Thanks Again ALPA

[PCL_128]

Hey scooter your post (number 26) was referring to RLA strikes so tell me about the one ALPA ran since the 80's that was successful.

NWA '98 and CMR '01 come to mind.

 

[CopilotDoug]

So what you're saying is that you think a union should be able to get you massive pay raises even when a carrier is losing massive amounts of money and slipping towards liquidation? Get real

Not saying that at all...just emphasizing the point that ALPA takes what management is willing to give them...just like ANY Union. What it boils down to is that there is nothing special or magical about the ALPA Logo.

ALPA produces results when it's possible to produce results. Had FedEx not been ALPA, then they wouldn't have gotten as good a contract in '06. Companies don't just hand over money to employees when they turn a profit, you have to fight for it.

The FDX pilots know better than you. They decertified ALPA in the early '90s because they thought they could do better themselves, and they created their own union called the FPA. After a few years of FPA failure, they realized that they had made a big mistake and voted in record numbers to bring back ALPA. They've had some of ALPA's highest approval ratings ever since.

While UPS and NetJets have shown that it can be done without ALPA. Why is ALPA so special again?

And despite your pessimism, ALPA produces results on Cap Hill. ALPA actually has the biggest PAC in the airline industry. ALPA contributes more money to politicians from ALPA-PAC than the ATA does.

And how do the PAC contributions size up against corporate contributions? I'm guessing they're not as much.

CMR - What don't you understand about bankruptcy?

Just want to make sure ALPA gets all the credit they deserve.

PCL - You vote for Bush, you suffer the consequences of an anti-labor NMB. Things are about to change.

Yes...with the economy in the toilet and Obama racing around the globe to appease tin pot dictators...ALPA will be in line for a while.

MAG - ...Now they're only a year away from negotiations again under the Obama NMB when their company will likely be doing better. Smart strategy. I'm not surprised that you're not bright enough to understand that, though.

I forgot, JO and his attorney only know how to play fair:laugh:

What's so special again about ALPA? Besides the magazine of course...

 

[PCL_128]

Not saying that at all...just emphasizing the point that ALPA takes what management is willing to give them...just like ANY Union. What it boils down to is that there is nothing special or magical about the ALPA Logo.

No, ALPA gets what they negotiate. I don't know why this is so difficult for you to understand. Management is not benevolent. You have to fight for every scrap.

While UPS and NetJets have shown that it can be done without ALPA. Why is ALPA so special again?

NetJets isn't an airline, so I wouldn't expect them to need the Air Line Pilots Association. As for UPS, their contract doesn't match up to the FDX agreement that was negotiated by ALPA. I'd rather have ALPA representing me than the IPA if I needed help.

And how do the PAC contributions size up against corporate contributions? I'm guessing they're not as much.

I'm guessing you'd better do some better research next time.

What's so special again about ALPA?

Effectiveness.

 

[sgu]

I would not call ALPA "Effective"? In what way? How effective were they against age 65? USAir vs AWA? Atlas VS STN(AABO), Atlas vs Polar??
All they have done is screwed up!

 

[PHXFLYR]

All they do is "screw up ?? " Care to explain why 747 was recently placed into trusteeship. Why 1124 can't seem to get the severance money for the released Airborne guys their company owes them ? Hell, you just voted in a union that takes screwing up and elevates it to an art form.


PHXFLYR

 

[CopilotDoug]

No, ALPA gets what they negotiate. I don't know why this is so difficult for you to understand. Management is not benevolent. You have to fight for every scrap.

And what ALPA negotiates is nothing over or above what any other Union would negotiate.

As for UPS, their contract doesn't match up to the FDX agreement that was negotiated by ALPA. I'd rather have ALPA representing me than the IPA if I needed help.

Why would they match up? Are they the same management team and pilot group? How many Management Pilots fly for FedEx? It's a comparison using false reasoning that You and Rez love to get hung up on. If you're going to use that...why not ask the reason for the contract disparities for ALPA represented carriers flying similar equipment? KittyHawk and FedEx???

I'm guessing you'd better do some better research next time.

...because you know it's true. And Rez will be the first to tell you that Money talks in D.C.

Effectiveness.

Maybe effectiveness at brainwashing...I can see why you're a poster child for the ALPA Youth.

Alas, I've taken up too much of your time. Time for you to get back to pointing the finger at the UAL pilots for the failures of ALPA. Maybe Rez will jump in and let them know they are ruining his contract.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

And what ALPA negotiates is nothing over or above what any other Union would negotiate.

Why would they match up? Are they the same management team and pilot group? How many Management Pilots fly for FedEx? It's a comparison using false reasoning that You and Rez love to get hung up on. If you're going to use that...why not ask the reason for the contract disparities for ALPA represented carriers flying similar equipment? KittyHawk and FedEx???



...because you know it's true. And Rez will be the first to tell you that Money talks in D.C.



Maybe effectiveness at brainwashing...I can see why you're a poster child for the ALPA Youth.

Alas, I've taken up too much of your time. Time for you to get back to pointing the finger at the UAL pilots for the failures of ALPA. Maybe Rez will jump in and let them know they are ruining his contract.

Then don't apply to an ALPA carrier and don't be a member..... problem solved?

 

[CopilotDoug]

Then don't apply to an ALPA carrier and don't be a member..... problem solved?

Better still, why not push for decertification of ALPA?

 

[zman]

UAL MEC= voted in by UAL pilots

UAL Scope= given away by UAL MEC

ALPA= a law firm with an insurance branch

Its easier to blame others for your voting errors then to blame ALPA national.

 

[bluefin]

If UAL pilots do have a chance to strike, lets see what kind of unity we have in the industry. How many express carriers out there are represented by Alpa? or for that matter represented by a union? Are these carriers going to respect the line? remember we are all unionized, right. The majority of this is UAL pilots fault. When the rj first appeared, it was considered beneath them to even think about flying the 50 seater. Now its too late to do one thing about it except jet for jobs and sitting in the right seat for 20 bucks an hr. This scope train for UAL has left the station and is not returning. The only fight left is other carriers that have scope, is to fight and keep it in check. Pilots are their own worst enemies.