Rejected by AirNet

[RefugePilot]

Based on some responses from a posting here I applied to some cargo carriers, including Airnet. I was pleased to get a phone call back from Airnet a few days later. I was not so pleased to get a rejection letter a few days after that.

I was hoping I could just fill out a few online applications then just choose from all the offers that would come pouring in. I realize now I will have to tailor my answers to phone interviews so they hear what they want, then I can choose from all the great paying opportunities presented to me.

Questions for the board:

Would the "get hired by the airlines" books also help me prepare for the cargo hiring process?

What are the interviewers looking for as far as answer to the following questions:

"Why do you want to work for us?"
Is reputation a good answer?

"Why do you wan to fly freight?"
The real answer besides building multi-time is having flight instructed for over 1000 hours, I am ready to have the cockpit to myself and fly in a single pilot enviroment and face the challenges associated with the freight pilot job. Does this sound to macho and will it get me weeded out?

"Where do you want to go in aviation?"
Do I have to tell them I want to be a career freight dog? I dont know yet.

Oklay I am pretty sure I know what I said to get rejected, but I want to make sure I did not say more than one thing to get the dear pilot letter. When the interviewer mentioned they have caravans, and asked how I would feel about flying a Caravan. I told them I really was only interested in flying with them, if I could get some multi PIC, but not in those words.

The only saving grace was Airnet is only east of the mississippi, and I want to be on the west coast or Rockies. That doesn't mean that rejection doesn't hurt.

I need to figure out what to say before Ameriflight calls and I blow it again.

Thanks
the Refugee

PS for anyone who has gotten the dear pilot letter, you need to look at Dash-Trash's post on this link. http://forums.flightinfo.com/showthread.php?t=71915

 

[Guillotine007]

just answer truthfully...if whoever is interviewing you doesn't think that you would be a good fit and decides to not hire you, it is probably best for everyone involved. it is a safe assumption that they know what to look for, and it is not a statement of your piloting abilities.

if i interviewed at a regional, it would be best if i was not hired because i would not fit what they want....not matter how qualified i am on paper. something about cupcaking the FA's wouldn't go over so well.

G007

 

[100fly]

If you want to be out west and don't what to fly the caravan, then airnet is not the best place for you anyways. Try Ameriflight. They are out west and have a wide variety of aircraft to fly.

 

[starchkr]

"east of the Mississippi"??????????????

What the heck are you smokin'????? Maybe a lack of company knowledge made them pass you up...you should know about a compnay before you try to work there...seems to me that i was based in Denver for the last year, and that Denver has been a base for many many years now, let alone Burbank and Portland.

And flying the van is only a minority at Airnet...most will start in the twins, however, there is a chance you might have to fly a van a few legs a week or night and then a twin the rest of the time...you can't be picky. And if you get stuck flying a van right out of the gate, you can always change runs to a twin only run if it is that big of a deal for ya.

 

[uscpilot]

"east of the Mississippi"??????????????

What the heck are you smokin'????? Maybe a lack of company knowledge made them pass you up...you should know about a compnay before you try to work there...seems to me that i was based in Denver for the last year, and that Denver has been a base for many many years now, let alone Burbank and Portland.

And flying the van is only a minority at Airnet...most will start in the twins, however, there is a chance you might have to fly a van a few legs a week or night and then a twin the rest of the time...you can't be picky. And if you get stuck flying a van right out of the gate, you can always change runs to a twin only run if it is that big of a deal for ya.

You are being very misleading. The only aircraft west of the Mississippi are Jets. Yes the way things are going he will probably have his pick of lears in less than a year. But you have to go into this knowing that you could handle living in an area that might not be you first choice. When I started in June 2001 it looked like I would be in a Jet at the beginning of 02. Then a Jet capt by the end of that year. After a year of building jet PIC time I would be at Southwest or Fedex by fall of 04. Things were looking great until some people decided to hyjack and fly some planes in a few buildings. You never know what will happen, people are moving through quickly right now, but who knows.
As far as the Caravan there is a good chance that one would have to get trained in it. Being a floater is not as desireable as it used to be.
Hey man have fun over there dont get too rusty flying that glorified video game.
WDR11

 

[RefugePilot]

Yes east of the mississippi

Hey USC Pilot,

I with you on the derailed career track. I started training full time in December 2000 and according to my schedule then I should be sitting left seat in a 737 and making six figures.

Starchkr,

The person on the interview said Airnet no longer has any contracts west of the mississippi, they gave them up to concetrate their resources in the east. The recruiter also said something about being commited to an airplane once you are trained in it.

I have 1700 hours total time now, and 78 multi. Most of my time is in fixed geared singles, as much as I would like to fly a Caravan, 2700 hours of fixed gear singles would only make me slighly more higherable. I have had opportunities in the past that I was not able to take as I was uninsurable in the aircraft. I feel my best career step now is something that will get me Multi PIC.

I would think of moving east for the right oppotunity, the Caravan is not it though. Still looking for suggestions on what they are looking for in an interview.

 

[jdlilfan]

So is the 'van easy to get? I'm the opposite of the most. I like the tall, oversized C207.

As far as the Caravan there is a good chance that one would have to get trained in it. Being a floater is not as desireable as it used to be.
Hey man have fun over there dont get too rusty flying that glorified video game.
WDR11

 

[Guillotine007]

the chances of having a caravan only run is probably around 5%

 

[inthewind]

When I did the phone interview for Atlantic Coast in 2002, they asked me it I'd fly the J-41 if offered or hold out for the CRJ. I told them,"I'll fly a hangglider in a tutu if you pay me!" They offered me an interview in a week and a Dornier Jet class that started 8 days later.

 

[uscpilot]

the chances of having a caravan only run is probably around 5%

Is that hyperbole? You've never used that before.
Carvans make up about 15% of the fleet. Almost all the aircraft that will be purchased will be Vans. The likelihood of being exclusivly in a one is not that high, but what I was saying there is a good chance of being trained isn one atleast in the floater capacity.
jdlilfan,
If you want a Van then bid a floater position. Like I said it wont be exclusive, but you could get qualified then hold out. Are you planning on moving on to the lear. It is a pretty tight cocpit, but well worth it.
WDR11

 

[jdlilfan]

Well I've still got prolly a year before I will/can apply to Airnet. Im guess I am in the "research" stage of looking for employment. Airnet looks like an awesome company to work for even though a lot of my coworkers (cfi's) seem to think otherwise ( shiney jet syndrome). I guess what got me interested in Airnet was USC321...the last guy who flew that route. The lear would be a neat plane to fly even though old school lears suck to fuel (by yourself, quickturn, in the cold, then GPU start). I sat in one of ameristars lear 23's. It was like cramming into a tall c152.

Im browsing other cargo companies too. Priority Air flies in a lot lately picking up auto parts and they seem like they have nice equipment. My last 2 flight instructors went to ACC. Martinaire seems like a nice place to work for. I thought about Airnow down the road but yeah..... Like I said, I got a year or so before applying for anything. I gotta get this CFI knocked out and pick up some students since we are about to lose some CFI's to shiney jets.

 

[starchkr]

Misleading....not quite, because we do have west coast stuff...props no, but anyone "most likely" will only have to spend a limited amount of time in the props before moving on like you said. I still say that knowledge is power, and by saying that everything is east of the MS river there was a lack of knowledge. Now maybe it was also on the interviewers part by saying that there was nothing out west, but if so then they need new interviewers who themselves are knowledgeable of the company. Telling someone that they "gave up" everything out west to concentrate on the east coast is just ludacris, and has absolutely no truth to it. Oh well, i guess i shouldn't get all worked up over it anymore, I definately do not want to be like Purvis.

I guess i'll just sit here and program my flying computer... :laugh:

 

[uscpilot]

Misleading....not quite, because we do have west coast stuff...props no, but anyone "most likely" will only have to spend a limited amount of time in the props before moving on like you said. I still say that knowledge is power, and by saying that everything is east of the MS river there was a lack of knowledge. Now maybe it was also on the interviewers part by saying that there was nothing out west, but if so then they need new interviewers who themselves are knowledgeable of the company. Telling someone that they "gave up" everything out west to concentrate on the east coast is just ludacris, and has absolutely no truth to it. Oh well, i guess i shouldn't get all worked up over it anymore, I definately do not want to be like Purvis.

I guess i'll just sit here and program my flying computer... :laugh:

Yes there is west coast stuff, perhaps 10% of the runs/aircraft. Not enough to get excited over, expecially since they are all jets, and wont even be attainable for 8-12 months.
If the company did not "give up" out west, then what would you call it? Reno is gone, Burbank is not what it used to be. I think that the recruters should be honest with applicants. The last thing they should be doing is giving people false hope.
As far as being worried about being like Purvis dont worry, so long as you have lost your virginity you will always be one step ahead of him. Not the first time I have made this point, but its not the first time that someone else has been concerned.
WDR11
PS If knowledge is power then you have a long way to go. J/K could not help it, you walked into that one.

 

[starchkr]

I'll agree i have a long way to go...

Trying to figure out all the Airbus acronyms is really starting to fry my little brain...yeah, i said little. Why they cant use easy words or phrases to explain something is driving me nuts...like how the FWC's give the ECAM messages about the Flux Capacitor and how if we can figure out how to introduce stolen plutonium into the engines we can actually turn back time and get people to their destinations before they actually left their departure cities. Hmmmmm....I think i bumped my head tonight and woke up having this dream....(ok, so again, some of you got that, others just think on it for awhile).:laugh:

You are right though, only a limited amount of flying out west...however...there is flying out there, and this knowledge should be considered before making statements, either by an interviewee or an interviewer. Peace out...and that superbowl sucked this year...not too much excitement, and the half time show just wreaked of boredom.

 

[flyin4pennies]

Carvans make up about 15% of the fleet. Almost all the aircraft that will be purchased will be Vans. WDR11

I didn't know that Airnet was taking delivery of ANY airplanes?

 

[uscpilot]

I didn't know that Airnet was taking delivery of ANY airplanes?

Sorry for my lack of clarity. Currently they are not (as far as I know, I am a bit out of the loop flying passanger). This was their long term goal, they did not want to buy any more piston aircraft. The plan was to replace all but the Barons (and Lears of course) with the mutant 172's. The 310's were supposed to be gone along time ago, however they are still terrorizing the skys around BHM and neighboring areas. The only ones they were able to get rid of the Deathstars.
WDR11

 

[iflyjets4food]

Well I've still got prolly a year before I will/can apply to Airnet. Im guess I am in the "research" stage of looking for employment. Airnet looks like an awesome company to work for even though a lot of my coworkers (cfi's) seem to think otherwise ( shiney jet syndrome). I guess what got me interested in Airnet was USC321...the last guy who flew that route. The lear would be a neat plane to fly even though old school lears suck to fuel (by yourself, quickturn, in the cold, then GPU start). I sat in one of ameristars lear 23's. It was like cramming into a tall c152.

Im browsing other cargo companies too. Priority Air flies in a lot lately picking up auto parts and they seem like they have nice equipment. My last 2 flight instructors went to ACC. Martinaire seems like a nice place to work for. I thought about Airnow down the road but yeah..... Like I said, I got a year or so before applying for anything. I gotta get this CFI knocked out and pick up some students since we are about to lose some CFI's to shiney jets.

Are you from THAC?

 

[jdlilfan]

Are you from THAC?

Yup. THAC Attack!

 

[wheelsup]

When the interviewer mentioned they have caravans, and asked how I would feel about flying a Caravan. I told them I really was only interested in flying with them, if I could get some multi PIC, but not in those words.

I need to figure out what to say before Ameriflight calls and I blow it again.

My #1 rule for phone/personal interviews is always tell THEM what they want to hear. Even if it's lying through my teeth, I don't like to close any doors before they are open. I learned that lesson the hard way. After figuring that out, I've gotten every job I wanted (your mileage may vary).

I *think* AMF has taken their Lances out of service, but what if they haven't and you give them the same answer you have Airnet? Now you've just blown your chance with another company, even if the "transition" to a twin would happen almost instantly after training.

There are times when you need to be honest in an interview (like Q's about driving record, criminal history, etc.) and other times when embellishing a little never hurt. That way, THEY don't make the choice for you - you can say yes or no thanks.

~wheelsup

 

[RefugePilot]

Tell them what they want to hear

Thanks Wheels up,
Thats exactly what I am thinking. Tell them what they want to hear, then you can choose not to accept if you find out the details and dont like them. The more offers you have...

I have had someone PM me with a response to my answers and I feel I am saying the right things. Even though Airnet has some things west of the mississippi, most of the opportunities are east. I have spent the last 5 years living in place I did not want to be. I know my domicile and promotion opportunities are based on the company I work for. So I feel it would be stupid to choose a company that is based 2000 miles from where I would like to be.

My #1 rule for phone/personal interviews is always tell THEM what they want to hear. Even if it's lying through my teeth, I don't like to close any doors before they are open. I learned that lesson the hard way. After figuring that out, I've gotten every job I wanted (your mileage may vary).

I *think* AMF has taken their Lances out of service, but what if they haven't and you give them the same answer you have Airnet? Now you've just blown your chance with another company, even if the "transition" to a twin would happen almost instantly after training.

There are times when you need to be honest in an interview (like Q's about driving record, criminal history, etc.) and other times when embellishing a little never hurt. That way, THEY don't make the choice for you - you can say yes or no thanks.

~wheelsup

 

[flyin4pennies]

My #1 rule for phone/personal interviews is always tell THEM what they want to hear. Even if it's lying through my teeth, I don't like to close any doors before they are open. I learned that lesson the hard way. After figuring that out, I've gotten every job I wanted (your mileage may vary).


~wheelsup

BE CAREFUL

Some recruiters can tell when your BSing them!!!
That policy dosen't always work

 

[OARfan]

321 pilot

Well I've still got prolly a year before I will/can apply to Airnet. Im guess I am in the "research" stage of looking for employment. Airnet looks like an awesome company to work for even though a lot of my coworkers (cfi's) seem to think otherwise ( shiney jet syndrome). I guess what got me interested in Airnet was USC321...the last guy who flew that route. The lear would be a neat plane to fly even though old school lears suck to fuel (by yourself, quickturn, in the cold, then GPU start). I sat in one of ameristars lear 23's. It was like cramming into a tall c152.

Im browsing other cargo companies too. Priority Air flies in a lot lately picking up auto parts and they seem like they have nice equipment. My last 2 flight instructors went to ACC. Martinaire seems like a nice place to work for. I thought about Airnow down the road but yeah..... Like I said, I got a year or so before applying for anything. I gotta get this CFI knocked out and pick up some students since we are about to lose some CFI's to shiney jets.

I used to fly that route summer of '04. Were you at KHUF?

 

[rubicon789]

So is the 'van easy to get? I'm the opposite of the most. I like the tall, oversized C207.

It's a C208...:smash:

 

[Princedietrich]

While it is true that the Van may appear to be nothing more than a lame single fixed-gear, it does have a very redeeming quality for the logbook. That being the turbine PIC time you'll be racking up in it. Plus, for purposes of upgrading to the lears, Van time is just as good as twin time.

As for your phone interview questions, I don't really see any glaring red flags from what you mentioned there. Then again, I'm no recruiter. I just sit in a cubicle 10 feet away from the recruiter and listen to his rattle off those questions over and over and over and over and over...


sorry, brain is a little tired at the moment.

 

[Guillotine007]

PrinceD - how can we take anything seriously from you when you have a quote from "XXX" as your signature?

 

[jdlilfan]

It's a C208...:smash:

I know! it looks like a streched 207 on stilts. haha And yes, it is an awesome turbine aircraft even though its slow.

 

[starcheck208]

that van is only slow is cruise, it kicks butt on approach...nothing like racing the airliners to the runway

 

[starchkr]

ahhhh....the infamous "Turbine PIC".....yes, that it is, and that's all it is. Unfortunately moving on, places do not really care too much about the single turbines...yeah yeah, you might say i am wrong, and i myself used to think that it was good too, but in all reality, it is good at Airnet, or maybe some other smaller airlines, but it will not work for the larger airlines people want to go to after Airnet. OK, so i know i will take A LOT of heat for this one, but just remember, i too used to think that ANY turbine time was good....then i saw the light, also known as the airline recruiters and their idea of Turbine time.

 

[uscpilot]

OMG!! I cant believe it, I am actually agreeing with starchkr. The planets must be aligned.
Here is what the interviewer will say:" Hey thats great you have 1000HRS PIC turbine. I would like to offer you a.... oh never mind its in a caravan."
Piston twin time is more valuable than single engine turbine. Having said that it will not hurt you if you stay with the company, but it will not help you elsewhere.
WDR11

 

[starchkr]

HOLY CRAP!!!!! There's a first time for anything...and well, this is a first :laugh:

I kinda put that whole "I know i will take A LOT of heat for this" statement in there just for you USC...I really do not know what to say, i am too shocked right now.