The JetBlue ALPA drive has officially started.

[dicko]

You really don't know what you are talking about do you? ALPA had nothing to do with the Skywest deal and had no legal grounds to stop it. It was allowed by the worthless CBA written in 2001 that had so much poor language and loop holes that have been exploited continuously. That CBA was written by an inept in-house union known as the NPA.

You need to actually read what I wrote. It will make it easier for you to reply. I said nothing about SkyWest.

86 seat RJ's are specifically allowed in the TA'd Scope section written by ALPA. Not the NPA.

When this occurred we became the only ALPA airline to allow 86 seat jets in our Scope. This is how our union interpreted the pilots first polled priority. "Protect Scope".

You are however correct about one thing. The NPA were inept.

 

[rayford steele]

You need to actually read what I wrote. It will make it easier for you to reply. I said nothing about SkyWest.

86 seat RJ's are specifically allowed in the TA'd Scope section written by ALPA. Not the NPA.

When this occurred we became the only ALPA airline to allow 86 seat jets in our Scope. This is how our union interpreted the pilots first polled priority. "Protect Scope".

You are however correct about one thing. The NPA were inept.

Your MEC gave away your scope. There has never been a case where scope has been breached without some worthless self serving negotiating committee signing the bottom line. It's all part of pilots screwing pilots.

 

[A350]

Rayford:

And on the other end is another MEC who will take the flying, no matter what the pay, just to get to fly a larger airplane with a somewhat larger paycheck.

We agree that pilots will just screw pilots....and standing guard over all of it is good old ALPA National.

A350

 

[jayme]

ALPA national can't stop a group from undercutting another. Do you think they should have the right to tell you how to vote?

 

[A350]

ALPA National has always had the power to stop the profession from imploding on itself.....except they never do. They occasionally use a strike...but when your carrier liquidates or comes upon hard times, there is never anything for you because they will tell you they don't hire pilots. The ALPA president signs these contracts too....he just has to say no!

They also have had the power to suspend service....this is a nuclear bomb but ever since the APA got jammed with a $30 mil. judgement...they have been as quiet as a lamb.

The USAir pension is a great example.....ALPA National could have vetoed the agreement....let the judge or the government take the pension but to give it away sure didn't do the pilots at DAL, NWA, and UAL any favors.....

A350

 

[jayme]

That's a one way street! I bet you if I ever violated a company policy, it wouldn't be "leave him be, fire him later." It would be instant termination. So why the hell should we "fly now, grieve later."

What Caveman wrote PLUS:

No, you're wrong. When's the last time you heard of an "instant termination" at a union airline? With a union, there is a defined process to terminate a pilot, usually including providing evidence that you deserve to be terminated and that everybody who ever did what you did was also fired. Otherwise the union will aruge that there was precedence for keeping you around.

There are reasons for not liking unions. Your reasons reek of prejudice and lack of understanding.

 

[jayme]

ALPA National has always had the power to stop the profession from imploding on itself.....except they never do. They occasionally use a strike...but when your carrier liquidates or comes upon hard times, there is never anything for you because they will tell you they don't hire pilots. The ALPA president signs these contracts too....he just has to say no!

You mean you want the president of ALPA to override a pilot group's collective voice? Like he's some kind of father figure who knows better than his kids? Are you serious?

They also have had the power to suspend service....this is a nuclear bomb but ever since the APA got jammed with a $30 mil. judgement...they have been as quiet as a lamb.

I'll let your lack of logical thinking speak for itself here.

The USAir pension is a great example.....ALPA National could have vetoed the agreement....let the judge or the government take the pension but to give it away sure didn't do the pilots at DAL, NWA, and UAL any favors.....

A350

Again, you think National should override the wishes of a pilot group's decision? I'm guessing you're already anti-union. If national had overruled a pilot groups vote, I'm certain people like you would be using that as ammo against ALPA as well. Damned if you do...

 

[A350]

As you are so quick to point out....the pension debacle at USAir was not the pilot group's decision, but a 9th hour back door deal. National should have known better.

A350

 

[Splert]

As you are so quick to point out....the pension debacle at USAir was not the pilot group's decision, but a 9th hour back door deal. National should have known better.

A350

We have a 5% 401K match in a 401K that is out of balance and fails IRC testing every year and a statement that at any time and for any reason the company can amend, change or terminate each and every benefit plan at the company.

Your PBGC Pension is probably a better deal.

ALPA may suck but what we have a JetBlue swallows.

Next!

 

[A350]

Splert.....

Yeah.....$28,800 a year from the government instead of a $1.5-2.5 million lump sum is a better deal all right! The way our government spends money....I ain't counting on that either.

That verbiage is in there....but the company has never done that. They pay to equal everyone up and pay the profit sharing....even when we lost money and fuel was $4/gal and going to the moon.

I am not defending some of the things that management does....but it will take a whole lot to make me change my mind about ALPA.

A350

 

[jayme]

As you are so quick to point out....the pension debacle at USAir was not the pilot group's decision, but a 9th hour back door deal. National should have known better.

A350

What do you mean "National should have known better?"

What should National have done?

 

[Splert]

Splert.....

Yeah.....$28,800 a year from the government instead of a $1.5-2.5 million lump sum is a better deal all right! The way our government spends money....I ain't counting on that either.

That verbiage is in there....but the company has never done that. They pay to equal everyone up and pay the profit sharing....even when we lost money and fuel was $4/gal and going to the moon.

I am not defending some of the things that management does....but it will take a whole lot to make me change my mind about ALPA.

A350

A normal retirement will net no less than $750,000 without ever reaching retirement age at Airways. Man you got dorked. Can I please get dorked like that too?

The company has never done that? What are you smoking? Our Health Care plan changed from 33% share of cost to 37% and that after canceling the health plan and mixing the benefits around. Just because the company did not change the name of Care Plan 1 doesn't mean it wasn't terminated and replaced with a new and improved Care Plan 1.

Also the guy who flew the first revenue flight for JetBlue had his health plan TERMINATED.

CSPP goner.

New Hire stock options - goner too!

What are you going to say when next year the Plus Plan is terminated? Oh I know: "They actually improved it".

Dude...every other pilot group in our peers set earns at least a 10% retirement not counting profit sharing. We are not 2.7% behind we are in the neighborhood of 8.5% behind peer set. With a peer set retirement we should be in the range of 13% 401k and B-fund PLUS profit sharing.

BTW, PS is based upon Operating Income not NET INCOME. When is the last time JetBlue had a operating loss?

Pilots!

Geez.

 

[coogebeachhotel]

Splert.....

Yeah.....$28,800 a year from the government instead of a $1.5-2.5 million lump sum is a better deal all right! The way our government spends money....I ain't counting on that either.

That verbiage is in there....but the company has never done that. They pay to equal everyone up and pay the profit sharing....even when we lost money and fuel was $4/gal and going to the moon.

I am not defending some of the things that management does....but it will take a whole lot to make me change my mind about ALPA.

A350

Just who got you that pension?

 

[A350]

The same people who gave it away.....

A350

 

[Splert]

How pension plans end

• When an employer ends a pension plan
• When PBGC terminates a pension plan
• How you will know if your plan is ending
• Additional benefits after a plan ends

When an employer ends a pension plan
Employers can end a pension plan through a process called “plan termination.” There are two ways an employer can terminate its pension plan.
The employer can end the plan in a standard termination but only after showing PBGC that the plan has enough money to pay all benefits owed to participants. The plan must either purchase an annuity from an insurance company (which will provide you with lifetime benefits when you retire) or, if your plan allows, issue one lump-sum payment that covers your entire benefit. Before purchasing your annuity, your plan administrator must give you an advance notice that identifies the insurance company (or companies) that your employer may select to provide the annuity. PBGC’s guarantee ends when your employer purchases your annuity or gives you the lump-sum payment.
If the plan is not fully funded, the employer may apply for a distress termination if the employer is in financial distress. To do so, however, the employer must prove to a bankruptcy court or to PBGC that the employer cannot remain in business unless the plan is terminated. If the application is granted, PBGC will take over the plan as trustee and pay plan benefits, up to the legal limits, using plan assets and PBGC guarantee funds.
^ Top
When PBGC terminates a pension plan
Under certain circumstances, PBGC may take action on its own to end a pension plan. Most terminations initiated by PBGC occur when PBGC determines that plan termination is needed to protect the interests of plan participants or of the PBGC insurance program. PBGC can do so if, for example, a plan does not have enough money to pay benefits currently due.
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How you will know if your plan is ending
If your employer wants to end the plan, your plan administrator must notify you in writing that your plan is ending. You must get this notice, called the Notice of Intent to Terminate, at least 60 days before the "termination" date. If PBGC is terminating the plan, we notify the plan administrator and often publish a notice about our action in local and national newspapers.
In a standard termination, you should receive a second letter describing the benefits you will receive, called the Notice of Plan Benefits, generally no later than six months after the date proposed for your plan’s termination.
In a distress termination, or a termination initiated by PBGC, our communication with you begins when we take over your plan as trustee. Initially we will provide you with general information about the pension insurance program and our guarantees. We will be able to provide more specific information about your benefits after we have had an opportunity to review the plan’s records, assets, benefit liabilities, and your participation in the plan.
^ Top
Additional benefits after a plan ends
You cannot earn additional benefits after the plan ends.

 

[Flyer1015]

When's the last time you heard of an "instant termination" at a union airline?

I have, at our airline. Crap happens.

 

[jayme]

And do you think that employee would have fared better or worse without a union? How about all the other guys whose jobs were protected?

 

[BeachBummer]

I have, at our airline. Crap happens.

Union or not, people do some dumbA$$stuff. The union will not save you from utter stupidity.

honest mistake? yea, you'll keep you job. Blatantly dangerouse: you'll probably be fired, and stay gone.

 

[coogebeachhotel]

The same people who gave it away.....

A350

Let me guess you have recall as well at an airline? Who got you that recall(big guess)? Give it up if you don't like that. Ahhhh

 

[A350]

Questioning my integrity are you? My wagon is hitched to this horse.

Recall? Resigned already and wouldn't go back even if I could.

A350