SWA Pilot union gives away flying!

[Tejas-Jet]

Boy, the web sites are really buzzing. The SWAPA forum and some anonymous forums have lots of SWA
Pilots angrily telling us how they are gonna vote on this.

For all the bluster and the "I'm voting NO" statements....remember we saw the same amount of "no" rhetoric when Herb offered us the bribe of the 2 yr extension on the then-10 yr contract. That contract has now been in effect for 12 plus years.

Why? Because it passed by almost 70% ....thats why. And that after the then-SWAPA BOD sent it out with a "no" vote recommendation.

BTW...the SWAPA PResident at that time got us the 2nd highest pay raise in SWAPA history...and was promptly voted out of office in the next election.

Goes to show you how fincky pilots can be.

Sorry...but this one passes.....codeshare and all.

 

[RedDogC130]

Hey MACH 80...where are the raises from 2006...if we do not get the money from then it is a concessionary contract. period. I think there were record profits that year right? Try to look 15 years down the road and see how this wouuld affect the pilot group with this codeshare. So what is your vote....please say if you have decided. Mine is NO.

 

[GuppyWN]

Dog,

We got a raise in 2006. It was the last "bump" on the day the contract became amendable.

Gup

 

[maxblast72]

You guys got no RJs, a raise and are bitching? Seriously?

I need to introduce you to some of my friends over at US Air.

The reasons alot of pilots bitch is due to a major change in career expectations. We have had this at Airtran with upgrades times going from 2.5 years to 8-10 years within a years time. I imagine alot of the unhappy people at Southwest are 2002-2004 hires that were expecting 5-7 year upgrade and are now looking at 10-12 years with the 65 rules and no growth.

It is easy for the senior people to be happy since it isn't their expectations that have changed greatly. Happens at every airline.

 

[Whine Lover]

"In a courtroom on the campus of Indiana University on Wednesday, March 25, Judge Lorch approved .... the sale of the ATA certificate and LGA gates to Southwest. "

 

[vixin]

AA767,
The rates top out at 70%.
Gup
I dont know why guys dont understand we received a raise in 06'.

Mach80
My guess is you are a senior I have mine guy, but for the rest of us this TA is crap to be nice. There are several 4 digit guys that are vocal about voting it down. To them I say thanks for looking out for the entire pilot group. There are so many holes and restrictions on the pilots side it isnt funny.Yet the company side has teeth. This TA is a POS and I hope it gets voted down. The NC did a very poor job. Them and the sweet 16 should be kicked out of SWAPull property.

 

[Slug]

Other than codeshare, one of the biggest problems is that this POS TA destroys almost all flexibility in scheduling. 2 weekends a month are closed to trading. What you bid is what you get on those weekends. It is at the discretion of the company which two. You can only drop 4 duty periods (days) a month. Even if you fill those 4 days in, you cannot drop another day, even if picking something else up. Half of the lance captains go back to F/Os. Very little ability to drop stuff and even less ability to pick stuff up. The guys that do stay lances can only pick up 9 duty periods a month. I laugh at Mach 80 because he will lose flexibility too. If he wanted to drop a trip, put it in giveaway and, poof it was gone. Not so now, there will be no starving lances to pick it up.

Despite miniscule raises, temporary protection of our flying, some addition to retirement (less than $1500/year for me), almost guaranteed lack of raises in '10 and '11, this TA sucks pretty bad.


Slug

 

[pipe]

Think of this though. To get from lets say MDW, to YYZ on Westjet, it would not be on you. It would be on them. Be careful.

It takes a whole bunch of flights to Canada and Mexico to get to the 6% ASM cap.

PIPE

 

[Dude]

There are, without question, negatives in this TA. However, the pro column is much bigger than the con column.

• Pay raises; Retro; 2% 401k bump (while others are decreasing); Scope language that actually defines all of our flying and that only we can do it; NO RJs unless we purchase a carrier that already operates them and then it remains status quo; prohibition on domestic codeshare; and some other gains.
• Reduction (by half and Lances get hosed, but there's an increase in Captain positions) in the Lance Captain program; allowance of trans-border codeshare and little restrictions on that; ELITT restrictions (this one sux); first year pay potential reduced; and a few other negatives.

The point being that there is NO perfect agreement. What good is a perfect contract when a company can be noncompliant at will with the support of an arbitrator? Just ask the APA how good their language is to them when a judge gets a hold of it. If any company wants to participate in any activity-they will. Labor cannot stop it when judges won't even uphold agreements.

We locked out domestic codeshare, wetleases, alter-ego flying, far-international codeshare, Hawaii, Alaska, and RJ's. Everyone is getting spooled up over the "duration of the agreement" language. This agreement is amendable, it doesn't expire. When the contract is amendable, we remain status quo and we keep trucking as if the contract went on forever.

News Flash: We are back at the table in 2011 and it would take a job action to get codehsare off the property. If you don't like codeshare, call Ike and Hugo. They are the ones that wanted it instead of a merger with ATA. They were asked and went the codeshare route. Tell Ike and Hugo how you feel and thank them for codeshare because they brought it to you.

 

[thruthemurk]

Just curious as to what the 401K or Bfund is bumping to. In addition, do you get an automatic profit sharing or stock purchase/issuance program?

Thanks from a JB guy surrounded by guys who don't understand the difference between profit sharing and retirement.

Good Luck,
Murk