Skywest sez this about UAL J4J.....

[Splert]

general Lee,

Yes, but to fly 70 seat [jets] for United, you will have to play by their rules... You are lucky that United didn't ask for 5 Capt slots per 70 seat RJ.

I covered this already.

However, you keep insisting that it’s UAL and not UALPA that was asking for the moon. It was UALPA that wanted to put their furloughed pilots in the jet at SkyWest. UAL could give a rats butt.

It makes sense, and UAL holds the cards.

There you go again. UAL would like nothing more than to have SkyWest, MESA and others to fly 1000’s of RJ’s for them. However, it is UALPA putting the breaks on UAL.

UALPA is trying to tell SkyWest how to run its business. Last time I checked SkyWest is paid by UAL and not by UALPA. Without UAL to back UALPA all UALPA is holding is their units. That is why they are at the bottom of the list. UALPA backed down.

I find no pleasure in UAL pilots being furloughed: it freaking sucks. I wish DALPA and UALPA would find a way to fly these RJ’s themselves. But we are past that. Or are we? Why don’t you sit down and find a rate at which these jets will make money for DAL or UAL.

Can you at least do that?

Splert…

 

[~~~^~~~]

Gen Lee
What is the 70 seat rule you mentioned as it applies to Wisky?

ALPA's jets for jobs protocol has required that all Captain slots be given to furloughed mainline pilots. This has proven problematic to implement. The longer Skywest can delay ALPA's J4J tactics, the better off your pilots and Company will be. There are many problems with J4J, but wonder:

(1) If the UAL pilot does not have the qualifications for the position?
(2) If the UAL pilot has problems in training, can Skywest fire them?
(3) Is a UAL pilot in his "probationary year?"
(4) Does the UAL pilot have ALPA protections at Skywest?
(5) Does ALPA represent the UAL pilots at Skywest?

You say Skywest does not want ALPA? How do you think this will work out when you have a bunch of new Captains (with ALPA to thank for the trick of putting them at the top of another airline's seniority list) preaching to junior First Officers?

As you can read from my friend General Lee, the mainline pilots have been preached to by ALPA that they own your jobs, that they now believe it.

Good luck to Skywest pilots. ALPA did ask for the moon, and at other airlines, they are getting it!

~~~^~~~

 

[Splert]

ALPA did ask for the moon, and at other airlines, they are getting it!

Was this the price of "brotherhood"?

Splert...

 

[g159av8tor]

roll the dice and pull an ACA.

I hope that phrase goes in the aviation history books and is added to Webster's dictionary!

Roll the dice and pull an ACA (phrase) 1. to stand-up to your abusive spouse and leave, never to return 2. to take a gamble with uncertainty and go on your own 3. to mortally thrust a wooden stake into the heart of a vampire and other walking dead in an act of vindication and independence!!!

Remeber, ACA is an abbreviation. I hate when foreigners and UAL stations pronounce it "AHH KAHH".

Tailwinds...

 

[Russ]

Thanks Fins
I didn't know Wisky had to give up jobs on the dumbo jet. I haven't heard of them getting any 70 seat CRJ's so I guess that's where they will go? That is unless they are getting 70's and it simply made it past me.

 

[surplus1]

Was this the price of "brotherhood"?

No sir. Brotherhood is only conferred upon those born with blue blood.

May I recommend UPA? That way you can avoid the Trojan Horse.

 

[Jeepman]

General,

It makes no sense for SkyWest to give any extra seniority to UAL furloughs. Would they offer preferential hiring in the future (theoretically speaking)? No. They go to the bottom.

Besides, what would all of your Delta furloughs making first year pay in the RJ have to say about it?

 

[General Lee]

I know it doesn't make sense Jeepman. I thought that was the "order" that United Alpa forced the company to use when dealing with the Express carriers. They could ask for the Moon and try to get that too. I thought United Alpa wanted their furloughed FO's in the FO seat of the 70 seater. I am probably wrong. As far as our Delta furloughs, I think most would go to the right seat of an RJ if they knew they were going to be out for a long time, but with the nasty reception they have recieved from some (not the ASA or Chataqua pilots), I doubt they would try. But, I do know that many would go to a seperate DCI carrier made for them. We know that Delta wants more 70 seaters, and after Comair and ASA get their order filled, we are hoping that a deal could be made that would include our furloughs into new 70 seaters under the DCI banner, and with comparative rates. We shall see--but we do have 1310 people who would like to fly again, and without the "CRM" crap they have gotten so far from one group.

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[wil]

General- I was on travelnet today checking out my families trip to Ireland. Next to the peoples names listed are their employment date- no ASA, Delta Mainline, Delta ticket Counter, CMR, etc. For one split second it looked to me like one company- oh well I hope we can get the furloughs back in the air. I still think that if DCI would quickly rid the portfolio of contract carriers there would be plenty of flying for Delta, ASA, CMR. Fly safe- Wil

 

[Chairman]

Who is UALALPA looking out for. They want there pilots in the right seat of the 70 seaters. Fine but our first one doesn't show up until feb or march. That is 6 or 7 months of UAL pilots sitting on the street. IF agreed to we could put them in classes starting now and get them off the street. Now first year pay is hard to swallow but beats sitting on your couch.

 

[flipflyr]

So there I was.......

B

What was that? 6000' on what part of the approach???


J

 

[MTorbust]

I like this one:

"ALPA did ask for the moon, and at other airlines, they are getting it!"

Moon = A S S = Mesa, what a score for them.

Oh, YIPPIE, my Union negotiated a job for me at mesa! YIPPIE!

 

[Jeepman]

Oh, YIPPIE, my Union negotiated a job for me at mesa! YIPPIE! [/B][/QUOTE]

Did Mesa do the j4j again?

 

[~~~^~~~]

As far as our Delta furloughs, I think most would go to the right seat of an RJ if they knew they were going to be out for a long time, but with the nasty reception they have recieved from some

But, I do know that many would go to a seperate DCI carrier made for them. We know that Delta wants more 70 seaters, and after Comair and ASA get their order filled, we are hoping that a deal could be made that would include our furloughs into new 70 seaters under the DCI banner, and with comparative rates. We shall see--but we do have 1310 people who would like to fly again, and without the "CRM" crap they have gotten so far from one group.

Bye Bye--General Lee

General, I have had one of your furloughed pilots in my right seat and he was a darned good pilot. A real pleasure to fly with. No CRM issues on our trip.

Thanks for coming right out and saying you want "our" airplanes. If Delta Connection executes options on "our" order, they are "our" airplanes and we own all the delivery slots for the next 8 years. If you guys go for those, the gloves come off in more ways than one. With the RJDC litigation growing in force and effect ALPA might just yank your leash back before they have to explain to the Court how they allowed you to "steal" the Plaintiff's equipment. Heck, I would ask that the RJDC at least try to get an injunction to stop the transfer of equipment. (Remember the RJDC lawsuit was filed over C2K scope language and the Court has ruled there sufficient harm to Comair and ASA pilots justifies a look at ALPA's DFR failure - in other words, don't assume what your MEC did in 2000 is the standard. The 105-seat scope that we had when I hired in could be the "standard." It depends on the Court, or ALPA, if ALPA decides to perform its duty and reign in the DAL MEC.)

You want our airplanes and our jobs, there is one way, on one list. You will not be allowed to kill us and take our equipment.

We will not allow your predatory MEC to destroy our jobs as ALPA has done elsewhere in this industry. We are organized, funded and represented. We are prepared for war. Besides, why do you think Delta would take aircraft from a solvent carrier to place them at a bankrupt carrier? The longer ALPA drags its feet, the closer Delta gets to Chap 11 reorganization. You might not think the clock is ticking on your negotiating position, but it is.

Sorry to be rude, I would prefer we were working together, but your MEC's profligate ways are unsustainable and ALPA's failure to take control of the situation has resulted in the loss of jobs at ASA because we are blocked from any job protection effort we might make. You have us backed in a corner and there is a lot more Patton over here than Pee Wee Herman. We will fight.

 

[WhiteCloud]

So when (if) things turn around lets give Comair pilots Delta seniority with their Comair DOH and Skywest pilots UAL seniority with their Skywest DOH. Imagine the kicking and screaming and tantrums that would go on if that happened.