SWA and 737 type-rating -- Federal investigation?

[Publishers]

First of all, why would any company that can find sufficient pilots with types and experience not prefer to hire them.
Second, SWA used to have the decency to interview you without the type and tell you whether you would make it in but you had to get the type before you started. There was a second group that had the type and experience.
Sounds reasonable.
The only time there is any question at all about pay for training ethics is when people are being trained on revenue producing trips and you only got the job as you were willing to pay. Training contracts are designed for the company providing the training to get the benefit of that training.
With the current cost of jet training being what it is, we can look for more contractural agreements before training of some kinds.

 

[MILPILOT17]

First of all, why would any company that can find sufficient pilots with types and experience not prefer to hire them.
Second, SWA used to have the decency to interview you without the type and tell you whether you would make it in but you had to get the type before you started. There was a second group that had the type and experience.
Sounds reasonable.
The only time there is any question at all about pay for training ethics is when people are being trained on revenue producing trips and you only got the job as you were willing to pay. Training contracts are designed for the company providing the training to get the benefit of that training.
With the current cost of jet training being what it is, we can look for more contractural agreements before training of some kinds.

As of Aug 07 (point at which they stopped interviewing) SWA was interviewing without a type. I know people w/o the type were hired because I was one of them. I suspect they may do the same thing in the future.

 

[J.Otto]

Requiring a type rating sounds like a good business model to me. Call it what you want, but look at it from their business perspective. Seems like there is no shortage of folks willing to foot that bill. If it goes against your own constitution, then steer clear of SWA.

Other than that, they aren't doing anything illegal. Think of it this way, a company that makes their pilots pay for outside training helps their bottom line and your job security too. Clearly, if you bothered with obtaining the type and getting hired, you would be blessed as SWA isn't nearly in the trouble almost every other airline is in right now.

 

[waveflyer]

does the type help at all w/ training=- i've got more than a few friends that did their type in less than a week= then waited 2-3 years before getting on.

My understanding of the type is that they want that entreprenurial spirit= they want people who are invested in the company. They invest a lot in their employees and they don't want to waste time w/ those who aren't willing to return the sentiment. Is this a more accurate reason for it?

 

[contrail67]

does the type help at all w/ training=- i've got more than a few friends that did their type in less than a week= then waited 2-3 years before getting on.

My understanding of the type is that they want that entreprenurial spirit= they want people who are invested in the company. They invest a lot in their employees and they don't want to waste time w/ those who aren't willing to return the sentiment. Is this a more accurate reason for it?

They do it to save on training expenses....Believe me, they could issue you the type on your checkride...other legacy carriers do....but they don't. As long as they have folks that will pay then there is no need to change it.

 

[contrail67]

Papa,

I'm sorry you didn't get hired. Did you do any interview prep, or did you just try and impress the interviewers with your conspiracy theories?

Southwest doesn't care where you get your type rating. And for the illiterate or just stupid in the group who think that buying the rating is PFT, here it is one more time:

Paying your prospective airline for the job is PFT. Getting a type rating at a private company is investing in your future, just like getting a college degree, or paying for your commercial/ ATP.

You guys that got turned down really need to give it a rest. Southwest probably read your (barely) hidden bad attitudes.

I kinda doubt if this guy even applied. I know I did not........ it was a personal choice, and I have never regreted it.

 

[StopNTSing]

I Don't think there is any validity to that.

However, I do think SWA needs to think whether or not pressuring someone into spending $8-9k plus expenses, just to get an interview is a good idea. The pressure is significant especially for the Regional crowd. Imagine your company is in Bankruptcy you have been displaced twice furloughed once and looking at another furlough and the only way you can get even an interview is to get the Type. That is some massive pressure going into the interview. Thats what happened to me and I let the pressure get to me; hence poor performance in interview. Out of the 12 I interviewed with 3 got the job and the ones that did were NOT faced with the pressures I and others had. Coincidence.... I think not.

I'd bet the same sense of entitlement and victimization that permeates this post probably had more to do with your unsuccessful interview at SWA, than knocking knees or sweaty palms. I hope you haven't given up, though. Lots of people are getting shot down on the first attempt these days, and many of them make the cut after 2nd or 3rd tries. Since you apparently already have the type, keep your app updated and best of luck next time. I wouldn't be surprised to see the pool drained by the end of this year, and interviews shortly before that.

And FYI.....you don't HAVE to fork out $8K to get a job here. You just have to have a 73-type! You can get that from many sources, including working for Uncle Sam (C40, T43 assignments), EG&G (the Vegas mystery ships), a BBJ gig, a sim instructor gig, or a foreign carrier contract....among others. My apologies for inserting this inconvenient truth in the middle of a good rant. We now return you to your original whine-fest.

 

[Tejas-Jet]

does the type help at all w/ training=- i've got more than a few friends that did their type in less than a week= then waited 2-3 years before getting on. --->Not really...it is just a ticket to the dance. Once you get here...we train you to do it our way. Like me, I got my type while flying for another airline...all that mattered to SWA was that I had the type.

My understanding of the type is that they want that entreprenurial spirit= they want people who are invested in the company. They invest a lot in their employees and they don't want to waste time w/ those who aren't willing to return the sentiment. Is this a more accurate reason for it?--->Again, it's just a ticket to the dance...gets you in the door...that is about as plain as I can make it.

 

[Dude]

All,

If you paid for your certificates, then you are no different than any other SWA guy/gal. There is a cost associated with doing business in this industry and I am sure you would question the integrity of a flight intructor that just finished writing a large check to finish his CFI training. You will, however, question mine and/or SWA for requiring such qualifications for employment. What is the difference? I say none.

I will stick my neck out there and say that there is not much difference between PFT (Gulfstream) and buying ratings. It is considered less than a classy move to opt for PFT and gain experience more expeditiously than others. However, if I had done that I would be a Captain and not an FO. It ain't where you start, it's where you finish. Gulfstream pisses me off because folks have less of a clue when they get another job and they lack the experience that is necessary, IMO, to do the job well. Not to mention they don't appreciate the subtle increases in QOL and pay like their counterparts that spent a while getting there.