Welcome to Flightinfo.com

  • Register now and join the discussion
  • Friendliest aviation Ccmmunity on the web
  • Modern site for PC's, Phones, Tablets - no 3rd party apps required
  • Ask questions, help others, promote aviation
  • Share the passion for aviation
  • Invite everyone to Flightinfo.com and let's have fun

Sun Country follows suit

  • Thread starter Thread starter schafjet
  • Start date Start date
  • Watchers Watchers 18

Welcome to Flightinfo.com

  • Register now and join the discussion
  • Modern secure site, no 3rd party apps required
  • Invite your friends
  • Share the passion of aviation
  • Friendliest aviation community on the web
Status
Not open for further replies.

schafjet

Osama hunter
Joined
Sep 6, 2002
Posts
214
Blaming fuel costs, Sun Country to idle 29 percent of its pilots

By John Welbes
[email protected]
Article Last Updated: 04/01/2008 03:12:37 PM CDT



Sun Country Airlines will lay off nearly 30 percent of its pilots starting May 1 in response to rising fuel costs.

The Mendota Heights-based low-cost carrier sent out letters to its pilots last Friday, telling them of the temporary move, said Wendy Blackshaw, an airline spokeswoman.

"We are not going to be flying as much this summer because of rising fuel prices," Blackshaw said today. The company has 156 pilots, and 45 received the letters sent out last week.

"They won't fly at all" from May until the end of October, she said, but will continue to accrue seniority. The 45 pilots are expected to be back on Oct. 31, she said.

"We very much regret having to take this action, both from the personal impact on pilots and their families but for the airline," the carrier said in a statement this afternoon. "This represents a deep pool of talent."

Sun Country is structuring the cut flights to keep passenger service close to what it is now, she said. "The flights we've taken out are primarily the ones that weren't as profitable," she said. "We haven't eliminated any routes."
Might Sun Country passengers notice that the remaining flights are little more full than they had been?

"If we cancel a red-eye to L.A., the hope is that someone would take the daytime flight to L.A.," she said, and they might notice more full seats on that flight, she said.

Major carriers, including Northwest, have also indicated they'll likely cut flights in the coming months to adjust to rising fuel costs. Champion Air, a Twin Cities charter carrier, said Monday it will cease operations May 31. That move will affect 550 workers.
 
Blaming fuel costs, Sun Country to idle 29 percent of its pilots

By John Welbes
[email protected]
Article Last Updated: 04/01/2008 03:12:37 PM CDT



Sun Country Airlines will lay off nearly 30 percent of its pilots starting May 1 in response to rising fuel costs.

The Mendota Heights-based low-cost carrier sent out letters to its pilots last Friday, telling them of the temporary move, said Wendy Blackshaw, an airline spokeswoman.

"We are not going to be flying as much this summer because of rising fuel prices," Blackshaw said today. The company has 156 pilots, and 45 received the letters sent out last week.

"They won't fly at all" from May until the end of October, she said, but will continue to accrue seniority. The 45 pilots are expected to be back on Oct. 31, she said.

"We very much regret having to take this action, both from the personal impact on pilots and their families but for the airline," the carrier said in a statement this afternoon. "This represents a deep pool of talent."

Sun Country is structuring the cut flights to keep passenger service close to what it is now, she said. "The flights we've taken out are primarily the ones that weren't as profitable," she said. "We haven't eliminated any routes."
Might Sun Country passengers notice that the remaining flights are little more full than they had been?

"If we cancel a red-eye to L.A., the hope is that someone would take the daytime flight to L.A.," she said, and they might notice more full seats on that flight, she said.

Major carriers, including Northwest, have also indicated they'll likely cut flights in the coming months to adjust to rising fuel costs. Champion Air, a Twin Cities charter carrier, said Monday it will cease operations May 31. That move will affect 550 workers.

That sucks. Many of those junior pilots were recalled recently - right? I thought some of them also came over from Mesaba.

As someone else said on another thread, the US leisure markets (that are served by Sun Country) are likely to be packed with both US and European visitors this summer because of the high costs of traveling abroad (high exchange rates make Europe way too expensive). Too bad many airlines can't last long enough to enjoy those full seats this summer... Good luck to those pilots!
 
This is going to be a really, really bad summer.
 
Wow another ALPO carrier. I guess thats what "taking it(in the) back" really means?:(
 
Wow another ALPO carrier. I guess thats what "taking it(in the) back" really means?:(

Tool. Yeah it is alpa's fault for a slowing economy and out of control oil prices. This was caused by a republican administration, not Alpa.
 
Tool. Yeah it is alpa's fault for a slowing economy and out of control oil prices. This was caused by a republican administration, not Alpa.
Right! take another hit off that ALPO pipe sonny. You may get lucky and survive this....But just in case you don't no need to worry ALPO Will!
 
Tool. Yeah it is alpa's fault for a slowing economy and out of control oil prices. This was caused by a republican administration, not Alpa.


What? It's Bush's fault? You forgot to blame Haliburton too. That's your great satan to you liberals. Rising oil prices? Pin most of the blame on democrats and their tree hugger buddies. It's democrats who have thrown up roadblocks to develop new oil fields in the U.S. It's democrats who have killed any new refinery being built in the U.S. since 1976. Get a clue.
 
What? It's Bush's fault? You forgot to blame Haliburton too. That's your great satan to you liberals. Rising oil prices? Pin most of the blame on democrats and their tree hugger buddies. It's democrats who have thrown up roadblocks to develop new oil fields in the U.S. It's democrats who have killed any new refinery being built in the U.S. since 1976. Get a clue.

Pleny of blame to go around, but I know this for a fact (have family that in the oil business in positions that would know):

There are no new refineries in the US because the oil companies DO NOT WANT THEM! Not because of tree-huggers, not because of regulation, not because of the Dems.

There is simply no incentive; why spend lots of money to build a refinery which will only increase supply of useable fuel, bring prices down, and thus lower your profits?

There are no insurmountable restrictions on building new refineries in the US, and even if there were Exxon could build them right over the border in Mexico if they wanted them badly enough.
 
Pleny of blame to go around, but I know this for a fact (have family that in the oil business in positions that would know):

There are no new refineries in the US because the oil companies DO NOT WANT THEM! Not because of tree-huggers, not because of regulation, not because of the Dems.

There is simply no incentive; why spend lots of money to build a refinery which will only increase supply of useable fuel, bring prices down, and thus lower your profits?

There are no insurmountable restrictions on building new refineries in the US, and even if there were Exxon could build them right over the border in Mexico if they wanted them badly enough.

Yeah right! Building a new refinery is on the same par as building a new nuclear plant! Overregulated and priced out of reason.
The reason no one wants to do so is that to get a return on your investment makes the project itself unfeasible.
 
You are right in a way, but you miss the point. If an oil company could build a refinery for free, it would still lose ROI, because oil prices will go down.

As to the impossibility of building a refinery, you are wrong on that too. Did you know that a US refinery is being built as we speak? It is only going in because congress practically forced it on the oil companies during the last price spike.

And again, they could build in other countries if they chose, they just don't want to.



Yeah right! Building a new refinery is on the same par as building a new nuclear plant! Overregulated and priced out of reason.
The reason no one wants to do so is that to get a return on your investment makes the project itself unfeasible.
 
I need to expand a bit on the oil comments. Some of the price of oil is true supply demand, but as we all know much is speculation based. We all see that bad news drives prices up, but no or good news doesn't bring it down as much.

It is much like the diamond business- prices stay high on the PERCEPTION of scarcity as much as reality.

So, a new refinery is bad for an oil company. Even if in theory it could produce more oil which is still sold at a profit, the risk to the oil company is that prices will fall too much based on the perception that new refined crude is finally available. Lots of potential downside, few upsides. Plus, it would cost lots of money regulation or no regulation.

They are good businessmen, and they know their market. Too bad the airlines, and all of us are taking the hit.

One other note: the low interests rates are dropping the dollar, another reason oil is going up, totally separate from the refining issue.
 
You are right in a way, but you miss the point. If an oil company could build a refinery for free, it would still lose ROI, because oil prices will go down.

As to the impossibility of building a refinery, you are wrong on that too. Did you know that a US refinery is being built as we speak? It is only going in because congress practically forced it on the oil companies during the last price spike.

And again, they could build in other countries if they chose, they just don't want to.
I didn't miss the point at all! The price of refining oil is added to the barrel price and passed on period.

So it doesn't matter to a refiner whether oil is at $10 or a $100 a barrel they still get their refining cost added.

The problem of a new refinery is economics make it impossible to make a profit(markup) because the price of new construction + meeting the regulatory cost price exceedes competing with the current refineries .
Hence no new refineries. If and until this is relaxed no one is going to play no matter if oil goes to a $150.

Although if it does the shipping cost from another country will certainly be feasible.
 
Last edited:
Fair points. Refiners and producers are often not the same. But, they do work closely together and have their tentacles in each other. (Mutually assured profits).

I think more new refineries will happen, but we need an aggregate plan, including nuclear.

Good discussion, but I gotta go fly!

Good luck to Sun Country, ATA, and Champion people. And maybe to the rest of us too, we all need it.
 
Fair points. Refiners and producers are often not the same. But, they do work closely together and have their tentacles in each other. (Mutually assured profits).

I think more new refineries will happen, but we need an aggregate plan, including nuclear.

Good discussion, but I gotta go fly!

Good luck to Sun Country, ATA, and Champion people. And maybe to the rest of us too, we all need it.

Agreed! Have a good one and I share your sentiments toward our fellow colleagues.
 
They can't go just anywhere though and build them. Didn't Chavez just "nationalize" about 5 billion worth of assets of the oil companies?
 
Common guys... Its not the rifinery's.... Oil was in the 70's less then a year ago, and there weren't anyless or more refinery's as there are now. Remember, oil is traded in dollars. The lower the dollar, the more expensive the oil. Throw ontop of that the old supply and demand equasion, and also speculation, and you have $100+ a barrel oil... As far as supply and demand goes. I just read several articles that said supply and demand would equal oil in the $70-$80 a barrel range. Until we get the value of the dollar up, were all really screwed...
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Latest resources

Back
Top