exporting our wealth at an alarming rate.

It is time to stimulate the base, spend on domestic projects to electrify our economy. But most important of all that I think the generations below me do not understand; we have got to improve our standing on the global stage. Powell nailed it, the Republican base does not understand the new age of thinking, it is time for a new idealogy to get this country running again.

I am 57 years old, I have never voted for a Democrat but I am about to because we are in trouble, serious trouble.

This sums it up nicely but seemed to get lost in the mudslinging.
It's time the people who buy the airline tickets get a break and not the execs, who sometimes do create jobs with the tax breaks but more often seem to pocket the money for themselves and the shareholders.

 

[777forever]

Most of the people who made it big in the 80's and 90's with the tech boom are very big philanthropists and are trying to use their wealth to help better the world.

Unlike the majority of the Republican party...

 

[Mr.B]

Trickle down economics is a scam cover up for the true intention of greed.

When businesses cut jobs or wages following a downturn they are not giddy to increase costs as soon as they start making money.

McCain wants to help his corporate buddies get richer at the expense of the middle class, the true people that make the whole economy turn.

McSame, No Millionaire left behind, etc...the list goes on.

There's nothing wrong with being rich and achieving the American dream. But when you start using unethical tactics to take more away from those that work hard to pad your already fat pockets there is something very wrong with that.

United's managment is making MUCH more than CEOs at the most profitable airlines in the world like Singapore and Cathay. That is flat out wrong.

The US corporate system is completely corrupt and filled with greed. People in this country are getting sick of it. Its time for a change.

Indeed.... Well said.

 

[airksk]

Unlike the majority of the Republican party...

Do you have any data to back that up?

http://philanthropy.com/free/articles/v19/i04/04001101.htm

In Who Really Cares: The Surprising Truth About Compassionate Conservatism (Basic Books), Arthur C. Brooks finds that religious conservatives are far more charitable than secular liberals, and that those who support the idea that government should redistribute income are among the least likely to dig into their own wallets to help others.


Gee what a surprise. Democrats are very willing to give away MY money, not their own.

 

[milky]

Your right that it isn't simple. We could go back and forth all day cherry picking whatever we think supports any position you want to take. Talking about money is especially emotional for some.
I just think it's a good idea to try and spur the economy by putting more money in the pockets of the consumers and not trying to make a few very rich and hope they will create jobs. There is a LOT of greed and self serving behavior in the upper income brackets. The whole world is paying for it.

No offense, but as I read through this thread and others that you have posted in, I see that you are completely ignorant of how the economy works. It's pretty scary. It makes me really scared for our country that there are idiots like you out there that think you are more intelligent than the rest of us. I'm truly scared and worried. Educate yourself please. You look like a fool.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

No offense, but as I read through this thread and others that you have posted in, I see that you are completely ignorant of how the economy works. It's pretty scary. It makes me really scared for our country that there are idiots like you out there that think you are more intelligent than the rest of us. I'm truly scared and worried. Educate yourself please. You look like a fool.

Hey its Milky... the academic....

Have you read a newspaper lately... Seen Alan Greenspan?

 

[Jetjockey]

Here is some straight talk for you.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GEtZlR3zp4c&feature=related

 

[Dan Roman]

No offense, but as I read through this thread and others that you have posted in, I see that you are completely ignorant of how the economy works. It's pretty scary. It makes me really scared for our country that there are idiots like you out there that think you are more intelligent than the rest of us. I'm truly scared and worried. Educate yourself please. You look like a fool.

Thank you! I'm flattered my posts stand out. I have to wonder why you think I think I'm smarter than anyone else here. I just post my opinions like anyone else, my belief is that's how a forum should work. Everyone post's their beliefs as best they can and we are all adult enough to make up our own minds. But if it sounds like I think I'm smarter than anyone else, my apologies, it's my writing skills that are lacking. I really don't think I'm an economic genius. But I am a registered voter, so the discussions here are important and relevant. That said Obama and the team they have assembled ARE smarter than you and I combined, so I trust what they have to say.
Seems to me plenty of other people agree with my basic premise that trickle down economics has it's flaws and perhaps it's time to start giving the tax breaks to the people buying the airline tickets to spur the economy rather than depending on the companies to "trickle down the savings" to the consumer. It don't all trickle down dude.

 

[Smacktard]

Unlike the majority of the Republican party...

I think you meant unlike the Democrats. Look at Obama's recent tax filings for a hint there...

 

[Smacktard]

Are you really that stupid? Do an internet search on the middle class dissappearing and you'll get articles and data up the ying yang. Don't forget the top 1% used to pay an income tax of 70%, now it is less than 30%. Say you're someone like my grandfather that makes millions a year, if you're taxed at 70% you still have over a million left over. That's hardly making things equal(communist=bad). He doesn't pay 70% though, in fact with all the tax breaks from the 80's change in tax codes he pays about 10%. I've got news for you, the wealthy love you're ignorance. Can you say, "Baaaahhhhh"?

Classic response. Too bad you are the victim here, falling for the DNC talking point about the rich getting richer off the backs of the poor and middle class. There is a widening 'disparity' of income, but not for the reasons your ascribe to. Here, I'll quote from a study linked to below " On the one hand, it is natural and even important for market economies to experience changes in their income distributions over time as the inevitable consequence of competitive market forces. In fact, depending on the circumstances, they need not be inconsistent with healthy overall economic performance" The study, and all of the ones similar to it, refer to 3 main reasons this happens in any healthy society; changes to domestic labor market, global competition and the ability of the labor force to keep pace with technological advancement. Funny, none of the studies come to the conclusion that evil greedy CEOs are the cause of this inequality.

But here's the big point that you are also missing. The only people left behind are those that get 'mired' in the low end because of their inability to learn and advance. What the rest of the links show below is that a majority of earners in every bracket over the last 60 years have all experience upward mobility between income brackets. That is a better indication of wealth and the creation of wealth.

Here are some raw numbers, you read thru them and tell me what the conclusion is;
Controlling for inflation, in 1967, 8 percent of households had an annual income of $75,000 and up; in 2003, more than 26 percent did.
In 1967, 17 percent of households had a $50,000 to $75,000 income; in 2003, it was 18 percent.
In 1967, 22 percent of households were in the $35,000 to $50,000 income group; by 2003, it had fallen to 15 percent.
During the same period, the $15,000 to $35,000 category fell from 31 percent to 25 percent, and the under $15,000 category fell from 21 percent to 16 percent.
I would think the logical conclusion is that the middle class moved up. You tell me.

Next subject, that's a great story about your grandpappy there, too bad the example you used contradicts the point you're trying to make.

In 1980 with a tax rate of 70% the wealthiest 5% paid 37% of the total tax revenue. With a rate now of 35%, the wealthiest 5% pay 60% of the total tax revenue. If you need a link, just google Georgia Public Policy Foundation. So, with the top 5% paying a larger percentage of tax revenue, tell me how that makes the middle class smaller?

Please note, the sources for all of these links are below are government sources, not The New York Times or the Democratic National Convetion talking points.

The rich are getting richer, but so are the poor. To make the idiotic claim that the middle class is paying for the rich to get rich ignores the dynamic complexity of wealth in our society.

To end, here is one great quote from one of the links below (it was a study from the 80's thru mid 2006)...

"Median incomes of taxpayers in the sample increased by 24 percent after adjusting for inflation. The real incomes of two-thirds of all taxpayers increased over this period. Further, the median incomes of those initially in the lowest income groups increased more in percentage terms than the median incomes of those in the higher income groups. The median inflation-adjusted incomes of the taxpayers who were in the very highest income groups in 1996 declined by 2005."

http://www.lao.ca.gov/2000/0800_inc_dist/0800_income_distribution.pdf

http://www.whitehouse.gov/cea/lazear20060502.html

http://usinfo.state.gov/products/pubs/market/mktsb8b.htm

http://useu.usmission.gov/Dossiers/Economic_Relations/Nov1307_Treasury_Income_Mobility.asp

http://www.house.gov/jec/middle/mobility/mobility.htm

http://www.treas.gov/offices/tax-policy/library/incomemobilitystudy03-08revise.pdf

http://www.ustreas.gov/press/releases/hp673.htm

Here's one link that is not from the treasury but from one of my slanted, right wing hate mongers...

http://www.gmu.edu/departments/economics/wew/articles/07/IncomeMobility.htm

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

ahhhh the good ol... you need to work harder and maybe you'll be lucky too....

How many times does an Air Line Pilot need to get furloughed and start over on the recycle program?

Flying for an airline not working out for you? Then retrain for a new career, with new student loans and new first year wages....

Then who flies Jets for US Air Lines in this country? Asians? Mexicans?

If the airline industry is vital to the US economy then why are air line pilots not vital to the economy?