Southwest Airlines pay in training

[slaquer5]

Bubba- then why make it a requirement? Not flaming... Truly curious... If it it's all the same the. Why make Simone pay for their own type rating? To prove they want the job bad enough? I guess I just don't get it... What a waste of time and money... For a type rating...

You answered your own question .


I agree, it should go away .

 

[SWA Bubba]

Bubba- then why make it a requirement? Not flaming... Truly curious... If it it's all the same the. Why make Simone pay for their own type rating? To prove they want the job bad enough? I guess I just don't get it... What a waste of time and money... For a type rating...

I suspect, as Slaquer said, that the answer is exactly as you suggested in your question--that it was to ensure that applicants really wanted the job. I agree that it's unnecessary, but I'm not in charge of that. I believe it will go away eventually, especially, when/if this pilot shortage that everyone keeps talking about shows up.

Bubba

 

[Tripower455]

Bubba- then why make it a requirement? Not flaming... Truly curious... If it it's all the same the. Why make Simone pay for their own type rating? To prove they want the job bad enough? I guess I just don't get it... What a waste of time and money... For a type rating...

As the others have said, it's a stupid requirement, that should go away. It doesn't save SW any training cost and has prevented a lot of great pilots from even applying.

It's ALMOST as stupid as requiring a 4 year degree....... to fly airplanes.

 

[BILL LUMBERG]

I get the point you're trying to make, and I realize arguing with someone that's posted on a forum 20K times is pointless, but SWA does NOT require PFT. In fact, they pay you over $1200 a week while in training.

What they require is a type rating. A rating which many people get through military, scholarships, and previous employers. This rating is YOURS, and has helped many get jobs flying BBJs and overseas airlines.

PFT was used in the mid-late 90's by regionals who required $10-12K to be trained with nothing to show but an FO slot on a turboprop.

Every SWA pilot I know, except for one, has a college degree, and he has a 2-year. We'll see how picky mighty DAL is about degrees when they need 80 newhires every month.

Don't try to rationalize it. The only thing every other airline requires is a degree and a logbook with experience......not a cheap way to make an applicant buy their job. No wonder the profits are so good, they put the burden of training on the applicants back.

 

[BILL LUMBERG]

As the others have said, it's a stupid requirement, that should go away. It doesn't save SW any training cost and has prevented a lot of great pilots from even applying.

It's ALMOST as stupid as requiring a 4 year degree....... to fly airplanes.

I agree with Tripower.....must be a full moon.

 

[BILL LUMBERG]

What is the Furlough Pay at Delta?

How's your pension plan doing?

 

[SWA Bubba]

Don't try to rationalize it. The only thing every other airline requires is a degree and a logbook with experience......not a cheap way to make an applicant buy their job. No wonder the profits are so good, they put the burden of training on the applicants back.

Actually, amongst the major airlines, I believe that it's ONLY Delta that requires a degree. Go figure.

Bubba

 

[BILL LUMBERG]

Yep, pretty dumb....I agree.

But the history of it made sense. It thinned the herd, unlike somebody with 8 grand in their pocket looking to save the company some money runs with a type in hand.

At least the degree can be used later in life or if a medical issue creeps up. A 737 type can do what for you again? Remind me.....

 

[SWA Bubba]

Yep, pretty dumb....I agree.

But the history of it made sense. It thinned the herd, unlike somebody with 8 grand in their pocket looking to save the company some money runs with a type in hand.

At least the degree can be used later in life or if a medical issue creeps up. A 737 type can do what for you again? Remind me.....

As has already been mentioned, it doesn't actually save the company any money. It's exactly like you described Delta's degree requirement--it thinned the herd.

Bubba

P.S. By the way, perhaps it's your company trying to save a little money. You know, requiring the degree in case "a medical issue creeps up," and the pilot needs another job. Nice of management to be concerned. Southwest covers that by giving Loss of License insurance.

 

[BILL LUMBERG]

Wow....a negotiated benefit!!

I would rather have my union negotiate a retirement plan or B fund contribution than a small outlay for a plan Harvey Watt or even ALPA provides.....but hey, that's just me.

We done unit measuring Bubba?

 

[Tripower455]

P.S. By the way, perhaps it's your company trying to save a little money. You know, requiring the degree in case "a medical issue creeps up," and the pilot needs another job. Nice of management to be concerned. Southwest covers that by giving Loss of License insurance.

I can't believe that people still buy their jobs at Delta! What do they charge for a PFT, 4 year degree nowadays?

 

[SWA Bubba]

Wow....a negotiated benefit!!

I would rather have my union negotiate a retirement plan or B fund contribution than a small outlay for a plan Harvey Watt or even ALPA provides.....but hey, that's just me.

We done unit measuring Bubba?

Just yanking your chain a little in jest, Bill. Didn't you notice the little smiley face?

By the way, did you notice that this was actually a thread about how new guys to Southwest get paid in initial training, and somebody (<ahem> General Lee) turned it into another SWA-bash, ala PFT. Funny how that happens, isn't it?

Bubba

 

[waveflyer]

Bubba- then why make it a requirement? Not flaming... Truly curious... If it it's all the same the. Why make Simone pay for their own type rating? To prove they want the job bad enough? I guess I just don't get it... What a waste of time and money... For a type rating...

Herb wanted pilots who were invested
Who took a risk

It probably will go away sometime but I find it funny that pilots who actually work here and paid for the type don't resent it as much as the rest of you-

It's not fun- but we do want people who want to work here

 

[Tripower455]

Herb wanted pilots who were invested
Who took a risk

It probably will go away sometime but I find it funny that pilots who actually work here and paid for the type don't resent it as much as the rest of you-

It's not fun- but we do want people who want to work here

I work here, and think it's a ridiculous requirement......

But.........

It was, by far, the best investment I've made in my career. Far more valuable than my degree from an accredited college or the 4 other types and FE rating that I have. Those were "paid" for with 10 years of ridiculously low wages and non existent QOL.

FWIW, I just got home from a straight pay 4 day that paid $2154 less than the cost of my type rating. the first day and a half of my next trip will cover the rest.

 

[waveflyer]

Right there with you Trip
Well said

Except it takes me a couple of 3 days to pay for mine

 

[canyonblue]

Wow....a negotiated benefit!!

I would rather have my union negotiate a retirement plan or B fund contribution than a small outlay for a plan Harvey Watt or even ALPA provides.....but hey, that's just me.

We done unit measuring Bubba?

Listen dough head, our LOL pay is exceptional. I'd still make more than you to stay home and golf. You have no clue what you are talking about.

 

[BILL LUMBERG]

Aww Canyon,

You get dropped as a baby?

We're just discussing stuff. Like Bubba said, smiley faces and whatnot. Of course you make more than me because you told me so.....

 

[BILL LUMBERG]

Well good for you guys...really. If you have the attitude that it is an investment, and you got a good return, then you should be satisfied, no question there.

I am so glad the rest of the chimps in airline management never followed SWAs lead. That would be a slippery slope for this industry if everybody had to bring their own type to the game. Where was SWAPA when all this went down?

 

[Tripower455]

Well good for you guys...really. If you have the attitude that it is an investment, and you got a good return, then you should be satisfied, no question there.

Everything I did prior to getting a major was an investment in my career. It began when I got my first job at the airport washing airplanes.

NOBODY but SW was hiring in the early to mid '90's, so after several years of deliberation, I took the chance and bought the type, interviewed, and got hired. My ONLY regret is not doing it sooner, which might've saved me a few years of misery in the commuters and night freight world.

I am so glad the rest of the chimps in airline management never followed SWAs lead. That would be a slippery slope for this industry if everybody had to bring their own type to the game.

As I said earlier, like the 4 year degree, it is a ridiculous requirement for an airline pilot, especially since it doesn't save the company any training costs (maybe there's an insurance savings?), and should go away.

Where was SWAPA when all this went down?

Probably fishing with Herb.

 

[BILL LUMBERG]

Everything I did prior to getting a major was an investment in my career. It began when I got my first job at the airport washing airplanes.

NOBODY but SW was hiring in the early to mid '90's, so after several years of deliberation, I took the chance and bought the type, interviewed, and got hired. My ONLY regret is not doing it sooner, which might've saved me a few years of misery in the commuters and night freight world.




As I said earlier, like the 4 year degree, it is a ridiculous requirement for an airline pilot, especially since it doesn't save the company any training costs (maybe there's an insurance savings?), and should go away.



Probably fishing with Herb.

All true.....point taken.