Retired Airline... 135 pilots

[FL420]

Only after I hand fly an app. to mins.
Mobie

....and I remember when waking up stiff in the morning was a good thing.

 

[mobie]

Old Age and International Flying

Just remember the rules:
Do not eat any vegetable with the skin on
Do not pass a chance to have your laundry done
Never fart unless you are in a restroom
Never ignore an erection even if you are by yourself.

Has worked for many longhaul pilots.

Mobie

 

[Bringupthebird]

While Airline/Corp/135/military flying have their similarities, there isn't a whole lot of overlap. Airline guys need to percieve themselves as qualified, but inexperienced when it comes time to cross over to the 135 world. As with most pilot problems, it's 1% ability and 99% attitude. Most pilots convince themselves they can do it all and a very small number actually prove they can.

 

[G100driver]

Why can't you fart in the cockpit?

How else is someone with an otherwise 15 year-old mentality keep themselves entertained?

 

[mobie]

Because for us old guys the dew point and temp get to close!!

 

[G100driver]

Because for us old guys the dew point and temp get to close!!

uke:

 

[AAflyer]

....and I remember when waking up stiff in the morning was a good thing.

ROFLMAO..........
:laugh:

 

[AAflyer]

While Airline/Corp/135/military flying have their similarities, there isn't a whole lot of overlap. Airline guys need to percieve themselves as qualified, but inexperienced when it comes time to cross over to the 135 world. As with most pilot problems, it's 1% ability and 99% attitude. Most pilots convince themselves they can do it all and a very small number actually prove they can.

Excellent statement. One needs to know their own limitations! Each theatre in the aviation community is a little different. If you needed training and some IOE to fly a heavy, why would you not need it to fly 135?

Attitude can make all the difference in the world, however in end if you can't fly then it is time to hang it up.

AA

 

[AAflyer]

I'll have to concede some of this to you guys, but you are talking about the pinnacle of aviation experience here......not the day to day operations of the airlines. I'll admit that my airline experience has been limited to the regionals, and that my international experience has been limited to a lot of Carribbean flying and one trip across the pond to Iceland, but on the same token, my regional experience was dealing with some of the most inept pilots I have ever seen. Less than half the guys I flew with had any idea how to make a fuel order without a release. I once asked a 15 year captain at my company to file a flight plan from PHX to TUS over the phone so that we could just go instead of waiting another hour for dispatch to get around to it, and he had no clue how to do it. After I did it, he was completely amazed. Every time anything came up, they were on SELCAL talking to company asking them what they should do. I had 30 minute flightplans filed at FL330 in a CRJ200, and captains that would actually try to f-ing climb up there while I just sat there with my mouth open. Almost everyone was the same, takeoff, autopilot on, turn it off at about 300 feet. Every leg, every time. When I wanted to hand fly an approach, sometimes raw data, because I wanted the practice, I got everything from dirty looks to 'NO DON'T DO THAT!!'s. Every day at my operation was show up, program the FMS, drive the plane, go home.

I'd always imagined things were better at the 'real' airlines, and I'm sure they are. But my limited experiences of flying with heavy iron guys have been nearly the same. Flew with one guy in a Learjet that couldn't even taxi the thing. Another 15,000 hr retired DL pilot I know has trouble finding contract work anymore because "he has no idea how to fly an airplane smoothly." I had an AA 777 FO scare the hell out of me in a 172 when I was a flight instructor. My old boss told me the most scared he's ever been in his life was trying to teach a United 747 CA how to fly a Kingair. My best friend was nearly arrested crossing into the US in a Kingair from the Carribbean because he was flying with a Delta 767 guy that had no idea how to deal with customs, but was trying to act like he did.

I'm sure that flying with some of you guys would change my mind, but my admittedly limited experiences have been mostly bad. Everyone is a product of their experience. I'm just stating mine. Is it right or wrong, who the hell knows? I'd be willing to bet there are just as many jackoffs in GA cockpits just as there are in 121 cockpits. I guess I've been on the wrong end of the 121 spectrum.

Sorry you had to deal with the 1%. If they introduce themselves as god's gift to aviation they are most likely the 1%. Hopefully in the future you will fly with one of us aviation freaks! The ones that fly on the side, still go to Oshkosh, fly tail-draggers, write on these aviation message boards...You know the ones I am talking about.

Take Care,

AA

 

[AA717driver]

...and not ask my wife where she is based after sex.

Mobie

LMAO! You see, I was at TWA for 15 years. I never had to worry about getting laid on the road... TC

P.S.--It's easy to get in a routine with the airlines. I'm not at all intimidated by the prospect of flying to Katmandu these days but going back and taking a line check in an S80 with an uptight, anal-retentive Line Check Airman who thinks he invented flying isn't too appetizing...

 

[climbhappy]

pilot houston 123:

I just remembered I flew with a retired delta 76 captain (for a 135 outfit in Atlanta in a JS32) and he was director of training. he was a super nice guy and the jetstream was a handful for him, although he still flew to standards.

He had 13 type ratings and I had the utmost respect for him. At 60 plus, I think his hand eye coordination was failing, but not below par. If I consider my golf game, it ain't pretty, but I still get it in the hole.

What does the song say, "I'm not as good as I once was, but i'm as good once (one approach down to mins without a miss ) as I ever was.

If the guy is unsafe, i think you have to sit him down , and say ," Bud, it's over, It's over, How bout a beer!" Darn she's good looking! What do plan to do with the rest of your life?"

 

[CapnVegetto]

Sorry you had to deal with the 1%. If they introduce themselves as god's gift to aviation they are most likely the 1%. Hopefully in the future you will fly with one of us aviation freaks! The ones that fly on the side, still go to Oshkosh, fly tail-draggers, write on these aviation message boards...You know the ones I am talking about.

Take Care,

AA

Well, statements like this make me believe that you're right. I might've just hit the crap lottery. Beer's on me if we ever bump into each other.

 

[DavTheViking]

I will bet that I've flown with more retired pilots than most, (otherwise known as contract pilots) and they have all SUCKED, EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THEM. I don't know how else to say it. I can only hope when I reach that point somebody will be honest enough to tell me to hang it up. However, I probably wouldn't feel comfortable taking work away from somebody younger that really needed it after I supposedly retired so look for me on the golf course. I could go on about how bad they are with even more specific examples but I don't think they deserve the typing effort....

 

[Going2Baja]

The thing that has changed from 121 to 91/135 is that I have learned not to put my plate on the floor at home after dinner and not ask my wife where she is based after sex.

Post of the Year Award!!!

One of the better topics I've read here - great input guys!!

Baja.

 

[hawkerjet]

I'm sure you have given him all your input and tips on the aircraft. sometimes a guy just needs some gouge on flying a new aircraft.
If your convictions are that strong that he may not be safe, why not suggest the CP fly with him.

 

[pilothouston123]

I want to take a minute and say thanks to all that responed with all the great input! I am becoming a better pilot every day.. I hope I remain teachable until I retire and after. Since I never flew 121 I guees I will bedome a CFI scab in my 60's

 

[FlyFlyFly]

Airline pilots are great, especially retired ones. We all know that...

 

[Spooky 2]

Let me get this straight. When a new pilot comes to the airlines usually he/she listens, watches and learns how it is done by other pilots, mostly the Captains. Then when one of these same Captains comes into the Part135/91 arena he is an incompetent old fool. To old, unteachable, etc. I really doubt it.

There must be a lot of awsome aviators out there, or at least on this board, if not in their own minds.

 

[FN FAL]

Let me get this straight. When a new pilot comes to the airlines usually he/she listens, watches and learns how it is done by other pilots, mostly the Captains. Then when one of these same Captains comes into the Part135/91 arena he is an incompetent old fool. To old, unteachable, etc. I really doubt it.

There must be a lot of awsome aviators out there, or at least on this board, if not in their own minds.

No, you're just assuming that airline pilots can fly little planes, just because they can fly great big airliners.

Our 135 owner wouldn't let none us piston pups up into the conquests, so he hired a retired airline pilot and got him on the 135 cert as conquest PIC...tons of turbine time, literally. First week on the job, he wheelbarrows the props off of that sucker. The wing skins were so flexed, they had to bring engineers in from Cessna to look at the plane to asses it's future as an aircraft.

 

[Phantom Phlyer]

No, you're just assuming that airline pilots can fly little planes, just because they can fly great big airliners.

Our 135 owner wouldn't let none us piston pups up into the conquests, so he hired a retired airline pilot and got him on the 135 cert as conquest PIC...tons of turbine time, literally. First week on the job, he wheelbarrows the props off of that sucker. The wing skins were so flexed, they had to bring engineers in from Cessna to look at the plane to asses it's future as an aircraft.

------------------------------------
This is an interesting thread. I am a former military and 121 driver now in a management position in the 135 world. A few observations:
Retired 121 pilots are at a huge disadvantage in the 135 world. Many of the stigmas discussed in this thread are attached to all of us regardless of age or flying ability. Even though the 121 guys may have much more experience, our owners would rather not spend the money on initial type ratings -- they will opt for the less experienced guy who already has a type. Many of you assume that just because we had most things handed to us in the 121 world, that none of us is willing or capable of actually working. Many of us are very capable of filing flight plans, planning fuel, taking care of passengers, and some of the other things many of you think we cannot. How many of you have flown the President of the United States and/or frequently handled all the planning and security details that go along with a Presidential visit?
In the 121 world there were excellent pilots at 59 1/2 years and questionable pilots at 40 or less. The same appears to be true in the corporate world.
Is 135 flying usually more demanding than simply signing a 121 release? Sure it is. Does that mean that former 121 guys are incapable of meeting those demands? Some of you forget that very few guys (or gals) went immediately to the 121 world with no other previous experience.

Perhaps the most discouraging things I have seen in the 135 world are:
(1) The attitude that "I am an experienced corporate pilot and don't need any help from you or anyone else. There is nothing you can teach me." and (2) "I am here to fly jets -- don't bother me with any discussions of company health or needs."

Why can't we all get along and recognize that each of us has skills that can be utilized? There are good 121, 135, military, and other pilots. There are arrogant and inflexible pilots in each of those groups.

20,000 hrs plus of turbine time but still have a long way to go to learn the 135 world -- but I am working and listening.