SWA/Airtran Process Agreement??

[General Lee]

WOW!, I hear the same crickets too when somebody brings up DAL/NWA!!!!!

IF they truely believed in what they are spouting, they should have NO problem telling it to the arbitration panel. The USAir East guys thought they had it in the bag, even when Nicalau told them before he ruled that "they might want to work it out one more time before he ruled---hint hint, wink wink...." The East guys still didn't bargain again, and eventually lost big time.


Now, I don't think you will get the same type of ratio DL/NWA got in arbitration, but it certainly will be better than what they (SWAPA) offer you. You are thankful for what gains you will get in the SWA contract, but you will work just as hard as they will to keep it. You are valuable, or GK wouldn't want to buy you. But seniority is FOREVER (or until you go Chap 7), and you don't want to give in because some SWA pilot tells you they fought hard for their contract (that they piggybacked on), and that means you deserve worse seniority. Let an arbitrator decide that. If the panel thinks you deserve less, they will tell you why in the report afterwards. I would go that route because it will give you a more fair route to your deserved seniority. Seniority is very important. SWAPA doesn't care what you think.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[General Lee]

That's your arguement? Your trying talking about company items vs contract issues. Apples and oranges.

What does the AAI contract bring the Southwest group?

What does the Southwest contract bring the AAI pilot group? The differences are staggering, and very definable. Gonna be an interesting arguement to say the least.

Doesn't matter. BTW, you are handling it like the USAir guys did, with SLI prior to a joint contract. How has that worked out for their morale? If you actually wanted to do it correctly for a smoother merger, you would get the joint contract first, and then arbitration for the SLI. The judges would look at what each airline brought to the table via planes, longevity, etc. That would be more fair, but you obviously don't want it to be fair. That is a problem. Delta had a better contract (30% higher wages) and the NWA guys had a pension. Even after all of that was settled with a joint contract, none of that was brought up in arbitration. The arbitrators just looked at what each side brought to the table, and decided. You still think Airtran brings little, when infact they bring enough for GK to want to buy them. That says something, Red.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[GuppyWN]

If you feel you've got a hot hand and the pit boss is in your corner, roll the dice my friend and demand arbitration! Just don't be pissed if you crap out.......

KP,

The process agreement is designed to allow us to come to an agreement but has provisions if we can't.

Gup

 

[Kharma Police]

KP,

The process agreement is designed to allow us to come to an agreement but has provisions if we can't.

Gup

I believe that we will come to an agreement without arbitration. Again, the sooner the better!

 

[kwick]

KP,

The process agreement is designed to allow us to come to an agreement but has provisions if we can't.

Gup

It's called "Arbitration!"

 

[Kharma Police]

It's called "Arbitration!"

If so, let's hope it will be a quick one!

 

[redflyer65]

prior to a joint contract.

Bye Bye--General Lee

Your leading with IT DOESN'T MATTER?

General, what are you smoking? We have a contract already, one of the better ones in the industry.

Why don't you list what the SW pilots gain from the AAI contract?

GK is buying AAI because he's getting them on the cheap and he's acquiring the COMPANY assets. Can you understand the difference between combining company assest VS the difference between two pilot contracts?

Your arguements don't hold water. Sorry.

RF

 

[texman]

I have been flying a lot of Asia trips, and sometimes I don't have a good Wifi connection, or I would rather sit on the beach and relax. As far as whether or not you guys will go to arbitration, I don't know for sure, but if the terms are not acceptable to the majority of the AT pilots, I bet you will then. If you try to force too much of a ratio, or not allow a significant amount of their Captains to remain Captains in a combined list, then anyone would think they would choose arbitration. Back in the day Delta used the phrase "United plus 1" when we were negotiating the C2K contract, but before that we got new 777s without a payrate. When they showed up on property, Dalpa refused to fly them. Leo Mullin was Chairman at the time, and he decided to give in to Dalpa's demands, which was a raise for EVERY plane Delta had, and a big one. We forced their hand. Then United got their big contract, and we added to our 777 agreement to get an even bigger raise. So, part of it was from our own deal with the new 777s, and part of it was piggybacking off of UAL. Our 777 Captains made $315 an hour. (double that for greenslips on your day off) Granted, we didn't have that many planes, but those guys hit the lottery. And before you state that our payrates helped with our BK, remember we also had a Comair strike that cost $1 billion, 9-11, and then when thoughts of BK leaked out, 2000 Captains left with their lump sum pensions, and many left with $1 million or more. The payrates were a fixed cost. Your current payrates and benefits (like 90 trips min on reserve with 105 average for your pilots per month) amounted to more than what we had total, because we had furloughed pilots and were limited to what we could have per month back prior to BK. (maybe 75 hours a month max, and then the rest put into a bank) Our payrates were great, but we couldn't see them to max due to the pilots on furlough, which was fine with me at the time. That's the story.


Bye Bye---General Lee

Well here is our story. So will you stop with your piggy back story BS.
http://www.swapaluv.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/11/pilotpay.jpg

 

[Luv2BFlyin]

Well here is our story. So will you stop with your piggy back story BS.
http://www.swapaluv.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/11/pilotpay.jpg

That's actually only the last 20 years of the story. Let's see the full 40 and compare where WN was at 17 years compared to the tranny and industry average now.

Oh no, that wouldn't serve the same purpose though would it?

BTW, it wasn't until 9-11 and subequent bankruptcies that WN actually took off after a decade of stagnation (just based on the SWAPA LUV graph but more like 3 decades). Fortunately arbitrators will look at more than just the SWAPA LUV website.

 

[ASADFW7]

SWAPA luv = circle jerk