SWA wants to fly from HOU to MEX and SouthAmerica

[Flopgut]

It's going to be the city of HOU to lose, if so, my bet all international shifts to AUS or SAT. Their gain, HOU better choose wisely.

The city of Houston has chosen, It's IAH. You can do anything you want at that airport, just get in line and compete for it. No more hand outs.

 

[ASADFW7]

I am guilty of being the idiot. I am human. A apology with no disclaimers.

 

[Flopgut]

Nicely stated....

 

[Cometman]

The city of Houston has chosen, It's IAH. You can do anything you want at that airport, just get in line and compete for it. No more hand outs.

I believe the article said that SWA will pay for all the facilities and it will not cost the taxpayer anything. Having said that, it appears you would be concerned because you cannot compete against SWA.

 

[Whataburger]

If our 25 international flights a day out of Houston are gonna topple the economy, split the city in two, put United into a tailspin, and wreck the air traffic system; then United, the city of Houston and the FAA have much bigger issues they need to address.

Standby for Houston's second dose of the Southwest Effect. The city and it's people will win.

 

[scoreboardII]

The city of Houston has chosen, It's IAH. You can do anything you want at that airport, just get in line and compete for it. No more hand outs.

Like DFW? No thanks, free market baby, get in line. Here comes SWA.

 

[fam62c]

What is it with Texas and these barriers to competition? More flights out of more airports to more places is a good thing. Some communities are losing air service and begging to get it back. Are you telling me the people of Houston would say no to more air service if you polled them? Have a referendum and let the consumers decide what is best.

 

[On Your Six]

So much for unbiased moderating.

"In one post you mention smaller footprint, and the next you try to justify the crap out of your mouth. Your an idiot."

This is what I got when I said something far more tame.



Dear On Your Six,

You have received an infraction at Flightinfo.com Hangar.

Reason: Insulted Other Member(s)
-------
I asked you to stop being disruptive, and you insist on hiding behind the cloak of help, when you are being intrusive and condescending.
-------

This infraction is worth 1 point(s) and may result in restricted access until it expires. Serious infractions will never expire.



Godspeed!


The OYSter

 

[ASADFW7]

I was referring to the American Airlines bankruptcy speculation, not about SWA. I have a friend in maintenance there who is about to lose his job. Not easy has his wife had a double mastectomy this year, and they have a one year old as well as a couple other kids. I wasn't referring to SWA. Calling one person am idiot is within the TOS, stirring up a whole forum is different. I apologized let's move on.

 

[Flopgut]

I believe the article said that SWA will pay for all the facilities and it will not cost the taxpayer anything. Having said that, it appears you would be concerned because you cannot compete against SWA.

If our 25 international flights a day out of Houston are gonna topple the economy, split the city in two, put United into a tailspin, and wreck the air traffic system; then United, the city of Houston and the FAA have much bigger issues they need to address.

Standby for Houston's second dose of the Southwest Effect. The city and it's people will win.

Like DFW? No thanks, free market baby, get in line. Here comes SWA.

There is a lot more to this type flying, in this location, than you guys realize. Traffic over the Gulf is congested. The line-up sequence starts at the gates. The larger number of flights that depart IAH don't need to get jammed up with Hobby departures. Maybe if we keep you guys below FL230, or put you behind any/all IAH traffic it would work? You'll have to live with something like that if you pull this off. (and then the SWA bawling will really start)

Another problem is that SWA wants to deny equal access to whatever they carve out for themselves. That aint going to work. Let everybody in on whatever you get. We'll be down there. Us Continental Bubbas kicked you butts once, we'll kick it again. SWA effect my a$$ Whataburger. If the city does the right thing and looks at what you guys did to Ft. Worth/Dallas they'll send you up to IAH and see if you can handle a fair fight. The "SWA effect" is snake oil these days boys....

 

[Double Shot]

When did continetal ever kick southwest butts. Are you thinking continental lite? Being a former continental guy i'm not to worried about anything you guys can do. Instead of worring about southwest...why dont you get an industry leading contract. Or perhaps try to merge the seniority list with united.

Continental is the most dysfunctional pilot group out there. Flop keep barking....but we all know your pilot group has NO bite!

 

[Saluki Dawg]

Sounds good Flop. Why don't you guys just open up 5-6 Gates for us over at Terminal E, and we'll come right on up there. While you're at it, why don't you let TACA, AeroMexico, Air France, Emirates, BA, and KLM park over there too. After all, it isn't fair that Continental spent all of their own money building that beautiful new Terminal to keep it all to themselves now is it?

 

[On Your Six]

I was referring to the American Airlines bankruptcy speculation, not about SWA. I have a friend in maintenance there who is about to lose his job. Not easy has his wife had a double mastectomy this year, and they have a one year old as well as a couple other kids. I wasn't referring to SWA. Calling one person am idiot is within the TOS, stirring up a whole forum is different. I apologized let's move on.

If I call someone an idiot, I get a week off. Look, understand it is a double standard, and let's move on. I didn't know you knew someone there, how could I know that? Getting mad at me for something I don't know about you and your friend is WRONG. I have actually been through the same thing at my previous company, so I know it sux. And your buddy at SWA was the one who started talking about AA and possible scenarios, not me. Can I not join in on speculation if it is brought up, or do I have to turn my head and go to another thread? And how do you know someone is purposely trying to "stir up" a whole forum? Maybe it's an honest question? There, I feel better.



Godspeed!


The OYSter

 

[ASADFW7]

Yep, tomorrow is a new day. I have been spending much less time on here, and did not follow the thread as closely as others. As I stated before I was wrong to call you an idiot, I apologized, I tried not to play the double standard, and I will take my lumps like a man. I am accountable as well for my interaction on the forum. I did not delete or moderate this thread in recent interactions to my advantage or a perceived bias.

As for those who wonder how we moderate, mostly it is from reported posts, in reference to the TOS. Other users who at times inflame a discussion that destroys a topic have their posts reported more often which draws attention to themselves. It isn't that complicated. Cheers.

 

[Flopgut]

When did continetal ever kick southwest butts. Are you thinking continental lite? Being a former continental guy i'm not to worried about anything you guys can do. Instead of worring about southwest...why dont you get an industry leading contract. Or perhaps try to merge the seniority list with united.

Continental is the most dysfunctional pilot group out there. Flop keep barking....but we all know your pilot group has NO bite!

Pbly happened after you left. It was just a few years ago. SWA wanted to run CAL out of CLE because they thought there was some blood in the water. We put hourly M80s into Hobby/CLE market and SWA blinked. We didn't let up until SWA agreed to leave IAH.

I'm sure you guys tell each other a different version. But that's the truth.

BTW: Thank everybody over for being the first to fly with no pension and age 65 and all. You guys are hard core...

 

[Flopgut]

Sounds good Flop. Why don't you guys just open up 5-6 Gates for us over at Terminal E, and we'll come right on up there. While you're at it, why don't you let TACA, AeroMexico, Air France, Emirates, BA, and KLM park over there too. After all, it isn't fair that Continental spent all of their own money building that beautiful new Terminal to keep it all to themselves now is it?

Well Dude, you're making my point and you don't even realize it.

Do you doubt that you would not be allowed to build your own Terminal E at IAH? Heck no man! The airport would be fine with it. And frankly I would too. Put your corndog next to our airplane and we'll see how it goes? But you've got to pay to play and it's a level playing field. You guys want to build something separate at a separate airport where there is no access for anybody but you. We [CAL] didn't get to knock down the old terminal, or close the gates, or deny anybody access. Not at all. In fact, CAL had to update most of the gates before they were forced to abandon them for other airlines. Build something nice for yourselves at Hobby and then put something suitably equal in place for the competition. The aforementioned TACA and AeroMexico would love to land there and sell against your tickets to Mexico.

You guys don't want to compete.

*edit* You know this post of yours Saluki is very telling. Usually when you build something like terminal E, you are required to provide adequate space for your competition. If it's not there, you put it there. Your airline has always skirted the norm at almost all of you biggest airports. It doesn't even occur to you what it is to have a level playing field, does it? When it really counted, you've always had a gimmee of some sort. For an airline that shamelessly markets itself using it's own employees as 'officials" who throw "flags" at the competition's bag fees, you sure make a great effort at not actually competeing....

 

[humveedriver]

Do the pilots at SWA decide what new service will be conducted from which airports? Or is it that pilots from other airlines expect the SWA pilots to go on strike because flying international out of Hobby is somehow taboo? And why would anyone be even remotely surprised by this attempt after SWA bought AT in part for it's international operations?

 

[Cometman]

*edit* You know this post of yours Saluki is very telling. Usually when you build something like terminal E, you are required to provide adequate space for your competition. If it's not there, you put it there. Your airline has always skirted the norm at almost all of you biggest airports. It doesn't even occur to you what it is to have a level playing field, does it? When it really counted, you've always had a gimmee of some sort. For an airline that shamelessly markets itself using it's own employees as 'officials" who throw "flags" at the competition's bag fees, you sure make a great effort at not actually competeing....

Stop crying and grow up. If the city approves it and you want to compete then you can fly from there also.

 

[SKC]

The thing that cracks me up the most about Flop is that "equal playing field" equals SWA uprooting their operation to move to IAH.

Why aren't you crying about MDW? UACO has a huge operation from ORD....but yet you aren't wailing about MDW's intl ops. Why is that? Surely it's not because a large city can support TWO airports with intl operations, is it?

Why aren't you crying about the LAX area, the NYC area, the bay area? Look at all of that "injustice". City after city being cheated by multiple airports running international operations. It's amazing they are all still in existence.

 

[Bwipilot]

The posters on this threads are idiots and crony capitalists. On one hand they cry that SWA isn't willing to compete at IAH--and then complaining that IAH can't compete with Hobby. Boo hoo! I can't make it on my own so I'm going to pay off the government to let me win.

 

[Flopgut]

After the last 12 years, all I want to do is see my airline continue to square off with SWA. I don't care what airport. I don't care which direction. I'm sick of you running away.

 

[Flopgut]

The thing that cracks me up the most about Flop is that "equal playing field" equals SWA uprooting their operation to move to IAH.

Why is that? You were there. Fairly recently. Why can't you go back? It's where everybody else is that is flying international flights. Why should the city have to step in and make a special effort for you? Answer: You can't compete if you don't get a lot of help.

Additionally, with regard to these other cities, I think we can all agree that Canada does not count. Right?

 

[Double Shot]

Mexico doesnt count either. Flop quit crying.

 

[Whataburger]

Let's see: fight someone on my terms or their terms? Easy answer.

Flop congrats on kicking our a$$ in IAH. Continental got every thing else right in bankruptcy court right?

 

[Bake]

I'm sure us pilots are going to work out this Hobby thing here on flight info. So far, it's a tie.

 

[Flopgut]

Mexico doesnt count either.

I need to rephrase that. North doesn't matter. South sure does...

Let's see: fight someone on my terms or their terms? Easy answer.

Flop congrats on kicking our a$$ in IAH. Continental got every thing else right in bankruptcy court right?

You know what my friend? I'll try to see your point about bk if you will try to understand my point about these anticompetitive airport deals that are slanted to SWA? They are both outside the level playing field and they need to stop. Both [all] airlines are guilty in this regard. Can you and I agree on that?

I'm outta here for Spring Break with the kids. We're headed to the woods, so no internet.

 

[scoreboardII]

After the last 12 years, all I want to do is see my airline continue to square off with SWA. I don't care what airport. I don't care which direction. I'm sick of you running away.

Running away?

So you are OK with sluggin it out with your concessionary contract?

Your'e losing it.

Who bought whom again? UAL or COnti?

 

[General Lee]

Running away?

So you are OK with sluggin it out with your concessionary contract?

Your'e losing it.

Who bought whom again? UAL or COnti?

Does it matter? They are making 6 times the profit SWA is now. We all want them to get a better contract, but they are turning into a monster. I see it in far away places too, like Narita. They have 40 Whales (744s) and more than 60 777s, and all of that international revenue can be used to go after the rest of us. If they wanted to waste money going after you in HOU, I bet they could afford it, and it wouldn't get you back to the profitable quarters that you are used to. Let's hope they do get a better contract, which will allow them to slow down on their expansion.


Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[scoreboardII]

Here's the bottom line, airtravel intra-US cannot be subsidized by airtravel outside the country, at best it only subsidizes the intl routes that actually are flown, not help in making money on say a DAL-LAX or ATL-SEA.

The legacies have tried to do this for decades against the LCC's, they've lost more money than all of aviation has made since Wilbur said "clear prop".

Another legacy problem is the work less for more pay attitude instead of work more for more pay, that is a socialistic failure in the making, as evident by every brankruptcy.

The only issue right now is SWA is at the tipping point every legacy was at when they made the decision to step outside CONUS. There will be higher costs, lower returns till they find the sweet spot, and they'll find it with lower cost, lower fares, and higher RASM.

 

[Flopgut]

So you are OK with sluggin it out with your concessionary contract?

Look, I want a BIG raise. The only reason I go to work is to get that raise or strike this crap-hole. But my concessionary contract doesn't pay that much less than yours compared to what you guys made for the first 20 years. If you have to compete against that sort of disparity, well, you earned it.

Here's the bottom line, airtravel intra-US cannot be subsidized by airtravel outside the country, at best it only subsidizes the intl routes that actually are flown, not help in making money on say a DAL-LAX or ATL-SEA.

The legacies have tried to do this for decades against the LCC's, they've lost more money than all of aviation has made since Wilbur said "clear prop".

Another legacy problem is the work less for more pay attitude instead of work more for more pay, that is a socialistic failure in the making, as evident by every brankruptcy.

The only issue right now is SWA is at the tipping point every legacy was at when they made the decision to step outside CONUS. There will be higher costs, lower returns till they find the sweet spot, and they'll find it with lower cost, lower fares, and higher RASM.

You don't understand much about legacy airlines and you really aren't getting the bigger picture here. SWA is the single real success story out of de-regulation. (Even according to the guy who wrote it) But those of us who understand the history know it was the monopoly at Love Field, not de-regulation, that kept SWA alive. So now it's time for SWA to fly outside the Country and they want [what amounts to] another airport monopoly?!?! Is there NO difference between what the SWA with 3 planes and no money, and the SWA with 600 planes and billions of dollars needs to be successful?! Apart from an airport monopoly, SWA can't flourish? So other than bk every legacy and ruin thousands of workers lives, what did de-regulation accomplish?!