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Rolling Rest - Explain Please.

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Flight Options perspective.

It's interesting this discussion comes up just as you guys are on the cusp of voting for representation, just as it did at Flight Options. I guess management knows rolling rest is the first thing that will go away after the union is voted in, again just as it did at Flight Options.

Prior to our representation by the 1108 our SOPs (as it still does in our GOM today) stated that pilots were "expected" to answer their phones and accept duty assignments after 10 hours of rest. You see if they had said "required" that would have put them into a "present responsibility for duty" situation (legally duty starts at the time of present responsibility) and they didn't want that. By telling us we were only "expected" not "required" they were exploiting what they hoped would be a legal loop-hole for them.

Enter the 1108: The union put out an extensive amount of information to educate our pilots on this topic. As a result our pilots stopped answering their phones when "expected" too. I can tell you from personal experience that the first time I did that it was a gut check. But I was never confronted with my failure to answer the phone by management - because they knew they were on shaky legal ground here and would be confronted by the union's legal if they did.

As more and more of us began to collectively stand up for ourselves and word got out, the majority of our pilots began to reject management's directive in this area. Now the vast majority of Flight Options pilots do not answer their phones until their assigned duty on times. Regardless of the time. Duty on at 4pm know one picks up the phone until 4pm.

I can also tell you that this was a very positive change relative to QOL on the road, something that in spite of everything else that is going on at Flight Options these days, has made the job much more tolerable. I can now go to sleep, knowing exactly when I will be going to work the next day. Might even get to sleep in, who knows.

Management initially responded to this effort by the union, by scheduling everyone who had a history of not answering their phones for 5am duty at the FBO. That lasted about six months, but after everyone was on board with the program - solidarity is a wonderful thing - they can no longer get away with doing that, because most of us would be sitting at the FBO at 5am if they did. Now they have to actually schedule properly - some crews duty on early, some crews duty on late. And the system seems to be working well.

It feels good to collectively stand up for yourself, you guys should give it a try.

Thanks 1108!!
 
Gerry,
That is a great story that brings back wonderful memories. I am glad you guys are getting a taste of how good it can be!
 
This thread has become a great resource for those with "rolling rest" questions, concerns and ideas.

I would like to thank each one of you for your posts, past and future. Each of your unique views, stories, and opinions on this subject have been much appreciated.

I hope we at Flexjet can come together as a group and end this "rest" practice.
 
this is all good stuff. here is the other big question: how do we get it changed at flex? I dont want to volunteer to be the fall guy who is the first to get called into the office for turning off my phone. unless we all do, it wont work. So what do we do?
 
I would be careful about turning off the phone without legal advice ... or a union committed to backing you up.

I have read about lawsuits where pilots tried to fight this issue. Some cases the pilots won but others the pilot lost. They lost because they overlooked something that an experienced aviation lawyer or union official might not overlook.

I think if they tell you to answer the phone ... you have to. But you may not be able to accept the trip they assign according to the regulation. If thats the case and you refuse the trip and get fired I would think its possible to win your job back in court.

But if you refuse to answer the phone I don't think you can get your job back... or win in court.

Its complicated and there are those who say you don't need a union when dealing with your company. True ... if you are 100% confident you are Right. But a person who has any doubt will likely fly the trip and err on the side of not getting fired.
 
Flexjet is the "last of the Mohicans" with regards to rolling rest. I believe change is imminent. But I tend to be an optimist.

We just need to continue to bring up the subject anytime we're around our ACPs and other management types. Respectfully of course, with examples and scenarios of how it has made the operation teeter on unsafe.

In my experience, "unsafe" is always the keyword when dealing with aviation management. Their ears tend to perk up.
 
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I would be careful about turning off the phone without legal advice ... or a union committed to backing you up.

I have read about lawsuits where pilots tried to fight this issue. Some cases the pilots won but others the pilot lost. They lost because they overlooked something that an experienced aviation lawyer or union official might not overlook.

I think if they tell you to answer the phone ... you have to. But you may not be able to accept the trip they assign according to the regulation. If thats the case and you refuse the trip and get fired I would think its possible to win your job back in court.

But if you refuse to answer the phone I don't think you can get your job back... or win in court.

Its complicated and there are those who say you don't need a union when dealing with your company. True ... if you are 100% confident you are Right. But a person who has any doubt will likely fly the trip and err on the side of not getting fired.

I left FLOPS in Oct 07. In the last manifestation of the SOP's, (even though you were not required to answer) the language was such that the Blackberry was to be "not silenced" and the hotel phone plugged in after 10 hours of rest. I still unplugged my phone and my BB was off until my duty on time. I see it as if one is required to do something, then you're not in rest. How is one supposed to meter their sleep if they are required to subject themselves to interruptions in sleep?

I'm no attorney but, I disagree with your supposition that not answering, or in my example, silencing the phones, wouldn't hold up in court.

I sure wish that I had submitted an ASAP on this SOP. It is clearly designed to intimidate.
 
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I think Gunfyter makes a good point. In our case we had the advice of our union, who had consulted legal counsel. We also had a union communications network to get the word out, so everyone knew the drill. So the best thing you can do is get the union voted in and go from there. I'm sure at that point your brothers at the 1108 would be happy to pass along any legal research they have gathered and assist you in formulating a plan to put a stop to this.
 
Unfortunately it appears that the latest union drive has stalled.
 

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