Spirit ALPA Wins Arbitration on 4-days-off Language

[boomlrd]

You are right, but we are making money! So thats the small difference.

 

[boomlrd]

Just received the email regarding the arbitration ruling, basically we won, but no compensation or relief was provided. The company was ordered to cease and desist their illegal activity. The April bid package shows the company is complying. Great work by the MEC, keep up the good work! We all thank you!

 

[enigma]

Just received the email regarding the arbitration ruling, basically we won, but no compensation or relief was provided. The company was ordered to cease and desist their illegal activity. The April bid package shows the company is complying. Great work by the MEC, keep up the good work! We all thank you!

Sorry, but the credit goes to ALPA. Arbitrations are a legal matter. Our Contract Administrators, past and present, won a legal argument.

This is a great example of ALPA's value. The experience and expertise of the ALPA legal staff won this battle.

Our careers are controlled by the RLA/NMB which is very much a legal entity which must be dealt with by legal counsel. We join together as ALPA (and pay dues) precisely because we need to bring in experts to do our business. We are pilots, not lawyers.

 

[huncowboy]

Sorry, but the credit goes to ALPA. Arbitrations are a legal matter. Our Contract Administrators, past and present, won a legal argument.

This is a great example of ALPA's value. The experience and expertise of the ALPA legal staff won this battle.

Our careers are controlled by the RLA/NMB which is very much a legal entity which must be dealt with by legal counsel. We join together as ALPA (and pay dues) precisely because we need to bring in experts to do our business. We are pilots, not lawyers.

Enigma,

I don't want to turn this into a ALPA vs XY thread. Overall I am pro union anyhow. But we need to take a step back before we bow to ALPA and give them credit.

If ALPA's lawyers would have done their job back when our TA was signed into contract, we should have not lost a SINGLE arbitration since. That is not the case. Our contract is full of weak language and that is ALPA's fault. Their lawyers are there to advise us to write air tight language as much as it is possible. That is the first step in legal defense. Have a well written contract, and you don't have to defend it too often.

Not the case with the NK contract. Just like the contract we had over at Chautauqua. It was not worth the paper it was written on. Weak language gets you into arbitration quicker than anything. We should have never lost the door close arbitration, but we did. That too thanks to ALPA.

 

[troll565]

http://i39.tinypic.com/33bhd0n.jpg

 

[:-)]

Enigma,

I don't want to turn this into a ALPA vs XY thread. Overall I am pro union anyhow. But we need to take a step back before we bow to ALPA and give them credit.

If ALPA's lawyers would have done their job back when our TA was signed into contract, we should have not lost a SINGLE arbitration since. That is not the case. Our contract is full of weak language and that is ALPA's fault. Their lawyers are there to advise us to write air tight language as much as it is possible. That is the first step in legal defense. Have a well written contract, and you don't have to defend it too often.

Not the case with the NK contract. Just like the contract we had over at Chautauqua. It was not worth the paper it was written on. Weak language gets you into arbitration quicker than anything. We should have never lost the door close arbitration, but we did. That too thanks to ALPA.

Contract03 was overseen by one Neil D. You TranStaters will know the name. It was written during Duane Worths reign and we all know that ALPA during that time wasn't really friendly to regionals or nationals.

Herb got rid of Neil and brought in Art L.

Thanks Herb for getting rid of Neil D. Thanks Art for fixing Neils f-ups. Thanks pilots for dumping Dueane Worth.

 

[Fly Astar Jets]

...Herb got rid of Neil and brought in Art L.

Thanks Herb for getting rid of Neil D. Thanks Art for fixing Neils f-ups. Thanks pilots for dumping Dueane Worth.

Art is a good man.

Congratz on a good win. :beer:

 

[Beetle007]

Enigma,
If ALPA's lawyers would have done their job back when our TA was signed into contract, we should have not lost a SINGLE arbitration since. That is not the case. Our contract is full of weak language and that is ALPA's fault.

Which arbitration are you referencing that we lost? The wheel roll was NOT grey language. Our contract is very clear that block time begins when the aircraft first moves and block time ends when the aircraft comes to its final stop.

If anything, the company was at fault for paying us better than the contract allows. When they went back to following the contract language, we had the legal ability to argue that they had set past precedence and could not change the status quo during negotiations. But, there was no grey language in the contract.

 

[huncowboy]

Which arbitration are you referencing that we lost? The wheel roll was NOT grey language. Our contract is very clear that block time begins when the aircraft first moves and block time ends when the aircraft comes to its final stop.

If anything, the company was at fault for paying us better than the contract allows. When they went back to following the contract language, we had the legal ability to argue that they had set past precedence and could not change the status quo during negotiations. But, there was no grey language in the contract.

You are correct. I was referring to the wheel roll arbitration and indeed block time "Block-to-Block" is defined.

 

[Beetle007]

Luckily we won both of the grey areas. 4 days off and the training hotels had muddy language. I know I should be thanking someone for winning these for us.