Swa hawaii update

[B6Driver]

Wave, so many folks see you as such a tool.

 

[waveflyer]

Wave, so many folks see you as such a tool.

They do?
A troll I get, but tool...?
You feel the need to say this now bc.....?????

Oh I see... You're JetBlue -
A good airline- thanks for te ride you guys gave me to JFK that one time 4 years ago- treated me great.
Any nervousness HAL may have is certainly in your pilot group. Except with a greater chance of happening.

You don't like that the air tran integration is the precedent? You wish it weren't?
I do too. Do you also ever wish that water wasn't wet?
It absolutely screwed my career progression and I have nothing to show for it except 1800 pilots worth of growth that we won't have access to.
I wouldn't gain anything from a JetBlue acquisition either if precedent holds, except more grey hairs when I upgrade- and less time topped out and holding the schedule I want.

Let's not pretend that any of us have anything but selfish motivations when it all gets real-

I will drink to no acquisitions actually happening and everyone just doing their thing-

:beer:

 

[waveflyer]

Jim, time will tell.

Just telling you how pilots here feel about getting absolutely nothing but diluted seniority from any new acquisitions- we will be going apesh/t - and I'm kind of a kool aid drinker-
We just can't afford any more dilutions so unless it comes with some huge benefit- $$$ (and it would take a lot of $$$) it won't be as easy as air tran- I promise

Sounds like not on your end either.

So it'll be arbitration-

IF that outside chance actually comes to fruition-

Still clinging to the naive Hawaiians sticking up for you thing eh?

Many many pilots have thought that

Eastern did

Now delta dominates an Atlanta that was so protective

We'll see if it happens

 

[Jim]

No Wave, the angry Hawaiian thing is just a side benefit. It's the M-B Act and the arbitrators following federal law that will protect me. You and your SWA brethren always seem to conveniently forget that.

You can bet your second to last penny that the Hawaiian pilots will not roll over and take it up the ass from the SWA pilots. You can bet your last penny that the M-B Act and the arbitrators won't be swayed by your "SWA lottery ticket" bull crap either. I know I'll be betting mine when I vote to tell SWAPA where to stck their wet dream SLI. And I'll do so knowing the odds are greatly in my favor.

 

[waveflyer]

MB is as untested as it gets
And poked full of holes in the actual language
MB doesn't guarantee an outcome just a process and that's a good thing-
There are no SWA pilots afraid of arbitration- especially not junior fo's since air tran really couldn't have worked out worse for us

 

[freightdogfred]

MB is as untested as it gets
And poked full of holes in the actual language
MB doesn't guarantee an outcome just a process and that's a good thing-
There are no SWA pilots afraid of arbitration- especially not junior fo's since air tran really couldn't have worked out worse for us

You really are full of ********************

 

[waveflyer]

Yeah, that's been said


But I've been right more than wrong in my life so... I'm not blindly confident

 

[scoreboardII]

So if I read this thread right, we are already getting the panties nice and wadded up for the next maybe merger before we really finish the last merger?

 

[Flopgut]

Said this before on here: I would have happily cut a $1000/mo ALPA assessment check to AirTran pilots if they had wanted to fight harder in their integration. Would do the same for Hawaiian (even Dan Roman). That's me, not every ALPA member.

ALPA guys: I think we need a resolution that whoever SWA tries to buy next we circle the wagons around them. Keep Gary Kelly in check and fully defend MB legislation.

Having said that, I'm wondering what a first offer Is the best offer deal out if GK would be to Hawaiian? Wave I don't think you'd like it.

 

[Carl_Spackler]

McCaskill-Bond requires the any company that acquires more than 50% of an airline to merge the employee groups of the two companies. So threats of migrating our flying to SWA and shutting us down are worthless.

I'm not so sure that this is true in all cases. Doesn't the operation have to be merged with the same management, etc?

I think it would probably apply if SWA bought HA, but didn't when DL bought Endeavor because they are operates separately.

 

[slaquer5]

Said this before on here: I would have happily cut a $1000/mo ALPA assessment check to AirTran pilots if they had wanted to fight harder in their integration. Would do the same for Hawaiian (even Dan Roman). That's me, not every ALPA member.

ALPA guys: I think we need a resolution that whoever SWA tries to buy next we circle the wagons around them. Keep Gary Kelly in check and fully defend MB legislation.

Having said that, I'm wondering what a first offer Is the best offer deal out if GK would be to Hawaiian? Wave I don't think you'd like it.

Dude

Your hate for SWA just never seems to stop


Why don't you get every ALPA member to put in a couple hundred grand each ,or whatever it takes ,to buy SWA, then shut them down ?



You sure seem to like to spend others money

If I was an ALPA member , I would want ALPA to buy a hunting lodge with a Beaver on floats,up in Canada. Then let the members use it . I would be the ALPA Committee member in charge of it.



Sidebar. What does cut a check to fight harder mean ? I take it as you think ALPA does not do there job unless your willing to bribe them with more cash.

 

[Flopgut]

There are no SWA pilots afraid of arbitration- especially not junior fo's since air tran really couldn't have worked out worse for us

Seems like a real long time that I've been on here arguing with you. You're not still an FO, are you? Certainly no longer a "junior" FO, right?

 

[canyonblue]

Said this before on here: I would have happily cut a $1000/mo ALPA assessment check to AirTran pilots..

How about a $1000 check to help those poor Regional pilots that are carrying your passengers for United? They don't really matter do they? Unbelievable. :angryfire

 

[Flopgut]

Dude

Your hate for SWA just never seems to stop


Why don't you get every ALPA member to put in a couple hundred grand each ,or whatever it takes ,to buy SWA, then shut them down ?


I am sure you could care less if some regional pilots making 30k has to take out a 400k loan . But hey, you will be happy .

No, it's not really like that completely. I want the process to be a clean deal. That's all. I think ALPA needs to restate that membership is important, and not try to cut a deal with SWA/GK. Secondly I'd want my fellow ALPA guys to know that if you're not taking the first offer out of GK, then don't plan on doing anything but arbitration. (Do not take the 2nd offer!) That's pbly going to inflate GK's first offer.

Hawaii and the Pacific is complicated, on a lot of levels. The people are not going to like being made to feel they lost their airline. They still miss Aloha. I don't think SWA could buy Hawaiian and be well received. I think UAL/CAL might be able to. *might*

5% is an ok assessment for a regional or any pilot.

 

[Flopgut]

How about a $1000 check to help those poor Regional pilots that are carrying your passengers for United? They don't really matter do they? Unbelievable. :angryfire

Uh, they matter plenty. Especially XJT. When ALPA asks for $ for them, I'm sending it. Not a problem.

 

[slaquer5]

Flop


Just like when I was at EAL. Everyone wanted us to go on strike . They had no skin in the game easy for them to say . I was lucky and got a job right away, most did not . The 2800 dollar a month check , soon stopped for them .


Same goes here. It is easy for to tell the AT pilots what you think they should do. You do not have skin in the game. You might to do a search of what happened to Muse Air and ATA, after SWA purchased them .

Every AT pilot I have flown with is very sharp . I do not think they need someone from CAL, telling them how to choice there destiny

 

[Flopgut]

Slaquer: My audience here is as much alpa membership as it is an AirTran pilot or Hawaiian pilot. There needs to be a reminder that if another assessment opportunity comes to support a fellow alpa pilot then we all act on it. Like Lorenzo was at EAL, GK wants to play fast and loose with the rules. (Or at least Wave really wants him to next time) Scale things out from Muse thru AirTran and the trajectory favors the pilots of SWA's next acquisition.

AirTran did pretty darn good compared to Muse, right?

 

[Secret Squirrel]

ALPA wanted nothing to do with the AT group as soon as the merger was announced. They knew they were losing dues out of it and cut their losses. Never heard a peep out of ALPA national when all the threats were going on and almost the same from the local union after the threats came. Only a single unauthorized letter from the MEC chair that none of the other reps would sign. And now you think ALPA is going to do something next time? They will take your check, but there is no way they will stick their neck out for a small group. They will do as little as possible to assure they can't get sued.

 

[HowardBorden]

Said this before on here: I would have happily cut a $1000/mo ALPA assessment check to AirTran pilots if they had wanted to fight harder in their integration. Would do the same for Hawaiian (even Dan Roman). That's me, not every ALPA member.

ALPA guys: I think we need a resolution that whoever SWA tries to buy next we circle the wagons around them. Keep Gary Kelly in check and fully defend MB legislation.

Having said that, I'm wondering what a first offer Is the best offer deal out if GK would be to Hawaiian? Wave I don't think you'd like it.

Flopgut you really crack me up!

You should really pay more attention to what is going on in your own backyard. Perhaps your $1000 would be better spent developing a contingency plan to keep high value international passengers choosing IAH as opposed to Hobbie in the next couple of years.

 

[fr8doggie]

Flopgut you really crack me up!

You should really pay more attention to what is going on in your own backyard. Perhaps your $1000 would be better spent developing a contingency plan to keep high value international passengers choosing IAH as opposed to Hobbie in the next couple of years.

When does SWA start HOU-LHR service?

 

[HowardBorden]

When does SWA start HOU-LHR service?

Long after they poach Mexico, Caribbean, South and Central American passengers.

You do realize the definition of "international", correct?

in-ter-na-tion-al
ˌintərˈnaSHənl/
adjective
adjective: international
1. existing, occurring, or carried on between two or more nations.

 

[fr8doggie]

Long after they poach Mexico, Caribbean, South and Central American passengers.

You do realize the definition of "international", correct?

in-ter-na-tion-al
ˌintərˈnaSHənl/
adjective
adjective: international
1. existing, occurring, or carried on between two or more nations.

Of course I do. How's your first/business class seating for those flights south?

Don't get me wrong. I hope you guys do well in your int'l endeavors. I just don't think you'll be hauling a lot of high-end business travelers.

 

[slaquer5]

Of course I do. How's your first/business class seating for those flights south?

Don't get me wrong. I hope you guys do well in your int'l endeavors. I just don't think you'll be hauling a lot of high-end business travelers.

They would if they went back to hiring flight attendants like they did in the 70s

Also going back to the old uniform

 

[fr8doggie]

They would if they went back to hiring flight attendants like they did in the 70s



Also going back to the old uniform

Nah. I want a good single malt and a comfortable seat.

 

[waveflyer]

Seems like a real long time that I've been on here arguing with you. You're not still an FO, are you? Certainly no longer a "junior" FO, right?

Yep still an FO
And still in the bottom half

 

[slaquer5]

Nah. I want a good single malt and a comfortable seat.

So now your a high end business traveler ?

For some reason I thought you where a freight dog .


I guess it's the internet , you can be whatever you want to be.

 

[fr8doggie]

When I fly int'l it's a first class ticket courtesy of FedEx.

 

[slaquer5]

When I fly int'l it's a first class ticket courtesy of FedEx.

I do not think that makes you a high end business traveler.

So what do think us low life airline pilots are ? Mr. Business man .

 

[fr8doggie]

I do not think that makes you a high end business traveler.


So what do think us low life airline pilots are ? Mr. Business man .

I'm not a high end business traveller. I believe that most would prefer a good 1st class seat w/ good food/drink to the SWA experience w/hot F/As for a long (5 hours+) international flight.

You seem defensive. Lighten up. SWA is a good ride for leisure/family travel. I've flown on you many times both j/s and purchased ticket. Wouldn't want to do it for a long flight.

I think a lot of SWA pilots are pretty full of themselves. You're no better than the rest of us.

 

[waveflyer]

Fr8- I'm not defensive
I wouldn't want to be any taller in our seats and miss first class just for that reason-
But I've never understood that argument.
When an airplane has first class seats, the vast majority of seats are still coach with less pitch than what we have.
So most customer experiences are worse than ours on any long haul flight. Especially united. If this were a Singapore pilot levying these critiques it'd be one thing. Dude flies for the worst airline in the US for the last decade. Having a dozen or two people living it up in lay flat beds and free drinks doesn't make up for 200 in the back with less room than SWA , plus an overall sh/tty experience had by all off the plane.