Southwest Pilots Aggressively Push Age 65

[FoxHunter]

SWA/FO,

It appears that you think we all ride our own horse here in the industry. How I wish that were true. Whether you like it not, we all in the industry are tied together for better or worse. Management continually plays us off one another whether a legacy, regional, freight, you name it.

It’s when SWA doesn’t have an adequate retirement plan, goes to the government for relief and now I have to pay the price because SWAPA couldn’t negotiate a good retirement package that pisses me off. It’s like you didn’t give any consideration for the rest of the industry.

Contracts come and go, companies go up and down. Right now, Southwest is amongst the tops. With United, NWA and Delta, I can understand their reasoning, but with Southwest it’s incomprehensible what you are doing. Given the strength of your company along with your leverage, SWAPA should be able to negotiate an adequate retirement package so you can adequately retire at age 60.

Do us all a favor and force your negotiating team to bring back a solid retirement plan.

Age 60 is a built in early retirement and you guys are going to lose it for all of us.

AA767AV8TOR

Although the SWA pilots have been fighting the age 60 rule for some time they will be the first to say they are far from alone today. Pilots from UAL, JetBlue, American, NWA, ATA, UPS, USAIR, FedEx, Horizon, Continental, Chautauqua and others have spent their time and money to get the rule changed. Many hours talking to Senators, Congressman, and most of all staffers have resulted in a great deal of support for the change.

 

[Bake]

Honestly I don't give a rat's ass what you guys think I should do for you or anyone else in this industry. When you were top of the pay scale getting your A plan B plan and c plan we were trudging along doing the best we could. SWA F/O and the rest of us will do the best we can for us with what we have. We will get the raises we deserve, invest our money where we see fit and not worry about you. Don't worry about us. If you want us to tow the line to make your benefits better you should find another rope. Bavarian, I couldn't care less what you guys over at JB make or what your retirment is. I know for a fact you benefits lag SWA's by a wide percentage.

 

[gearjockey]

http://www.congress.org/congressorg/bio/userletter/?letter_id=388913371


To all you babies about to watch your lives go down the drain, here's your chance to weigh in with the people that make the decisions. Hopefully you all did this earlier but it's not over til the fat lady sings.

 

[FN FAL]

Don't worry RJ captains, when you reach age 60, you can come fly a carvan down by us if you don't have enough money to retire on.

Hahahahahahaha.

 

[BVT94]

I 100% agree with "LUVIN LIFE". and SWA pilot group to go 65.
Why should we let foreign pilots fly in our airspace up to 65 but we can't?

Maybe because a foreign pilot flyin' in our airspace isnt gonna make me work weekends for the next 5 years so some senior Captain can support his 3 ex-wives.

 

[Bavarian Chef]

Honestly I don't give a rat's ass what you guys think I should do for you or anyone else in this industry. When you were top of the pay scale getting your A plan B plan and c plan we were trudging along doing the best we could. SWA F/O and the rest of us will do the best we can for us with what we have. We will get the raises we deserve, invest our money where we see fit and not worry about you. Don't worry about us. If you want us to tow the line to make your benefits better you should find another rope. Bavarian, I couldn't care less what you guys over at JB make or what your retirment is. I know for a fact you benefits lag SWA's by a wide percentage.

You lost me. You asked me what they were at jb and I told you. AND, I said we had the same "retirement" benefits, just less. Your point?

 

[Falcon Jet 1]

Hey bud, don't flatter yourself. We don't care so much about "you", we care about what SWA pilots as a whole are up to. Your not doing your own thing by pushing for changes that affect all of us.

For arguement sake, please estimate how much a SWA pilot with 20-25 years has in retirement if they started in the mid 80s. If you wouldn't mind.

The ones that Ive flown with that have that seniority typically have 2-3million between 401k, ps, and stock options. Some more and some less, I guess it depends on toys and pu$$y demand

 

[Bringupthebird]

So let's add the Age 60 rule to ALPA's List of Accomplishments 2001-2006
1. NWA Concessions
2. DAL Concessions
3. US Concessions
4. UA Concessions
5. TSA Outsourcing
6. XJT Outsourcing
7. TW debacle
8. HP pre-concession
9. ASA quagmire
10. Age 60 repeal

Yep, they're a force to be reckoned with. That Duane Woerth ought get a performance bonus!

 

[zonker]

So let's add the Age 60 rule to ALPA's List of Accomplishments 2001-2006
1. NWA Concessions
2. DAL Concessions
3. US Concessions
4. UA Concessions
5. TSA Outsourcing
6. XJT Outsourcing
7. TW debacle
8. HP pre-concession
9. ASA quagmire
10. Age 60 repeal

Yep, they're a force to be reckoned with. That Duane Woerth ought get a performance bonus!

He's drawing the line at Mesaba, though. You gotta give him credit for that!

:laugh:

 

[SWA/FO]

For arguement sake, please estimate how much a SWA pilot with 20-25 years has in retirement if they started in the mid 80s. If you wouldn't mind.

I've heard some guys retire with 8 million... A union guy I flew with told me I'd have 16 million if I work til 65 with 12% return. Unfortunately I don't remember the other figures. Probably around 9 million at age 60 with 12% return. Not sure, I believe that 100% but he did have a fancy computer program that spit out all this info.

 

[Andy]

I've heard some guys retire with 8 million... A union guy I flew with told me I'd have 16 million if I work til 65 with 12% return. Unfortunately I don't remember the other figures. Probably around 9 million at age 60 with 12% return. Not sure, I believe that 100% but he did have a fancy computer program that spit out all this info.

GIGO. I heard the same sh!t at UAUA back in Y2K. I'm counting on karma taking care of you.

 

[Flopgut]

Thanks Falcon and SWA/FO for the honest estimate. My honest question is: If your going to have over 3 mil. why work?

 

[Andy]

[quote='LUVIN LIFE]It's not a matter of retirement packages, it's a matter of principle. Why should we let foreign pilots fly in our airspace up to 65 but we can't?[/quote]

Perhaps you should stop listening to the drivel of Rep Gibbons and actually read about whether or not foreign pilots over age 60 are allowed to operate 121 aircraft in US airspace. They cannot. They may be able to after 23 Nov 06, but it is highly likely that the FAA has published or will publish an exception to the ICAO age rule and enforces age 60 as the maximum that any pilot can operate under part 121 in the US. Foreign or domestic pilot.

On second thought, let's just throw out ALL age restrictions on retirement. I want everyone in favor of increasing the age limitations the opportunity to converse with a 70 year old FAA controller; perhaps be pulled from a burning building by a 75 year old firefighter. I see no reason why cops can't be on the job unitl they're 80+. I would especially like to have an Air Marshall on board my aircraft with a loaded weapon who's 65 years old. It's all just age discrimination, right? Let's open up that Pandora's box and find out what's inside.

 

[Flopgut]

Not a bad idea Andy. Lets also bring back anybody who can still pass the physical and put em on the list where they left the list. Empty the nursing homes! Ol Bringingupthebird can go back to FO. In order to get the back pay right we can all get out our checkbook and refund the money we got when they left. How's that sound Bringupthebird? I can swing it, of course its a lot more money for you guys in the left seat. I think we'll find out that in the case of guys like you, it's a lot more about the timing of the rule change, not the rule.

Don't forget the interest!

 

[The Prussian]

I wouldn't take those honest estimates too seriously...they sound slightly to grossly over-estimated (especially if you're talking about a guy hired on in, say 1985)