The logic of relative seniority

[OK3]

Doesn't lose any seniority. 60% F/O to 60% F/O is keeping seniority exactly where it was. NOTHING changes for that F/O, nothing.

With respect, something does change for that FO in this case if he works for SWA. The missing factor is the age of the pilots inserted above him (AAI is a younger group). An argument can be made that the new bigger company will also produce fewer upgrade because upgrades for growth are twice as many as for attrition, and growing beyond 700 aircraft will be difficult to do for a number of reasons. This is not as clear cut an argument though.

Another factor not included is the 717s that AAI brings to the transaction. This aircraft does not have a pay rate at SWA yet. It may in fact pay less than the 737. If that is the case a large number of the jobs being brought over are not worth as much to SWA pilots, further damaging a current SWA pilot.

 

[madjack]

Jonjuan,

Ok, the SWAFO keeps his relative seniority and pay, the AAI CP gets a huge pay raise (plus 3000 more FOs behind him)...that sounds like a windfall to the AAI CP and no gain for the SWAFO...not likely to happen either.

 

[shootr]

Another factor not included is the 717s that AAI brings to the transaction. This aircraft does not have a pay rate at SWA yet. It may in fact pay less than the 737.

THIS is the issue that has yet to have much discussion. Anybody who thinks it's a given that 717 pay at SWA will equal 737 pay, does not know SWA management. It's not how any of us want it to go down but it is VERY possible. A lower payscale with a 5 year fence would not shock me, at all. I'd vote against it, but it could pass.

shootr

 

[RIDETHELIGHTING]

Then I guess the 300 should pay less. When do u guys vote on that?

 

[Hose A. Jiminez]

There will likely be some complicated compromise. Due to the vast disparity in payscales, AT captains without enough longevity to hold CA at SWA are not likely to keep their seats. They will still, however, realize a pay raise or be protected. The AAI pay rates effective in September when the deal was announced will be the ones used for negotiations.

 

[shootr]

Then I guess the 300 should pay less. When do u guys vote on that?

We're about to vote on a sideletter for ALL 737's (including -800's) at one pay rate.

-300's have the same number of seats as -700's. Maybe you're thinking of the -500's (122 seats versus 137). I wouldn't be shocked to see all the -500's gone during the transition and replaced with the Mexicana 717's. I have not heard any of these things from any reliable sources. All speculation.

 

[Ty Webb]

There will likely be some complicated compromise. Due to the vast disparity in payscales, AT captains without enough longevity to hold CA at SWA are not likely to keep their seats. They will still, however, realize a pay raise or be protected. The AAI pay rates effective in September when the deal was announced will be the ones used for negotiations.

Everything you posted is at odds with recent arbitrated SLI's, but everyone's entitled to their opinion.

 

[madjack]

Every SLI is unique...recent (DAL/NWA) SLI may be very different than a AAI/SWA integration due to:

- Disparity in pay
- Dispartity in longevity of the companies
- Disparity in size

These factors will be have to be considered by the AAI/SWA NCs because they will certainly be considered if it goes to arbitration.

 

[Cometman]

Every SLI is unique...recent (DAL/NWA) SLI may be very different than a AAI/SWA integration due to:

- Disparity in pay
- Dispartity in longevity of the companies
- Disparity in size

These factors will be have to be considered by the AAI/SWA NCs because they will certainly be considered if it goes to arbitration.

I have a question for anybody that thinks he is an expert in this field. I would assume that both sides have to get a transition agreement with their respective company before they start on the SLI. At what point do the both sides agree if it will be handled by 1 arbritraitor or a panel of 3? Is that a choice they have ? If so, if they disagree does it go to arbitration? It seems like it can be a never ending task.

Thanks

 

[AFcitrus]

Hose,

After reading many of your posts I have come to the conclusion that you have no intent other than to spread mis-information. Having an opinion is fine. Blatant faulty information though is a horse of a different color. I encourage everyone here to go back and read SLI arbitration precedent. Then we can have an intelligent chat based on facts instead of one man's mis-informed opinion.