SWA, PHL and JBLU "Hot Flash"

[FLB717]

Redtails,
I thankyou for letting me know how bad my companies product is, I was hoping no one noticed. In fact I tell everyone thanks for not flying Jetblue in Atlanta because of the great concern it gives me in not sleeping well at night. Your cost are low and it will remain so as long as you continue to skim the cream of the long haul large demand routes. As our 737's come on line Ryan will go away and our CSM will drop and profits I fell will rise towards yours. And I will be very interested in how fast and well you build a feed system with your RJ's, and your cost to operate short haul will rise compared to your current structure. I think you will find building a feed system to small cities with every DCI and CoEx RJ doing the same is different from JFK to LAX. And yeah incentives to small cities is nice. It provides some incentive for the people who ask us to come and lower prices to fly us instead of using us for freq flyer services on the Majors. Now go kick your dog or something.

 

[flyingitalian]

lowecur,
You gotta be kidding me with all the emb190 is the savior stuff. Its an airplane that does not even exist. As a pilot for the launch of the 145 I can tell you that emb overstates the performance of their aircraft. It took a few years to get the 145 to where it is today, but I can tell you the performance is not as advertised. Also with the new passenger weights the 145 cant even carry a full load and bags.

Look the 190 may indeed turn out to be a nice airplane, but its not even here yet. Hanging the success or failure of an airline on one particular airplane is smokin crack.

 

[Redtails]

Lighten up Airtrans. There are quite a few communities that have incentive packages too for JBLU, but we've yet to take any "handouts". I think it'll be interesting to see the approach the LCCs take to expansion. JBLU and Southwest with adding Boston and Philadelphia respectively next year could be the only cities they bring on for all of next year (Connect the dots). This year, B6 only added San Diego, minus Atlanta, of course. How many cities did AirTran bring on? How many gates did they get in DFW? I think FL's expansion plans are quite aggressive and should be lauded-- I also believe that AA won't let you ride unreigned either in their backyard (they've realigned their assets for a fight in ORD and DFW). Good luck and God speed, FL, you've got a fine company, you don't need to defend it so hard...

 

[lowecur]

LiveFreeorDie

Lighten up, paly.

Those who post here with frequency all have an agenda. Whether it's to defend their airline, their contract or inform others, it's all about "freedom of speech" and thought!

People that don't agree with me, that's fine! I respect that. I would never tell someone that they should "move along," because I don't agree with them.

You should try a little more to live up to your username. Tolerance is a virtue that more of us need to live up to.

On the stock price. Come on, do you really believe that I think I influence the price of the stock? Don't be so nieve.

 

[Flying Freddie]

nieve?

 

[lowecur]

flyingfreddie

Naive.

Senior moment.

 

[B6Busdriver]

B6Busdriver..

My comments were not a slight of JB..More a responce to Mike Boyds ranting about the cat fight between JB and SWA..

I happen to think that JB has a great product but its still too early to tell where they will fit into the market IMHO..

If i have offended any of you great B6 folks then i am truly sorry..

Mike

MLB,
Your comments don't offend me in the slightest. That said the attitude of your post would scare me if I worked for SWA. I think it's foolish to take ANY competition for granted. One thing the management of jetBlue stresses is "we are only as good as our last flight." Our CEO and president ride the jumpseat frequently and they are the first to say we can never take any competition for granted. Humility really is a good thing. SWA is not immune to competition. To think change is not necessary for long term survivability is foolish. One always has to look at ways to improve.

Wether you like Boyd's article or not the guy has a pretty good history. I've been reading his website for years. He called the UAL-U merger just as it happened. He has talked for years about the 100 seat airplane market and how there is a void to be filled. He's dead on about airport security.

I'm too lazy to counter every argument you made against Boyd's article but here are a few:
Gates/slots will be built ,obtained, purchased,or acquired through political means. There are only a handful of slot controlled airports in this country so this won't be too big a factor. The biggest slot problem is going to be LGB. I expect very few slots to be added because of the noise issues.
As far as the jury being out for long term survivability. IMHO the jury is out for EVERY airline. B6 had 3 flights a day out of ATL. Hardly make or break for an airline.
Metrojet was hardly competition. All Ghettojet did was exacerbate U's financial problems. CAL Lite darn near put the company out of business.
I live near MHT and let me tell ya there are many Mass plates in the airport parking lot. Some of those people might very well go to Logan. Getting in and out of MHT is no picnic either. To think jetBlue might not take some traffic is nuts!
As for the 170 it's flying and will be delivered shortly. The 190 is supposed to fly 2nd quarter 2004. The 190 as you know is just a stretch of the 170.


As for being the media darlings. Personally I hate seeing these flowery articles that laud jetBlue. I would much rather be the quiet company that comes out of nowhere. The media loves to build you up and then tear you to shreds. You have to admit before jetBlue SWA has been the media darling of the airline world.

You work for the greatest major airline out there. Thanks to you and your co-workers for the many jumpseats and passes that have provided my family with ability to travel.

 

[mad691]

The bottom line is eventually the top 3 or 4 LCC's are going to bump heads. It will be interesting to see how they all react to each other. All these LCC's have different products to offer. Airtran with business class, Jetblue with IFE, leather seats and Southwest with unassigned seating. One thing is for sure I do believe Usairways has a full plate. They will be probably the ones to hurt the most.

 

[SWA/FO]

I'd say the LCC's are not going to be going at it until all the Lagacy Carriers are gone. An LCC fighting an LCC is a war! An LCC picking on a Lagacy Carrier now thats easy, there is so much to pick on.

 

[MLBWINGBORN]

B6Busdriver..

Im not too sure what you mean by my attitude..

You seem to feel that im some how not taking JB seriously..

Trust me when i say that everyone at SWA..My self included.. takes all forms of any competition seriously..

Again..My post was directed at Mr Boyds stretch of an artical..

He presumes that SWA making changes based on JB is some new thing that is some sort of wake up call for our managment..

Mr Boyds slant would lead most folks to believe that SWA has not had anything but a free pass for the last decade when it comes to our growth..

He then goes on to say that SWA is one tough and capable airline and our managment folks know what they are doing..

Of the three above assumptions presented by Mr Boyd only one is true IMHO..

Feel free to guess which one..

Mike

 

[General Lee]

SWA/FO,

It might take awhile to get rid of all the legacy carriers now that the economy is coming back----remember that the Legacy carriers also fly INTL ops and they are usually very profitable in good times. Also, some Legacy carriers---like Delta---have put in a defensive measure--Song---that might sting some LCCs. In better economic times, everybody wins. And, Jetblue and Southwest will eventually duke it out as they grow bigger---and that won't be easy on either of them. En-----joy!

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[FlyBoeingJets]

I'd say the LCC's are not going to be going at it until all the Lagacy Carriers are gone. An LCC fighting an LCC is a war! An LCC picking on a Lagacy Carrier now thats easy, there is so much to pick on.

You may be right but I think the era of LCCs concentrating solely on the low hanging fruit of Legacy carrier routes is coming to an end. The Legacy carriers will continue to feel the sting but will have their bottom lines cushioned by an improving economy. The LCC inside a Legacy carrier will also save a little cash. Not much but some. I personally think the Legacy carriers that survive will have most domestic ops in their Song or Starfish type divisions. That is up the road a bit (2 years??)

More importantly I wonder how SW, JB, and Airtran can buy so many new A/C and not bump into each other. If you don't think that is so, how many new aircraft do you think it would take? (No sarcasm, I would really like to know)

I may be underestimating the effect of the contraction occuring or soon to occur at AA, USAir, and UAL (and to a much lesser extent DAL). AAs parking of 75 aircraft with no loss in seat capacity will be amazing.

On second thought, I have no idea what will happen next year and '05. Someone enlighten me....please

 

[FLB717]

Among the big 4 you have nearly 2000 large aircraft and they bump into each other all day (hopefuly not the same point in space and time) and it does not seem to be a problem so I dont thaink LCC's will have a large issue.

 

[skykid]

From Boyd's silly article:

Some of the usual lightweight analysts will spout that it's an attack on US Airways. Forget it, US is just a bystander caught in what will become an increasingly nasty firefight between WN and jetBlue.

-- So, now we see that this guy is arrogant in addition to spouting nonsense to a third grade audience. For this guy to call anybody else a lightweight is incredible to me. So Southwest mgt considers JetBlue when developing strategy? Duh, thanks for telling me. I thought the reason they were so successful is because they operate in a vacuum and only consider one competitor at a time. To say U is a bystander is a typical Boyd lightweight remark. He probably gets most of his ideas from this board!