Straight shootin' about JetBlue

[hoya saxa]

. i don't know...just a guess!!! LOL

Are you virtually laughing at your own joke? That's truly gay; as is "LOL" to begin with. Unless of course you're a fourteen year old blogger chatting with all your fellow Star Trekkies!

 

[Redmeat]

That's truly gay;

No what is "truly" gay my friend is your avatar.

 

[hoya saxa]

No what is "truly" gay my friend is your avatar.

What's wrong with my yearbook photo? The chicks dug me back in the day!

 

[TonyC]

well tony c....i am glad you asked! please don't take this personally, but rather as a lesson to those with similar career profiles as yourself. we all know who they are!!

i am curious what makes you the resident "expert" in commercial PASSENGER aviation.....without commercial PASSENGER aviation experience?

...

at ease...........

Well, wndshr, if I had claimed to be an expert on commercial passenger aviation, or if I had been making a comment about commercial passenger aviation, then your comments would be on point.


I made a comment about the fuss that B6 pilots made about RJ rates, and the consequent changes made - - NONE.


What type of credentials do you suppose would qualify one to make such an observation?




.

 

[I.P. Freley]

No what is "truly" gay my friend is your avatar.

Oh, snap!

(sorry, but that's what they said 'back in the day' )

 

[IB6 UB9]

Well, wndshr, if I had claimed to be an expert on commercial passenger aviation, or if I had been making a comment about commercial passenger aviation, then your comments would be on point.


I made a comment about the fuss that B6 pilots made about RJ rates, and the consequent changes made - - NONE.


What type of credentials do you suppose would qualify one to make such an observation?




.

Here's what I think. I think TonyC is a legacy reject that landed at Fedex because he couldn't get hired anywhere else...and now struts around the grocery stores in his uniform spouting off about how he is the highest paid in the industry. He applied during the big hiring boom, couldn't get a job, finally applied at Fedex, had some recommendations from his "call sign buddies" (which they still use everytime they speak to each other, like at bars, during phone calls, and family functions) and got hired. Shortly after...his shat doesn't stink, he is the industry expert, and goes around saying "ya, while all you were going to the legacies...I had a vision and went to Fedex. (beats chest) Me cool, shat no stink!! Tony, there are a few of you dorks at every airline...I bet my buddies at your company groan when they have to share a flight deck with you. Keep your drivel going though...you are approaching General Lee Wrong territory! Tool.

 

[TonyC]

Here's what I think. I think TonyC is a legacy reject that landed at Fedex because he couldn't get hired anywhere else...and now struts around the grocery stores in his uniform spouting off about how he is the highest paid in the industry. He applied during the big hiring boom, couldn't get a job, finally applied at Fedex, had some recommendations from his "call sign buddies" (which they still use everytime they speak to each other, like at bars, during phone calls, and family functions) and got hired. Shortly after...his shat doesn't stink, he is the industry expert, and goes around saying "ya, while all you were going to the legacies...I had a vision and went to Fedex. (beats chest) Me cool, shat no stink!! Tony, there are a few of you dorks at every airline...I bet my buddies at your company groan when they have to share a flight deck with you. Keep your drivel going though...you are approaching General Lee Wrong territory! Tool.

I take it you're not a big fan of your RJ rates, either.








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[radarlove]

250/ quarter .

Mmmmhmm. Tell me all about this 250 per quarter.

 

[TonyC]

Mmmmhmm. Tell me all about this 250 per quarter.

It's a commercial passenger aviation thing.









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[zkmayo]

Mmmmhmm. Tell me all about this 250 per quarter.

Radar,

The 250/quarter thing is one of the measuring sticks JB crew services to guage how much you are flying. Commercially were all limited to 1000 hours in a turbojet, so they figure that to stay on pace and not time out you should not do more than 250/quarter. Supposedly they'll call you up and discuss other options with you (bid min schedule, fly a reserve line, or some other plan) to get you back on track to not exceed 1000 hours in a calendar year. So far, Ive never heard of anyone being asked to have that done. With vacation and training (either recurrent or upgrade) its usually not an issue. Ive heard of people going way over 250 hours in a quarter and not being called. For most people, that's way to much work. Its all about credit hours, not the amt actually flown.

 

[klhoard]

Radar,

The 250/quarter thing is one of the measuring sticks JB crew services to guage how much you are flying. Commercially were all limited to 1000 hours in a turbojet, so they figure that to stay on pace and not time out you should not do more than 250/quarter. Supposedly they'll call you up and discuss other options with you (bid min schedule, fly a reserve line, or some other plan) to get you back on track to not exceed 1000 hours in a calendar year. So far, Ive never heard of anyone being asked to have that done. With vacation and training (either recurrent or upgrade) its usually not an issue. Ive heard of people going way over 250 hours in a quarter and not being called. For most people, that's way to much work. Its all about credit hours, not the amt actually flown.

.
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Are you talking about 250 BLOCK HOURS per quarter? I've screwed up if I fly that much in a YEAR!!!
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[klhoard]

Do you have anything to contribute that is pertinent to the topic?

What does my background have to do with anything?







well tony c....i am glad you asked! please don't take this personally, but rather as a lesson to those with similar career profiles as yourself. we all know who they are!!

i am curious what makes you the resident "expert" in commercial PASSENGER aviation.....without commercial PASSENGER aviation experience? most of the bubbas i have flown with and jumpseated with at the legacies....and even B6 know when to "shut up and color" when it comes to understanding the true economics of the passenger airline industry. they learn A LOT while sitting next to ol timers who have been through 5 airlines and 2 furloughs from jobs they were promised to retire from! you can't GAIN experience from reading all the books....just as you can't assume the job as captain by reading FLYING magazine! EXPERIENCE is what gives you credibility.

if i wanted to know how many gallons of gas a KC135 holds?....i would ask the tony c....cubic volume of one of those fedex plastic things that goes into the back of the plane?...ask tony c. what is the max radiation exposure that you are allowed over a certain period of time? ask tony c. what is a sort in MEM? VMO on a 727? etc etc.

unfortunately, your lack of experience in commercial passenger aviation cannot go unnoticed. your opinions and comments don't seem to have any basis that is relevant in this particular sector of aviation...that is why i am GUESSING there is a CARGO forum on flightinfo??? i don't know...just a guess!!! LOL

anyway, please don't be discouraged from commenting but i am sure you are aware that your opinions are not only free, (you get what you pay for!!!) but they come from no real understanding of an industry for which you have no experience.

remember....EXPERIENCE EARNS CREDIBILITY and RESPECT...not the other way around!

at ease...........

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It looks like he was smart enough to avoid the pax business. . . .
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[SUNDOWN]

I take it you're not a big fan of your RJ rates, either.








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TonyC, you need to spend a little more time outdoors. Dude, you fly all night and still have time for over 3500 posts? Get a life.

 

[Daedalus]

Tony's callsign in the AF was "Tanker TOAD."

I find it unusual that so many FedEx folks feel compelled to pontificate on how jetBlue pilots should be careful about working without a real contract. Meanwhile, unionized pilot groups all over the industry are getting taken to the woodshed and sodomized with theirs. The most recent one appears to be Polar Air (Atlas)...an ALPA carrier. It's funny I don't see Tony over there sharing his spectacular insights among his own cargo brothers since their problems have a potentially greater impact on his own future than JetBlue ever will.

 

[wndshr]

hoya saxa klhoard, and tony c


for the sake of your bretheren with the SAME career profiles......(take a moment to digest that.......) you guys are embarrassing good men out there who know when to "watch, listen and learn."

 

[Smoking Man]

Tony's callsign in the AF was "Tanker TOAD."

I find it unusual that so many FedEx folks feel compelled to pontificate on how jetBlue pilots should be careful about working without a real contract. Meanwhile, unionized pilot groups all over the industry are getting taken to the woodshed and sodomized with theirs. The most recent one appears to be Polar Air (Atlas)...an ALPA carrier. It's funny I don't see Tony over there sharing his spectacular insights among his own cargo brothers since their problems have a potentially greater impact on his own future than JetBlue ever will.

NICE

 

[klhoard]

hoya saxa klhoard, and tony c


for the sake of your bretheren with the SAME career profiles......(take a moment to digest that.......) you guys are embarrassing good men out there who know when to "watch, listen and learn."

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Yeah, it seems we all "watched, listened and learned" BEFORE we got into the game. . . . .
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(take a moment to digest THAT). . . .
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[GogglesPisano]

had some recommendations from his "call sign buddies" (which they still use everytime they speak to each other, like at bars, during phone calls, and family functions) l.

That is just too funny!

 

[Dogwood]

I've been reading around on these boards and I'm sure the truth is out there, but between everyone taking a swat at JetBlue and a lot of misinformation, I'm still a little confused about the 5-year contract.

What is it? Is it a promissory note (IOU) or what? What is the penalty for leaving (should one choose to do so)? Is the company obligated in any way in the contract or is it simply a retention tool to control turnover? What happens after five years (I hear that some of the first to sign the contract are coming up on their five year anniversary)?

Looking forward to a straight answer.

Thanks fellas,
- TT

TT,

The bottom line "to me", is that our 5 yr agreement is a no-brainer and non-event. There's really nothing to it. You sign it, file away your copy, and go about your career.

The contract I signed when my cable TV service was installed is more complex and more binding.

DW

 

[wndshr]

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Yeah, it seems we all "watched, listened and learned" BEFORE we got into the game. . . . .
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(take a moment to digest THAT). . . .





please remember klhoard...

you must EARN the respect of your civilian counterparts at fedex, ups, dhl etc. respect is earned ONLY by experience, for which you have only a very limited amount of.

please don't make the mistake while in the cockpit of pontificating about an industry that represents complexities far beyond your level of understanding....your counterparts sitting next to you will greatly appreciate it!

good day son!
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[hoya saxa]

please remember klhoard...

you must EARN the respect of your civilian counterparts at fedex, ups, dhl etc. respect is earned ONLY by experience, for which you have only a very limited amount of.

please don't make the mistake while in the cockpit of pontificating about an industry that represents complexities far beyond your level of understanding....your counterparts sitting next to you will greatly appreciate it!

good day son!
.
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Please Mr. wndshr, let me sit at your ample knee and soak up the wisdom you're so eager to impart! I'm absolutely dying to earn your respect! Without it, I feel empty and alone! BTW, when was I claiming any particular expertise on this thread? You, sir, are a laughable clown. Thanks for the chuckle!

hoya the wannabe wndshr

 

[TonyC]

I find it unusual that so many FedEx folks feel compelled to pontificate on how jetBlue pilots should be careful about working without a real contract.

Where did a FedEx folk say that on this thread?

you guys are embarrassing good men out there who know when to "watch, listen and learn."

Yeah, like the "good men" that can contribute nothing to this thread other than cheap shots and name calling. If you only realized how IGNORANT that makes you look...



Let's review, folks. This thread was going along quite pleasantly. wndshr postulated that the REASON Jetblue pilots have a 5-year contract is that the FAs have a 5-year contract, and the "stink it would raise if the pilots didn't have the same thing [as the FAs]..." I disagreed with his opinion, offering as an example the introduction of the RJ rates and the resultant "stink."


He has offered not one scintilla of logical rationale to refute that observation. Rather, he has launched a campaign of name-calling and chaff-throwing, and his oh-so-mature compatriots have joined along in the party. At the same time, he smugly advises us to sit, listen, and learn.

Well, I've learned, alright. I've learned that he's an arrogant, pompus, blowhole that HAS no substance, and has no intelligence, and deserves no respect.


Kinda reminds me of FoxHunter.

Foxhunter, is that YOU!?

I know, you can't stand it because I ignore you, so you changed your name?


Oh, this is so funny.

 

[TonyC]

TonyC, you need to spend a little more time outdoors. Dude, you fly all night and still have time for over 3500 posts? Get a life.

Another shining example of intelligence.




.

 

[Redmeat]

Please Mr. wndshr, let me sit at your ample knee and soak up the wisdom you're so eager to impart!

Man, you really are gay aren't you? "Not that there's anything wrong with that".

 

[FoxHunter]

Here's what I think. I think TonyC is a legacy reject that landed at Fedex because he couldn't get hired anywhere else...and now struts around the grocery stores in his uniform spouting off about how he is the highest paid in the industry. He applied during the big hiring boom, couldn't get a job, finally applied at Fedex, had some recommendations from his "call sign buddies" (which they still use everytime they speak to each other, like at bars, during phone calls, and family functions) and got hired. Shortly after...his shat doesn't stink, he is the industry expert, and goes around saying "ya, while all you were going to the legacies...I had a vision and went to Fedex. (beats chest) Me cool, shat no stink!! Tony, there are a few of you dorks at every airline...I bet my buddies at your company groan when they have to share a flight deck with you. Keep your drivel going though...you are approaching General Lee Wrong territory! Tool.

Actually Tony was hired to drive one of those little FedEx trucks/vans for some reason. He was later hired as an Internal pilot applicant. Sort of like getting a pilot job at Jet Blue after working in the back for a while. Hmm, not sure if he tried that also.

Please excuse Tony because he has been in a great deal of hurt in recent days.

 

[Eagleflip]

Actually, Tony, you are only partially correct in my estimation.

Yes, the EMB pay rates stink. That much has been widely accepted by the JB pilot group as a whole.

Now, you say that the "stink" we raised has not changed anything. I respectfully disagree.

When the new contract was released, the EMB pay rates were included. This was the first time such rates were ever officially announced, and the pilot group took great exception to those numbers, as well as many other issues that were part of the proposed contract.

Subsequently, the company recognized--after hosting numerous pilot sessions and taking individual input for weeks--that certain issues within the new contract were (unintentionally, in my view) detrimental to the pilot group as a whole. I was quite proud of our group--we managed to convey our positions in emphatic, sometimes emotional and certainly unequivocal terms, and we did so in support of those not yet hired.

For example, a proposed plan to have professional arbitration to reconcile individual pilot/company disputes was canned upon review. Cost-sharing was the determining factor. Likewise, ill-advised provisions that would have allowed the company to take adverse job action against a pilot for failure to adhere to JetBlue's company values were retracted (for obvious reasons...who defines the value, who determines the severity?) Other issues, such as the new Airbus and EMB pay rates, PTO provisions, and liability indemnity increases were retained.

Does the fact that the EMB rates were maintained mean that nothing was accomplished? In fact, no. Our management has heard the pilot group loud and clear. These rates are still substandard, but the need for change has been established. How that change will take place is yet to be determined, but I think it somewhat disingenuous that you would suggest that our voices were not heard. Slow movement is not as fulfilling as quick , but I honestly believe that our current management team is willing to listen and take appropriate action once the aircraft has become established.

 

[TonyC]

Thank you, Eagleflip, for your thoughtful, unemotional contribution to the thread.

Actually, Tony, you are only partially correct in my estimation.

...

Now, you say that the "stink" we raised has not changed anything. I respectfully disagree.

... I think it somewhat disingenuous that you would suggest that our voices were not heard.

It's good to get back to the discussion. Certainly the changes that you described are not visible from the outside, so you might appreciate my misperception. wndshr could have rectified that misperception quite simply by stating what you have stated rather than by attacking me personally. Perhaps wndshr didn't know these things, and needs to be educated on the work that was done on his behalf regarding the arbitration and company values issues.

On a finer point, I did not say that your voices were not heard. I'm aware that you have the opportunity to voice your opinions, and I've heard about the sessions, and I know specifically that you voiced your displeasure about the RJ rates. What I said was that they resulted in no change, and I did so to contradict wndshr's explanation as to why you have a five year contract. He suggested that the FA's stink (hmm, better clarify that... not their body odor, but the raucous they'd raise ) would have been influential to the point of management imposing a five year contract rather a contract of any other length.

Given the information you have supplied I will admit that I was wrong in saying it brought no change. However, I maintain that wndshr's assertion is incorrect; a stink raised by the FAs could not have been sufficient to change the way pilot contracts are handled.


And that's my opinon.




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[TonyC]

Wah, wah, wah, wah wah wah wah. Wah wah wah wah wah wah.

Wah wah wha wah wah. Wah wah.

Wah.

Amazing.

I mention his name, and he shows up.

FoxHunter already collected his marbles and went home, because he doesn't want to play with the neighborhood kids anymore. He's hanging out of his second floor bedroom window now, crying because we won't change the game rules to suit him.




Wanna vote? Be a member.




.

 

[wndshr]

Where did a FedEx folk say that on this thread?




Yeah, like the "good men" that can contribute nothing to this thread other than cheap shots and name calling. If you only realized how IGNORANT that makes you look...



Let's review, folks. This thread was going along quite pleasantly. wndshr postulated that the REASON Jetblue pilots have a 5-year contract is that the FAs have a 5-year contract, and the "stink it would raise if the pilots didn't have the same thing [as the FAs]..." I disagreed with his opinion, offering as an example the introduction of the RJ rates and the resultant "stink."


He has offered not one scintilla of logical rationale to refute that observation. Rather, he has launched a campaign of name-calling and chaff-throwing, and his oh-so-mature compatriots have joined along in the party. At the same time, he smugly advises us to sit, listen, and learn.

Well, I've learned, alright. I've learned that he's an arrogant, pompus, blowhole that HAS no substance, and has no intelligence, and deserves no respect.


Kinda reminds me of FoxHunter.

Foxhunter, is that YOU!?

I know, you can't stand it because I ignore you, so you changed your name?


Oh, this is so funny.

EASSSSSY TONY C and friends.....

i challenge you to find a quote of mine where i am name calling?


i am merely giving a verbal "timeout" and offering advice that could help a fella's career at the cargo's. now even i know that advice is free and you get what you pay for....it just may make for a better trip! especially if you are flying some long international 5 or 6 day trip to the edge of the earth!

i was very careful to not group any name(s), just certain profiles. however, for most of us, we have all flown with the type of folks that seem to have become an overnight (no pun intended) expert in civilian aviation. what is even worse is when those "experts" try to draw parallels between different sectors of civilian aviation....i hope i don't have to remind you that comparing cargo to passenger aviation is a very large leap, and a leap that requires experience in BOTH venues in order to be heard, appreciated and respected.

in my lonely opinion....your repeated attempts (numerous other topics) to flamebait folks over the B6 about emb pay finally motivated me to send you and friends to school and offer a verbal timeout.

i am sorry if i have hurt your feelings, or any of your friends feelings, but i feel it is important to KNOW your target audience, and be thoroughly briefed on subject matter before launching flamebait that exposes your lack of experience in our sector of aviation.

i am sure you will be relieved to know that i would not think of posting statements on the cargo or military forum. i respectfully leave that task to those that have earned that credential with experience.

 

[AAflyer]

Hey TonyC,

I like You!!

AAflyer