SWA - No classes yet

[pegasus]

Just got a call from Lindsey, informing me that there are no signs of any new classes this year. She also informed me that I will make the 4th or 5th class once they begin again. I am currently 42 in our list. At least that's one whole class more optimistic than Jennifer.

Am now working in a call center (awful job ) and can see the SWA 737s flying out of my local airport. I wish the expected expansion would happen soon!

 

[Krunch]

Standby

I had dinner with a SWA FO friend of mine and he said there is a september class... I think everyone is waiting for the vote that closes at 1500 hours today... Patience is what we need when what we really want is control...

"Krunch"

 

[qxeplt]

Remember When...

They also told us back in April "NO SUMMER SCHOOL" and then they ended up having a July 15th class. Last I spoke to LL a few weeks ago she told me they were just waiting for flight ops to decide whether and when to run more classes. PD projections based on their speculation im sure are, nothing for the rest of the year, but remember there the last to know from Training. Didn't another post say something about a bunch of SWA instructors asking for time off in Sept and Training denied them the time off, well go figure. It's coming, I feel it in my bones.

That's my story and I'm sticking to it...

 

[Snoopy58]

From the training center at the end of last week...

- the instructor confirmed that the *current* word was "no classes for the rest of the year," but I don't think anybody in the room thought that that would be the final word. But at the moment the schedule for newhire classes is blank. However...

- the instructor ranks are still being expanded, from 34 in the recent past (don't have a date on that) to about 60 now, to 90 in the near future (again, don't have a hard date). Part of that will be to support the 9-month training cycle, but...

- the newest sim is up and mostly running, with another to follow shortly, making for 3 -300 sims and 3 -700 sims. I was supposed to have the new -700 sim for my checkride Saturday, but that was changed to one of the -300 sims; apparently the new box still needs some tweaking.

- the 9 month training cycle: presently, captains come in every 6 months for a day of academics, then a sim ride, alternating between a proficiency check (a PC) and a proficiency training (a PT) sim. PC's are run by check airmen (i.e. line pilots), while PT's are run by training center instructors (i.e. NOT line pilots). F/O's have one event each year, consisting of the day of academics followed by either a PC or a PT (alternating annually). New cycle will be, every 9 months, you come in for two days of academics, followed by a PT, followed by either a PC or a LOFT (Line Oriented Flight Training -- simulate an actual point A to point B flight, rather than 20 approaches & repeated dial-a-disaster). New system, F/O's get 2 sim periods every 9 months, vice 1 every 12; captains get 2 every 9 months vice 2 every 12.

Or at least that is the current state of the plan, which may still change form before going final.

Latest rumor is that the contract proposal passed, but I can NOT find the supposed web site that confirms that. But I've heard rumors of some VERY knowledgable people that it's gonna pass (even tho they'd hoped it wouldn't). When the official word comes out, I'm sure it'll show up here shortly.

Best of luck to all the swimmers!

cheers,

Snoopy

 

[w8n4swa]

A little insight....

For those of you thinking your several classes away....I've been told that some of our members have gone to other carriers who are in the SWA pool and haven't signed up on our list. They have probably kept this quiet to protect themselves during their probationary period with their employers and don't want anyone to know. These people may not take the SWA offer. Keep this in mind when your told you are 3, 4, 5 or 6 classes out. You may not be that many classes away when the calls start up again.

Just my thoughts....

W8n4swa

 

[qxeplt]

He's Right...

The average poolie made it into the class just prior to their official SWA projection, so clear your schedule...

 

[tredding@swa]

Fingerprints

Just for all to know, for what it is worth....

Went in to PHX PD yesterday to do the fingerprints. Easy task, in and out in 10 minutes!

WHen I asked LL what she thought I should wear.... "shorts, a tee shirt & flip flops should work, it's hot in PHX...".

SO, as instructed I wore the required PHX uniform!! Have to admit I felt I should have been in a suit, but it sure was more comfortable in shorts!!

Now that ALL of my blocks are filled.... bring ON the class DATES!!!!!!

Have a great day all - Tredding

 

[Indapool]

Hey Tredding,
when did you get the call?
Im about 20 ahead on the list but have not recieved the fingerprint call.
Last I saw they stopped around 40-something.
Just wondering ..........

 

[tredding@swa]

prints...

Well, I called LL to update some of my personal data... while we were chatting, I mentioned that since I live in PHX... so, when the time came for having my fingerprints done... could I have it done here??

SHe said that they are open for walk-ins every Wednesday and if I had the time just go on over and have them done now!! So I did.... no real "news" here I am sorry to say - just happened to be available to get it done, that's all!!

 

[w8n4swa]

Made my monthly call to Lindsey late last week and she said we could probably expect a couple more classes by the end of this year, but it will probably be next year for me. I'm currently # 82 on today's updated list (August 25, 2002), which I just sent in to Mark.

Hope to see the remaining poolies sign up as we wait this slump out.

Thanks to everyone who's helped in getting the info sent in!

W8n4swa

 

[tredding@swa]

tidbit...

WHile taxiing out of KMAF this morning, I asked WN#21... " when are you guys going to start training again, I am getting kinda waterlogged?"... for what it is worth, the answer was, " hang in there, the training machine is well oiled and the rumor is they are getting ready to crank it up again soon".

All quiet on the Western front...... still wading & tredding

 

[HPaul3]

Hmmmmmm......

Perhaps the calm before the storm?

Cheers!

 

[tredding@swa]

Stormy Skies??

SUre would be NICE to see a massive lvl6 pop up on the screen, ranged down to 25mi..... with many storms on the horizon!!

One can only hope..... dream & wish that something will change soon to allow us a free trip to DAL!!!!

Regards everyone - Tredding

 

[YeOldeProp]

And in that storm rides many a pilot hangin'-ten on top of the 50-foot waves and hoping to make it through the surf, over the beach and into the pool (still has the swim up bar---right?). But, how many of those pilots with all their resume's and supplemental packages carry the 737 type rating? I'm guessing that there's one room with stacks of 737 rated resume's lined up on the shelves, and then down the hall and past the employee's kitchen there's another really big room with stacks upon stacks upon stacks upon stacks of resumes from folks that just haven't gotten the chance (either time-wise or financially) to get the magic ticket.

Just can't deny the importance of that 737 rating in these times. The chat around the squadron flight room is a bit despondant these days...not enough financial independence to get it (at least without mortgaging the house again and getting that 2nd job with Domino's). All the pro's and con's of past forums have been really good, my vote is with the "just go and get it" crowd...it'll pay off quickly in the first couple of years IF the job is offered. Just a reeeeeaaaally big step to the "married with children" generation.

Good luck to you swimmers, and we'll hope that the gust front fills the SWA sails for a strong (building) few years...

 

[pegasus]

Here's a thought;

Let's say there are 300 poolies, all with type ratings (obviously) and lets say that at least that number again have got their 737 ratings and have either yet to interview, or have interviewed and (sadly) got turned down. So that is 600 type rating courses attended for the chance to work at SWA. Let's say the average cost was $7,000. So hopefuls have spent approx $4.2million in the recent past.

Wish I owned a 737 simulator

 

[VISTADRVR]

When I got my type rating back in May, one of the SWA FOs I met called the type rating an $8000 raffle ticket!

But, as the saying goes, you can't win if you don't buy a ticket

 

[chase]

Interview Updates

Spoke to some folks today who should know. As of now no more interviews scheduled for this year. No word on classes either. I go in for trainig mid-Sept & hope to have more info after that.

Sorry I can't throw a bone out there with something inticing on it but that's it for now. I'll get some of the company news off the hotline & post tomorrow.

To the Poolies:

These are obviously difficult times for everyone. It is trying people's patience and as time ticks away the stress without a job or steady income is a real one for many of you out there. I obviously have nothing to offer than some encouraging words but please continue to pursue ALL options for employment. This maybe difficult for some of you to imagine for you are hoping things will break soon. Ask yourself what you would do if you knew right now that SWA couldn't get you into class for a year.

Before anyone goes off the deep end, I'm not saying this will happen & I hope it doesn't but one must be prepared to keep the bills from getting overwhelming. Don't merely wait for SWA to come calling because if they don't because of other factors (war in Iraq will definitely slow things down IMHO, slower recovery in the economy, rising oil prices...creeping toward $30 a barrel due to uncertainity in the ME, etc.). Begin thinking out of the box to keep yourself current & bread on the table.

No one needs to be counseled on these types of things but I thought it would be worth mentioning as a reminder. If you'd like to review some 737 systems there are some good web sites out there that might be able to help you.

Boeing Site - UK


I will also try to publish some info from our FOM that might be helpful to review before arriving on the property. Wish I had more to offer but hang in there.

 

[pegasus]

Thanks for the honesty Chase.

Currency is 1 hour a month in a 172. That's all I can afford.
Job is a billing enquiry loser.
Applied to every outfit that is hiring. Still awaiting interviews. (Yeah, right, with a 737 type)
Wife has been forced into a full time job. Our cars pass on our way home/to work.
House purchase has been postponed indefinetly.
May have to go back to teaching.
Could do with a life-line since I bleed my gratuity at an unhealthy rate.
Would love to post one of those "still waiting with a massive grin on my face, I'd rather be in the pool than waiting to interview" posts, but since I was told a class in late Feb 02 originally, am not in the mood. It was fun at the beginning of the year.
Should have stayed put in the mil. Those still there, STAY PUT for at least 1 year.

Don't get me wrong, I am still charged about working at SWA, but believe now that the earliest class for me is late Spring 2003. Just about the same time the landlord turfs us out!

Went to a job placement man today and he wanted $3500 just for the pleasure of him helping w/a job search. No guarantees.

Anybody crying out there yet?
Anybody got a better sob story?
Still, I've got my family, our health, and eternal optimism.
(Poor fool)

 

[RightBettor]

I hear ya Pegasus. Getting another flying job has become a exercise in futility. Try getting something with the scarlet letter "F" (for Furloughed) on you AND a B737 type rating in your pocket. Folks doing the hiring at other companies will not touch you with the proverbial "ten-foot-pole." I only hope the currency thing does not become an issue with SWA. Otherwise I am looking at a potential career change... maybe dealer??

Regards,
RightBettor

 

[LiveFreeorDie]

Looking for a Job

Hey there are still some good jobs out there beside Southwest.

I was fortunate enough to land a job teaching KC-135 sims full time. For those interested there are a lot of openings right now. Any KC-135 or any heavy jet military pilot check out openings at. It isn't exactly "staying current" but it pays the bills well.

http://www.fssc.com/employment

Also Boeing is hiring C-17 instructors. Again only requirement is having been a heavy military instructor pilot. Check out

http://www.boeing.com/employment/flash.html

also Lear-Zigler is hiring T-6 texan sim instructors.

The guard and reserves are hiring at many units. Also the military does have a return to active duty program. Plus I have been seeing thirty year olds who have never flown before coming through the school house as 2nd Lts in the guard. There are atleast three new KC-135 guard/reserve units opening up. Plus there are desprate units out there who will hire you if you will go some less than popular places. Fairbanks Alaska comes to mind.

For you civilian types, there has to be something out there someone else on this site knows about. So why don't we concentrate on getting some people temp employment instead of wasting our time wondering about when SWA might call when they are tighter lipped than...some one from the South help me out here with an analogy...

I am applying for some of these jobs I just listed myself. But I have a good job now and why be selfish and keep the info to myself? I figure what goes around comes around. So I hope that this helps.

The last guy has it right at. If SWA trains 30 a month a lot of us will still be here next summer. Take it from a guy who lost 150 future senority numbers cause the mil wouldn't give me leave for my type. ( I interviewed last June 2001, but wasn't allowed to take two weeks off until March 2002!!!) You gotta plan for the worst and hope for the best.

This may seem disjointed, but hell it is 1 am on a school night.

 

[SentryIP]

Extension

Hey Poolies,

Based on my update with the People Department this month, I extended my retirement out another four months. I may have to extend more later on. I know I run the risk of another STOP LOSS, especially with the news concerning Iraq. However, I stay current and receive a steady income. I'm very thankful to be in my current situation where I can provide for the family because I know a lot of my fellow pilots out there are struggling. As chase said, I can't offer anything but encouragement and my prayers that all will return to some normalcy. Take care and God Bless.

 

[InHot]

Wishing & Hoping & Dreaming & Waiting

Hey Guys,

As the saying goes..."I feel your pain."

Furloughed in Sept from Midway. Shot down on three interviews before interviewing with SWA (for my 3rd time) in Jan with SWA.

Got a job offer from Vanguard (turned it down, thank goodnes)while waiting for the Feb 20th call from SWA.

Got the "good" call 22 Feb. Bought a bottle of Chivas and kicked back...thinking I'd be in class NLT end of Jun.

Started to get that uneasy feeling about future SWA classes in late March, spitted out the kool aid and ramped up my job search again.

Didn't know squat about corporate/charter stuff, but through this board learned enough to know that a Cessna 500 type rating is a very valuable tool to have in your flight bag.

Did a-lot of research and found that Flight Safety has a VA apporved course for a Citation II in Toledo. I combined my VA benefits (my VA pays 60% of cost of a type rating) with $2500 from WIA (lots of leg work there).

I banged on a-lot of doors and found a 135 operator in need of a Citation pilot. They ponied up the difference for the cost of the type and I got hired in Jul.

It's great to be flying again.

Moral of the story...it can be done. Takes a-lot of effort and a Sh*tload of that all-so-elusive factor - LUCK.

Keep the faith guys, SWA will call, just don't know when. In the meantime don't acept "no" for an answer and don't stop trying.

 

[pegasus]

Thanks guys

Inhot, Sentry and LiveFree,

Terrific stuff. Really appreciate those posts. Gives me some hope. Will be paying a visit to some charter people to nag them again.

Live Free, that is a great idea about posting known jobs. Maybe we should start a network!

 

[StarrBuck]

I'm not positive, but I am pretty sure that several of the commuter airlines are hiring right now. Some of which don't require you to resign your previous seniority number from what I have been told.. Skywest and ACA come to mind. I know the pay is not good, but at least it is a flying job..

I am currently at Continental Express (I am very blessed to still be flying and waiting for SWA) and we have over 400 pilots on furlough at this time. The good news though is we are taking 8 new EMB145's per month starting next month, for quite a while. It is expected that after the furloughed pilots are recalled, then off the street hirring should pick up.. I'll post more at a later date.

Good luck!!

SB

 

[duckman]

And in that storm rides many a pilot hangin'-ten on top of the 50-foot waves and hoping to make it through the surf, over the beach and into the pool (still has the swim up bar---right?). But, how many of those pilots with all their resume's and supplemental packages carry the 737 type rating? I'm guessing that there's one room with stacks of 737 rated resume's lined up on the shelves, and then down the hall and past the employee's kitchen there's another really big room with stacks upon stacks upon stacks upon stacks of resumes from folks that just haven't gotten the chance (either time-wise or financially) to get the magic ticket.

Just can't deny the importance of that 737 rating in these times. The chat around the squadron flight room is a bit despondant these days...not enough financial independence to get it (at least without mortgaging the house again and getting that 2nd job with Domino's). All the pro's and con's of past forums have been really good, my vote is with the "just go and get it" crowd...it'll pay off quickly in the first couple of years IF the job is offered. Just a reeeeeaaaally big step to the "married with children" generation.

Good luck to you swimmers, and we'll hope that the gust front fills the SWA sails for a strong (building) few years...

[/YeOldeProp: Don't want to be a MOTO (master of the obvious) here..but I assume you did NOT sign up for VEAP or MGIB when the military offered??? Would save you a bunch of $$$.

 

[reepicheep]

We should be thankful that Southwest so far has resisted the temptation to resort to the Old Boy Network - the dreaded LOR system. You can go out and get a 737 type and otherwise try to better yourself and improve your marketability; but you can do little or nothing about who your buddies happened to get hired by. Props to WN for trying to keep the playing field level.

 

[CaptainBrazilia]

SKW

Word is that there will be several new-hire classes here at SkyWest before the end of the year. Most, if not all, will go straight into the CRJ - at least that's what the rumor mill is saying. More than likely, those new-hires will come from a small existing pool, but it couldn't hurt to throw an application in.

I don't believe that SkyWest will allow you to keep your current seniority number if you've been furloughed, though.

If things are getting desperate for y'all (and I hope they aren't yet), SkyWest is definitely not a bad bet!

Good luck all!

 

[Snoopy58]

Non-flying jobs / recruiters

Pegasus (and anybody else in a similar spot),

Sorry it's taken me so long to post this, but I wanted to respond to something you said a few posts back:

Went to a job placement man today and he wanted $3500 just for the pleasure of him helping w/a job search. No guarantees.

Since flying currency isn't a concern for the SWA job once you're in the pool but having good income between now and "the call" is, this seems like a reasonable option for some guys, but PLEASE don't think that you should EVER have to pay for a service like this, CERTAINLY nothing on the order of $3500!!!

For all the former military guys out there, there is a group of placement services that will work to match you up with a civilian company for various types of work. They do it at no cost to the military member (present or former); they get their commission from the company that hires you. Links to several of the reputable companies are below.

-- disclaimer: my wife used to work for one of these companies, but this isn't an advertisement, really! --

-- second disclaimer: while they do work with pilots, as a generality, pilots tend to be one of the harder groups of people to place. Her experience was that military pilots tend to THINK that they want ops, but it almost never works; what does tend to work much better is medical sales. More autonomy, set your own schedule, less need to supervise the "problem children," etc. There are some extremely cool medical sales jobs out there, and it is NOT at all similar to the proverbial "vacuum cleaner salesman," knocking on every door trying to badger somebody into buying your product. If you're seriously considering a non-flying job until SWA calls, calling one or more of the following may be of some use. Worst case, you have a chat with a recruiter & find out that there's no real match for your skills/interest/location.

www.bradley-morris.com
www.cameron-brooks.com
www.leadersinc.com
www.orioninternational.com

Cameron-Brooks is probably the "high-end" of the bunch, but they are the only one that is "exclusive," i.e. if you work with us you may not work with anybody else. The others are okay if you work with other recruiters as well.

Clearly, for those in the SWA pool at least, you may have a hard time pretending you're looking for a 20-year career & being passionate about it. However, some of the jobs these guys hire for have a reasonably quick spin-up & can have you earning decent money fairly quick. You probably don't want to emphasize the "as soon as SWA calls, I'm leaving for Dallas" angle of it, but to say that "the airline industry is in such bad shape and so very uncertain so I'm looking for something else" is probably not stretching things too far.

If anybody has any questions about this sort of thing, feel free to post here or PM me; my wife doesn't work for the recruiter any more but she can give you the straight scoop on what they can / can't do for you.

As always, best of luck to all the poolies!

Snoopy

 

[pegasus]

Dear Snoopy,

Thanks for that. I owe you several beers. Even if nothing comes of it, I will be persuing those contacts tomorrow.

You are a gentleman and a scholar!

 

[specnut]

keep the faith

To all those waiting in the pool:
As I read all of the previous posts, I do tip my hat to all of you.
This is probably the most difficult time in your lives. I was there for seven months, which seemed like seven years. All my buddies that were flying were telling me just hang in there it wil turn around. Easy for them to say when they are earning a good paycheck and your not.
Southwest is a great place to be. This is my fourth airline, and hopefully the last. Someone just told me, You never know if you picked the right airline until the day you retire. I hope Southwest will be the one. I enjoy everybody I work with and I have that great feeling again when I go to work.
I hope that Southwest begins hiring sooner than later, it seems other guys like CHASE know more scoop than I. In the meantime
there is an job info newsletter called Flight Crews International, it is run out of LA and is not advertised. It is only word of mouth. They have several corp. job postings and crew leasing positions.
It is run by Capt. McNicol... The number is 800 213-6021. Call and check it out. Good luck to all, hope to see you at Southwest soon.