The future for ASA

[SkyWstman]

There are times in life when you just have to spend a few bucks more for magnum shells. An in house union would be like having one of those spring action BB guns.

 

[Tomct]

CF-34 you nailed it right on the head! They are the better of the NECESSARY EVILS!
KO...Have another glass of Kool-Aid! It is that thought process that got you in the situation you guys are now. According to this board, there are quite a few Skws people who are tired of getting the ole ram-rod in the ass by mgmnt! You might want to re-tink your thought process!

 

[Tomct]

AF...I am not saying that merging the two unions would be easy! A percentage merge would probably work the best for everyone. The benefit would be ONE STRONG GROUP of pilots. We would be a MAJOR Airline. Almost 4000 pilots strong. It would be a good thing!
Skywstman...you are absolutely right! One thing ALPA has is TONS of money. An in-house would not have those kinds of resources.

 

[Butters]

I personally know someone at a regional who lost his medical due to a serious illness. The Feds didn't want to give it back. ALPA Medical spent an enormous amount of time and $ getting this individual back in the cockpit.

I am certainly no big fan of Uncle Duane or the Major Airline Mafia that runs ALPA, but an in house union will simply not work at a regional . There isn't enough income from the dues a few thousand RJ drivers can contribute. And even if it DID work, it will never be able to match the resources of ALPA as far as things like Legal, Medical, Strike Funds etc.

ALPA National may not be the miracle cure some would like, but neither is it the Boogey man others think it is.

It's not perfect, but it's the best we're gonna do.

Very well said.

 

[ArcticFlier]

AF...I am not saying that merging the two unions would be easy! A percentage merge would probably work the best for everyone. The benefit would be ONE STRONG GROUP of pilots. We would be a MAJOR Airline. Almost 4000 pilots strong. It would be a good thing!
Skywstman...you are absolutely right! One thing ALPA has is TONS of money. An in-house would not have those kinds of resources.

Sorry. I think my tone was misunderstood (or maybe I'm misunderstanding yours ). I'm genuinely curious how two pilot groups go about merging into one group without managements blessing. If SGU wants to run SKYW/ASA as two seperate entities, how do we change that? Didn't you guys try that at ASA/Comair/DAL? What/who shot that down?


AF

 

[FreightNazi]

No aeromedical assistance, no safety department...

You are right. We here at UPS are not ALPA and we have not aeromedical assistance, no safety department...etc. LOL! ALPA is about as impotent a union as you will ever see and for you regional guys that think ALPA is your best option, you are sadly mistaken. You are much better off inhouse as your dues go to support YOUR pilot group ONLY. It's well established that ALPA will not fight for much of anything, let alone the interests of regional pilots. Those of you that are worried about not getting all the bennies of ALPA, well those are easily contracted for or can be established inhouse.

 

[Icelandair]

What about the Teamsters?

 

[CF34-3B1]

You are right. We here at UPS are not ALPA and we have not aeromedical assistance, no safety department...etc. LOL! ALPA is about as impotent a union as you will ever see and for you regional guys that think ALPA is your best option, you are sadly mistaken. You are much better off inhouse as your dues go to support YOUR pilot group ONLY. It's well established that ALPA will not fight for much of anything, let alone the interests of regional pilots. Those of you that are worried about not getting all the bennies of ALPA, well those are easily contracted for or can be established inhouse.

Supporting an inhouse union is fine when you're talking about dues from a pilot group of 4 or 5 or 8 thousand, most of whom have an average income way into the 6 figures.

Things get a little less rosey when you do the math for an average regional, or even a big one like a combined ASA/SkyWest.

Say 4000 or so pilots. 1/2 FOs, and 1/2 Captains.

2000 FOs. Factor in the 1st year guys and what is the average FO pay across the system? Mid 20s to low 30s? Let's be generous and say 30k. Times 2% dues times 2000 FOs = $1,200,000

2000 Captains, again, being generous, let's say an average income of $70000. Times 2% times 2000 Captains = $2,800,000

So a yearly in house union budget of 4 million.

Now go try to contract all the services of ALPA National for that, and still have anything left over for things like Family Awareness and Heaven forbid, Strike Pay.

Do the math on the 89 day Comair strike and see how far an inhouse union would have gone for those guys.

Inhouse unions may work at a major, but a regional just can't generate the income to support one.

As far as our dues going to support other pilot groups, with most ALPA regionals, it's quite the opposite.

 

[Texx]

Are you high? I think that would be terrible. ALPA sucks for regionals.
Skywest needs an in-house union

I thought you guys had a in-house union?

Can your in-house union represent a pilot that is having certificate action by the FAA?

Will your management supply a lawyer to fight for him if something goes wrong?
(TSA, sexual harassment etc...)

ALPA does a lot more than represent a pilot group for a contract. I pay about $1200 a year in dues, tax deductable, but if I need a aviation attorney I have one and it only cost me my dues. Last time I checked a good aviation lawyer is going for about $300 per hour.

 

[capt. megadeth]

I thought you guys had a in-house union?

Can your in-house union represent a pilot that is having certificate action by the FAA?

Will your management supply a lawyer to fight for him if something goes wrong?
(TSA, sexual harassment etc...)

.

Actually.......yes!

For all those opposed to an in-house.....I understand that ALPA has more resources, but you gotta start with baby steps. Sure in the beginning it will not be what ALPA is, but was ALPA what it is today in the beginning? What is essential to success in any union is the leadership. If you have a bunch of pansies, of course it won't work. If you have a good solid foundation and guys/gals with ba!!s and great leadership, eventually it will be good. The problem these days is that too many people are strictly out for themselves only which creates a divided pilot group which is exactly what management jerks off to thinking about every night.