Rjet update

[RobCat]

You bet I can quit. As to how my post on a webboard will affect your opinion, I guess you do have a weak mind.

I have a very weak mind directly related to reading your posts. You may not have to worry about me, what you may want to worry about is the other 2000 pilots at RAH that is reading your posts. Do you speak for the Midwest group as a whole or just the furloughs? For many of us we are starting to think that you represent the personality and attitude from the Midwest side that we are going to introduce to our (RAH, MW, F9, MK, and Lynx) new company. I am ready to do whatever it takes to get the furloughs from all of our companies back to work. As I feel I have a moral obligation to do so. I could very easily be in your situation. Your attitude is making me and I'm sure a few others think twice about that moral obligation.

 

[kf4amu]

As I feel I have a moral obligation to do so. I could very easily be in your situation. Your attitude is making me and I'm sure a few others think twice about that moral obligation.

Do you guys have a moral obligation to work for a liveable wage? Apparently not.

Do you guys have a moral obligation not to enable your management to undercut the few decent paying mainline jobs left? Nope

Do you guys have a moral obligation to raise the bar instead of bringing it down for that all important selfish, greedy, quick upgrade? Nope. Me me me me me me. ******************** the rest of the industry, I dont care if my pay rates affect their negotations, I want their flying because I want to be a captain and I'm willing to sell myself out.

Good job folks. Everyone hates you as much as Mesa now. Awful.

 

[RobCat]

Do you guys have a moral obligation to work for a liveable wage? Apparently not.

Do you guys have a moral obligation not to enable your management to undercut the few decent paying mainline jobs left? Nope

Do you guys have a moral obligation to raise the bar instead of bringing it down for that all important selfish, greedy, quick upgrade? Nope. Me me me me me me. ******************** the rest of the industry, I dont care if my pay rates affect their negotations, I want their flying because I want to be a captain and I'm willing to sell myself out.

Good job folks. Everyone hates you as much as Mesa now. Awful.

My point is that Citations attitude is a CANCER. He will poison my cockpit as well as our company. If we are going to make this place better for us and our families how is he going to help. Is Citation what MW has to offer as far as a group?

 

[OpenClimb]

My point is that Citations attitude is a CANCER. He will poison my cockpit as well as our company. If we are going to make this place better for us and our families how is he going to help. Is Citation what MW has to offer as far as a group?

So unless the guys from the recently-acquired Mainline carriers suck it up and thank RAH for the chance to fly in YOUR cockpit, they're a cancer? Wow.

Keep in mind that the Midwest guys (and the Frontier guys) have paid their dues and have moved beyond the world of feeder flying. You can better bet that each and every one of them will have a bad attitude if they end up swinging gear for the likes of YOU in YOUR cockpit.

Plan on having another 639 cancerous pilots if this is your plan (or hope) for the Frontier pilot group.

Keep in mind that Midwest pilots and Frontier pilots are far beyond the stage in our careers that we are just happy to have any old job flying a shiny jet. The only job we're interested in having is a job that's *worth* having. You all can keep your jobs that pay $37 for an FO and ~$85 for a captain. I had that job 10 years ago when I worked for Mesa.

 

[B727FA]

not if you're in front of the airplane. remember to get my coffee when i am onboard as i'm sure that's in bedford's plans for you guys.

My pleasure, Capt. Say, are your eyes a little blood-shot? I have just the thing for you...

 

[likeitis]

My point is that Citations attitude is a CANCER. He will poison my cockpit as well as our company. If we are going to make this place better for us and our families how is he going to help. Is Citation what MW has to offer as far as a group?

Yes it is what MW has to offer after what they went through, deal with it. You guys are in the process of poisoning the Midwest product that took us 25 years to build. For example I have flown about 30 roundtrips on the 170's over the last 9 months and only once have I found either pilot welcoming or saying goodbye to the pax's. This is something that you would see almost every flight when flying with Midwest. Are you guys just too good to say hello or goodbye or maybe you realize that pax are smarter than you think and know you all are replacement pilots.

 

[CitationLover]

My point is that Citations attitude is a CANCER. He will poison my cockpit as well as our company. If we are going to make this place better for us and our families how is he going to help. Is Citation what MW has to offer as far as a group?

Ooh I'm a CANCER!!! You happily will fly with those who are flying our old routes at a 70% pay reduction, but that's ok with you since it's "management" who is the evil one.

Please. Do you really think I will come back? Heck no. This is called integrity, something most RAH pilots do not have.

 

[CitationLover]

My point is that Citations attitude is a CANCER. He will poison my cockpit as well as our company. If we are going to make this place better for us and our families how is he going to help. Is Citation what MW has to offer as far as a group?

You think I am bad? Wait till you have a 20yr former MD80 CA who was home every night for the last 10 years.

I think our former MEC chair, with his job at HAL, will be representational of what you're going to see. Not a lot of Midwest pilots coming over. We don't have to make that decision though until we need to.

Again, you happily fly our routes, etc. but then call us the cancer and ask us to help "our" company. It's called "getting shi t on" in the real world. It doesn't produce kumbyah like you expect.

 

[Popeye0537]

So unless the guys from the recently-acquired Mainline carriers suck it up and thank RAH for the chance to fly in YOUR cockpit, they're a cancer? Wow.

Keep in mind that the Midwest guys (and the Frontier guys) have paid their dues and have moved beyond the world of feeder flying. You can better bet that each and every one of them will have a bad attitude if they end up swinging gear for the likes of YOU in YOUR cockpit.

Plan on having another 639 cancerous pilots if this is your plan (or hope) for the Frontier pilot group.

Keep in mind that Midwest pilots and Frontier pilots are far beyond the stage in our careers that we are just happy to have any old job flying a shiny jet. The only job we're interested in having is a job that's *worth* having. You all can keep your jobs that pay $37 for an FO and ~$85 for a captain. I had that job 10 years ago when I worked for Mesa.

O god here we go again with the "I paid my dues" $hit......

1. F9 guys have a viable product, they will fair better in the integration then MW.
2. My jet is shiny, isn't yours?
3. We will keep our $37 hour job as long as people will do it for that.
4. What are you making now sitting right seat? What your QOL, probably as good as it was at mesa.
5. You are MORE to blame then pilots at RAH, you worked at MESA...friggen MESA. Pot meet kettle

When it comes to MW pilot group, I can say that I haven't run into any of the nay sayers like citation in MKE. Most of the guys left understand what they are faced with and are looking to see if we have any more info on whats going on. Citation is a cancer to RAH but he will most likely never see the flight deck of an RAH plane because he is very junior at MW and will be close to the bottom of the list when it comes together.

 

[CitationLover]

When it comes to MW pilot group, I can say that I haven't run into any of the nay sayers like citation in MKE. Most of the guys left understand what they are faced with and are looking to see if we have any more info on whats going on. Citation is a cancer to RAH but he will most likely never see the flight deck of an RAH plane because he is very junior at MW and will be close to the bottom of the list when it comes together.

and when the new contract comes out with $39 / hr top end FO rates you will vote yes.

 

[carl p]

This really sucks for the MW and Frontier guys, two once proud companies reduced to this. Until you have watched a company you've poured your heart and soul into tank, you cannot really understand. The worst part would be waking up at a commuter 10-20 years older, light years behind in PAY/QOL. Best of luck F9 and MW guys/gals!

 

[OpenClimb]

I realize in this day and age of one handout after another, 'paying your dues' is not an accepted (or even familiar) concept. I'm sorry, but it's real, it's proper and there's nothing wrong with expecting it.

Items 1-3 don't really warrant a response.

4. Box 1 of my 2008 W-2 said $90,972.65. Keep in mind that this was with a 14.5% paycut for about 1/2 the year. 5th year pay before that.

5. QOL doesn't begin to compare with Mesa. Here are some numbers published in our monthly bid packet:

Month Avg Line Value Avg Days Off
Jan 77:13 15.64
Feb 75:58 16.20
Mar 76:52 16.29
Apr 77:12 17.31
May 76:13 16.48
Jun 76:48 16.26
Jul 79:26 16.86
Aug 78:O4 15.96
Sep 79:11 16.67
Oct 77:52 17.43

Keep in mind that these numbers are average. Captains and FOs bid on the exact same lines so these numbers apply to both seats. I'm in the top 1/3 of the FO list so I do a little better than the above, on average.

As another point of comparison, I'm just finishing the 3rd overnight on a 4-day trip. On this trip I've stayed at 2 Crowne Plazas (SFO and LGA) and a Hilton (MCI). Not that there aren't better hotels out there, but it's not too shabby, either. My most frequent hotel stays at Mesa were at the Holiday Inn in Farmington, NM and the Plaza Inn in Garden City, KS.

You are EXTREMELY out of touch if you think life as an FO at Frontier even VAGUELY resembles life at a crappy feeder airline like RAH or Mesa.

The point of me working at Mesa was to build time and experience so that I'd be qualified to move on to better jobs with a better quality of life. I interviewed at Frontier, started at the bottom, endured reserve, probationary pay, less-than-optimum schedules and now enjoy a pretty decent quality of life for decent pay. I'm OK with all that.

What I didn't do **and what I wouldn't have expected to do** was jump ahead of somebody who'd gone through all the above because Johnny O happened to have enough cash laying around to buy a mainline carrier.

Instead, had Johnny O purchased a mainline carrier, I would have been content with being stapled to the bottom of said mainline carrier's seniority list and thrilled with the idea of a guaranteed job, better QOL and better pay, **when my seniority allowed.**

That's the point the RAH folks are missing in all of this. Most all the pilots at Frontier and Midwest have done something to accumulate significant time and experience before coming to a mainline carrier. If someone is Junior at Midwest, it's most commonly because he first worked at a crappy feeder airline like Mesa or RAH and then interviewed and was hired by Midwest.

I don't feel any entitlement to your job. I don't want your job. You can have it. You can have exclusive upgrade rights to all the EMB-170 and/or 190's you want.

Now: If you can make the same statements with regard to my job and the equipment I'm flying, then we have no problem.

O god here we go again with the "I paid my dues" $hit......

1. F9 guys have a viable product, they will fair better in the integration then MW.
2. My jet is shiny, isn't yours?
3. We will keep our $37 hour job as long as people will do it for that.
4. What are you making now sitting right seat? What your QOL, probably as good as it was at mesa.
5. You are MORE to blame then pilots at RAH, you worked at MESA...friggen MESA. Pot meet kettle

When it comes to MW pilot group, I can say that I haven't run into any of the nay sayers like citation in MKE. Most of the guys left understand what they are faced with and are looking to see if we have any more info on whats going on. Citation is a cancer to RAH but he will most likely never see the flight deck of an RAH plane because he is very junior at MW and will be close to the bottom of the list when it comes together.

 

[RobCat]

So unless the guys from the recently-acquired Mainline carriers suck it up and thank RAH for the chance to fly in YOUR cockpit, they're a cancer? Wow.

Keep in mind that the Midwest guys (and the Frontier guys) have paid their dues and have moved beyond the world of feeder flying. You can better bet that each and every one of them will have a bad attitude if they end up swinging gear for the likes of YOU in YOUR cockpit.

Plan on having another 639 cancerous pilots if this is your plan (or hope) for the Frontier pilot group.

Keep in mind that Midwest pilots and Frontier pilots are far beyond the stage in our careers that we are just happy to have any old job flying a shiny jet. The only job we're interested in having is a job that's *worth* having. You all can keep your jobs that pay $37 for an FO and ~$85 for a captain. I had that job 10 years ago when I worked for Mesa.

I was calling Citations attitude a cancer, and poison. If you want to label yourself as such than so be it. Rather you like it or not if you come back your checks will be signed by someone at the likes of RAH. We are not worthy of you so please move on to the next company. The difference between the likes of you and us is that we are willing to work to make something better RAH. If you are not interested please move on. It is that easy.

 

[RobCat]

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[RobCat]

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