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Southwest Upgrade

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puddlejumper101 said:
It is ironic though when I hear a Delta pilot mention how cocky and arrogant SWA pilots are...that's like a hooker calling a stripper a W#@$%. Delta invented arrogance, double-brested jacket and all.
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I think it's more ironic when some sw fng thinks that they invented the "top industry pay." When you were handing out favors to pay for your type rating, southwest was at or near the bottom of the pay scales in the industry.;)
 
I think it's more ironic when some sw fng thinks that they invented the "top industry pay." When you were handing out favors to pay for your type rating, southwest was at or near the bottom of the pay scales in the industry.;)
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At least we "scoped out RJs"
 
redflyer65 said:
what everyone has to realize with upgrades is that when (not if) southwest goes full international with it's first wide body, the upgrades will drop to 5-7 years for everyone on the current list. Including all the airtran guys.

It's the equivelant of looking at delta in the early days before they went to europe. The growth potential is off the map.

Southwest will already have 3200+ flights a day feeding a new international network. It's the best domestic to international feed in the nation, easily.

I think all the junior sw/aai guys are in for a wild ride.
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pass the pipe you red belly hog!!!!!
 
Hey, I'm happy just doing domestic as long as we continue to have year over year profits like the last 39.

Just like everyone else over the years, you can doubt SW will do this or that, but I'd say Dallas has a full plan for international departures in the future. The timeframe? I have no idea. I see them looking to get past the AAI acquisition and possibly past the Wright Amendment restrictions first.
 
I think a lot of the old guys who didn't care that this was a stunt and a windfall, thought the industry woiuld be better off by now and the change effects wouldn't be this bad. Now that the opposite is true, and we still have a poor economy and are now dealing with mergers, is there any acknowledgement from SWAPA that this age change has created an unintended reality for junior members? As an ALPA member I can tell you this: if anything, the senior types care even less and are even more emboldened to pull the ladder up again. ALPA National looks less and less like a union every month. What's up with SWAPA on the issue?
 
Tripower455 said:
Just a little perspective.

My old man got hired by Pan Am in '66, and if you told him he'd retire in '96 from Delta (which he did), he'd have laughed you out of the room, since Delta was little more than a regional at the time.

When the Pan Am guys went over to Delta in '91, they were underwhelmed with the way Delta ran the international ops, since Delta was still relatively new at it and most of those guys had 25-30+ years experience doing nothing but international.

The bottom line is that you never know what's gonna happen in this industry. We might be going to CLE in 20 years, we might be going to Narita, or we might be out of business. Who knows. I just hope we last another 19.

Oh, and don't blame age 65 on us either. It took ALPA to make it change. Our guys had as much effect as Don Quixote had on his windmills for the 20 years or so they wasted our union dues trying to change it.
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Did your dad write the book 'Sky Gods' by chance?
 
Tripower455 said:
No. But it's a pretty close account of a Pan Am career from his perspective. I don't think the author went to Delta, but I could be wrong.
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http://gandt.com/cgi-bin/p/awtp-custom.cgi?d=robert-gandt-productions&page=6652

I thought I remembered that the author hired on in 66 and went to Delta. It turns out I had his Pan Am hire date wrong, it was 65. I remember thoroughly enjoying the book.

My dad was hired at Ual in 66, and while never furloughed, was a long time Fe and Fo. As far as the long and bumpy ride to the left seat, a 66 Pan Am and Ual hire had a very similar experience, despite many other differences.
 
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vetrider said:
http://gandt.com/cgi-bin/p/awtp-custom.cgi?d=robert-gandt-productions&page=6652

I thought I remembered that the author hired on in 66 and went to Delta. It turns out I had his Pan Am hire date wrong, it was 65. I remember thoroughly enjoying the book.

My dad was hired at Ual in 66, and while never furloughed, was a long time Fe and Fo. As far as the long and bumpy ride to the left seat, a 66 Pan Am and Ual hire had a very similar experience, despite many other differences.
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Yup... 21 year upgrade for my dad and never furloughed. He came close though!

Skygods is a great read and a relevant warning, even today. You never know what's gonna happen!
 
Tripower455 said:
Yup... 21 year upgrade for my dad and never furloughed. He came close though!

Skygods is a great read and a relevant warning, even today. You never know what's gonna happen!
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It was 20 years for mine, and then into the left seat of a 737-200. Ual didn't hire a sole from 70-78, and the 69-70 hires were furloughed for much or all of that time frame.

Meanwhile, a buddy of my dad's, same age, but hired in early 64, upgraded in short order and kept it. He used to love to tell me that story, "let me tell you what a number means....."

That dividing line between a have and have not can be in an awfully narrow time frame. It's also why these seniority integrations get so contentious, because of what a number means.

I remember when I told my dad I wanted to pursue this career, he kind of gave me an 'oh boy' look and warned me that it could be rough going.
 
redflyer65 said:
Just like everyone else over the years, you can doubt SW will do this or that, but I'd say Dallas has a full plan for international departures in the future. The timeframe? I have no idea. I see them looking to get past the AAI acquisition and possibly past the Wright Amendment restrictions first.
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The Wright Amendment repeal prohibits international flights from DAL, even after 2014.
 
SKC said:
The Wright Amendment repeal prohibits international flights from DAL, even after 2014.
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Doesn't prohibit massive growth out of Love though.

Flights like DAL-SEA, DAL-BOS, DAL-LAX, etc. They've already been running the numbers on how many flights they can work per hour at each gate and it's not a small number.
 
redflyer65 said:
Doesn't prohibit massive growth out of Love though.

Flights like DAL-SEA, DAL-BOS, DAL-LAX, etc. They've already been running the numbers on how many flights they can work per hour at each gate and it's not a small number.
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Oh, I expect lots of growth out of here in 2014. I'm looking forward to it.

I was just referring to the earlier statement of possible international flights out of DAL.
 

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