Regionals ... or the fractionals?

[Dooker]

If any of you had it to do over again, would you take a fractional job over a regional?

I ask because I may have to make that decision soon, depending on how a couple of upcoming interviews go.

Here's my concern: I go to a fractional, make a good deal more money out of the gate, but I'm gone from my wife and kids EIGHT DAYS in a row.

Or I go to a regional, get based locally, make squat for a few years, but at least my kids remember what I look like when I come through the door. And I build 121 time, which my resume sorely lacks.

Juts curious to hear what you guys think. I'd be especially interested to hear your comments about QOL at the regionals (specifically, Eagle).

Thanks.

 

[bailout]

If you have to commute to the fractional, then go with the regional. I would also say the opposite the other way around. Where do you live? CS has a ton of domicles. Ive done both, and I can tell you, although I had a really good time at the regionals, nobody leaves the fractionals to go to the regionals. Its always the other way around.

 

[Willy21]

but I'm gone from my wife and kids EIGHT DAYS in a row.

At NetJets the most you will be gone is 7 days and six nights. That gives you 7 days and 8 nights at home. Plus two 21 day vacations after your first year. Out of 52 weeks in a year you will work 24 weeks, less if you get sick. (we don't fly sick or tired at NetJets because our company doesn't treat us like children like the regionals I have flown for)

Yes being gone seven days gets long, but if you live within a two hour drive of you domicile I would go to the fractional.

Also for those of you on the fence about NetJets the window is closing. Unless things change, when the list hits 3000 pilots the upgrade will be 5+ years at best. The list is 2600+ at the present time.

Best of luck with your decision.

 

[Socalplt]

Bailout has a good point, I've never heard of Frac pilot going to a regional. Hard choice if I had to do it over again. It could be a misconception, but I picture Frac pilots sitting around an FBO numerous hours ever day waiting on someone. Thats just something I'm not up for.

I'm foruntate I have enough seniority now that I'm rarely away from home for more than a night. Living in domicile and my seniority (and I'm not really that senior) allows me to work locals, 2 days, or continious dutys for the most part. Basically, I see the wife and kids every day. If the wife starts bitching too much I can always bid a 4 day trips! I can't hold them all the time, but a local thats just out and back that pays 5-6 hour done 3-4 times a week seems ideal. Show at 8-9am and be home in time for dinner.

 

[Scaramunga]

Bailout has a good point, I've never heard of Frac pilot going to a regional. Hard choice if I had to do it over again. It could be a misconception, but I picture Frac pilots sitting around an FBO numerous hours ever day waiting on someone. Thats just something I'm not up for.

I wish we could sit around more. Most of the time we drop our pax, fuel up, eat and blast off again on an empty ferry leg to pick up someone else. There are times where we will just hang out at the FBO for a few hours, but's usually not the case.

 

[Dooker]

I'm waiting for a NetJets app. If they were to offer me a job, I'd take it. Seven on, seven off sounds way better than eight on, six off (which is the FlexJet way, from what I hear, and they're the ones offering me an interview).

Meanwhile, I have an interview next week with Eagle. I live in the DFW area, and the word is they're guaranteeing bases right now. So if they were to make me an offer, I think I'd take it ...

Basically, I want what Socalpt has ... lots of nights at home, if you want it, lots of flexibility. I'd sacrifice pay for that, any day.

Also, I just got out of the corporate world. Flying spoiled, rich f****rs all over the place. Getting their catering. Setting up their transportation. Wiping their a**es.

It'd be nice to fly people who are at least close to my own tax bracket for a change ...

 

[Willy21]

I would interview at Flex and Eagle. Go see what they are both about. The only thing about Eagle is you will sit there for a long time. Everybody talks about first year pay being bad, but second year isn't much better.

Flex is a good company as well and if offered a job I would have taken it. (I never interviewed there because they gave me the interview the day after I took the job at NetJets)

As far as taking care of the pax yes we do that more than you would at Eagle. The good thing about the fractionals is you have owner services doing a lot of that for you.

 

[Flybet3]

As far as taking care of the pax yes we do that more than you would at Eagle. The good thing about the fractionals is you have owner services doing a lot of that for you.

I hate to tell you my friend but once you're on the road, YOU will take care of the PAX. Fractional flying is like night and day compared with airline flying. If you want to be "just" a pilot then go to an airline (show up and fly) If you want to be a flight attendant, baggage handler, cabin cleaner, etc. Then Go to the fractionals. I can guarantee you this, at the fracs you will work 10 times harder then you would ever work at a regional. Yeah 7 days off are nice, but being gone for 7 days is not as great either. Trust me on this, I did it before and the week you're gonne goes by slow, and your 7 days off will fly by so quick! 7 & 7 is not for everyone. But you wont know until you try it.

 

[mosyslack]

I'm about to make the jump to NetJets in July, after 7 1/2 years in the regional industry with 2 stellar companies (Mesa & Comair). I'm done. There are some definate unknowns with going to the fracs, the biggest of which is how I will handle the 7/7 schedule. I do not have kidsnor do we have plans to, and that fact alone will make things easier, I think. Every chance I get, I try to introduce myself to a NJ guy (as long as they don't look to busy or preoccupied), and ask if there is anything they wish they had known going into the job that they now know. Everyone has responded that they are very happy and would never change. There are obviously some issues, but nothing that is a dealbreaker.

I'm looking forward to going into an airport that has a number in it's identifier... a different type of flying altogether. Come on July!

 

[cldsfr79]

Go to a FRACTIONAL! I'm there (NetJets) and it is like night and day from a regional. It's like living in the day! Yes, you have to work harder; someone referred to lifting bags and getting the aircraft ready for flight (catering & clean), but you are not an FA serving drinks in the back; once on the plane, you are the pilot only.

I worked at a regional for several years so I can compare the two. Life is much better at a fractional. Besides the pay being much better, the benifits are outstanding and the 7 days off are great. Did I mention you are catered crew food several times a day plus get money for per diem? That's really nice! I don't starve like I did when I was a regional guy. We also stay at Hilton and Hyatt products mainly. No more La Quintas or Comfort Inns like the regionals. We also get all the airline points and hotel points, so when I do go on vacation, it's paid for by points! After year 1 you do get 2 weeks of vacation, which turn into 3 weeks a piece if you are on the 7 on 7 off schedule. For those guys on are reserve schedule, you work about 17-18 days a month but see an extra $6K in your pay check (it goes up per year that you work). Some guys who have been here a while, and who work reserve make an extra $10k a year. The company also seems to care about there pilots and we have a great union protecting us.

Oh yeah, you are paid full salery from day one, full benifits from day one, receive per diem from day one, and the hotel is covered. (No you don't share a room with another guy). and your uniform is given to you.

On day 1 your trip you usually airline to your aircraft (thanks for the ride guys!). Day 2 through 6 you are zipping from here to there. If you enjoy flying all over the country than this is the place for you. So, you only really work for 5 days in a given work week. Is there down time? Sure, it's like being on ready reserve. You sit there at the FBO and wait for the company to call you to fly. Do I hate sitting around? Yes, but I deal with it. In most cases you only sit hot standby (ready reserve) once in a while. Most FBOs are nice, they have DVDs, computers, some have pool tables; some let you drive around in the crew car. Life really isn't that hard. On day 7 you are going home.

Down sides? I mentioned you have to do some "non-pilot" duties. The new guys have to live at a specified base. Upgrades are looking to be 4-5 years. We (NetJets) are growing like crazy, but people like it here and are staying, so attrition is super slow.

Come here if you are looking for a career that is alternate and possibly more stable than the 121 world. Don't come here if you are looking for a quick up grade and to build flight time (I get about 350-400 hours a year).

Good luck. We have a lot of airline guys here, young and old, who would't give this job up for the world.

 

[Flybet3]

Go to a FRACTIONAL! I'm there (NetJets) and it is like night and day from a regional. It's like living in the day! Yes, you have to work harder; someone referred to lifting bags and getting the aircraft ready for flight (catering & clean), but you are not an FA serving drinks in the back; once on the plane, you are the pilot only.

I worked at a regional for several years so I can compare the two. Life is much better at a fractional. Besides the pay being much better, the benifits are outstanding and the 7 days off are great. Did I mention you are catered crew food several times a day plus get money for per diem? That's really nice! I don't starve like I did when I was a regional guy. We also stay at Hilton and Hyatt products mainly. No more La Quintas or Comfort Inns like the regionals. We also get all the airline points and hotel points, so when I do go on vacation, it's paid for by points! After year 1 you do get 2 weeks of vacation, which turn into 3 weeks a piece if you are on the 7 on 7 off schedule. For those guys on are reserve schedule, you work about 17-18 days a month but see an extra $6K in your pay check (it goes up per year that you work). Some guys who have been here a while, and who work reserve make an extra $10k a year. The company also seems to care about there pilots and we have a great union protecting us.

Oh yeah, you are paid full salery from day one, full benifits from day one, receive per diem from day one, and the hotel is covered. (No you don't share a room with another guy). and your uniform is given to you.

On day 1 your trip you usually airline to your aircraft (thanks for the ride guys!). Day 2 through 6 you are zipping from here to there. If you enjoy flying all over the country than this is the place for you. So, you only really work for 5 days in a given work week. Is there down time? Sure, it's like being on ready reserve. You sit there at the FBO and wait for the company to call you to fly. Do I hate sitting around? Yes, but I deal with it. In most cases you only sit hot standby (ready reserve) once in a while. Most FBOs are nice, they have DVDs, computers, some have pool tables; some let you drive around in the crew car. Life really isn't that hard. On day 7 you are going home.

Down sides? I mentioned you have to do some "non-pilot" duties. The new guys have to live at a specified base. Upgrades are looking to be 4-5 years. We (NetJets) are growing like crazy, but people like it here and are staying, so attrition is super slow.

Come here if you are looking for a career that is alternate and possibly more stable than the 121 world. Don't come here if you are looking for a quick up grade and to build flight time (I get about 350-400 hours a year).

Good luck. We have a lot of airline guys here, young and old, who would't give this job up for the world.

Very good post, but like I said it all comes down to whether you will be able to do the 7 ON for the rest of your career. Personally for me anything longer than 5 days is more than enough. And as to going to the back and taking care of passangers, well they might not do it at Net jets but in the corporate and charter world & some fracs you need to go back and "check" on pax. Nothing wrong with taking care of people, but if you just wanna fly...well it's pretty obvious as to what you have to do. Yeah at the end of your tour you get sent home, but geesh! that's like commuting, you end up in California, and you live in Florida. You live in Texas and you finish up in Main and so on. Fractional flying is fun, dont get me wrong, especially flying a CL300 or a Citation X, but it's going to to come down you handling the schedule and commute.

 

[imacdog]

Yeah at the end of your tour you get sent home, but geesh! that's like commuting, you end up in California, and you live in Florida. You live in Texas and you finish up in Main and so on.

....except for the part that you are airlining home, on a positive space ticket, on a work day and getting paid for it. Get home after midnight at your regional job? Make a few bucks of extra block time. Get home after midnight at a fractional? Cha-ching! $$$

 

[Flybet3]

....except for the part that you are airlining home, on a positive space ticket, on a work day and getting paid for it. Get home after midnight at your regional job? Make a few bucks of extra block time. Get home after midnight at a fractional? Cha-ching! $$$

okkie dokkie

 

[Willy21]

I hate to tell you my friend but once you're on the road, YOU will take care of the PAX. Fractional flying is like night and day compared with airline flying. If you want to be "just" a pilot then go to an airline (show up and fly) If you want to be a flight attendant, baggage handler, cabin cleaner, etc. Then Go to the fractionals. I can guarantee you this, at the fracs you will work 10 times harder then you would ever work at a regional. Yeah 7 days off are nice, but being gone for 7 days is not as great either. Trust me on this, I did it before and the week you're gonne goes by slow, and your 7 days off will fly by so quick! 7 & 7 is not for everyone. But you wont know until you try it.

As for taking care of the pax, what we a talking a max of 8 and that is rare. I also picked the airplane that doesn't carry many bags and they all go inside tha cabin, ie I don't load many bags. You make it sound as if I am cleaning the cabin, loading bags and serving drinks to 50 un-supervised grade school kids. (the company also lets me tip a line-guy to vacume the airplane) So I guess I work harder than you, I don't see it.

Seven day trips usually go by fast for me. Day one airline. Day two-six maybe two legs a day and to the hotel. Day seven airline home get to the house most of the time by 6pm and if they don't get me home by 14 hours of duty or midnight they pay me for two extended days. That is a lot better than the 121 commute, if we can leave MSP 15 minutes early and keep it at .83 then we might get lucky and get to SLC 45min early. If all that goes as planned that will give me 30 minutes to run and try to catch the last flight to DFW. You say well I won't commute because I live in my domicile, I did as well until they closed DFW, then SLC, and now many of my friends have seen LAX close as well. Ask me what NetJets has to gain by closing DAL as a domicile, nothing.

If you want to play the airline game and flying big airplanes is your thing go to the airlines, been there done that. If you want to have a job with a company that has a sustainable business plan then go frax.

 

[Flybet3]

As for taking care of the pax, what we a talking a max of 8 and that is rare. I also picked the airplane that doesn't carry many bags and they all go inside tha cabin, ie I don't load many bags. You make it sound as if I am cleaning the cabin, loading bags and serving drinks to 50 un-supervised grade school kids. (the company also lets me tip a line-guy to vacume the airplane) So I guess I work harder than you, I don't see it.

Seven day trips usually go by fast for me. Day one airline. Day two-six maybe two legs a day and to the hotel. Day seven airline home get to the house most of the time by 6pm and if they don't get me home by 14 hours of duty or midnight they pay me for two extended days. That is a lot better than the 121 commute, if we can leave MSP 15 minutes early and keep it at .83 then we might get lucky and get to SLC 45min early. If all that goes as planned that will give me 30 minutes to run and try to catch the last flight to DFW. You say well I won't commute because I live in my domicile, I did as well until they closed DFW, then SLC, and now many of my friends have seen LAX close as well. Ask me what NetJets has to gain by closing DAL as a domicile, nothing.

If you want to play the airline game and flying big airplanes is your thing go to the airlines, been there done that. If you want to have a job with a company that has a sustainable business plan then go frax.

You've got some good points, I'm not trying to argue, but I did fly for a fractional that everyday was pretty much a 14 hour day. No joke. Net jets is not to bad. Yeah commutin sucks, period. But if you live 10 to 15 minutes from the base airport, then your life at the airlines will make a world of difference. The same way you have a total of 14 days off at some fracs you will have 14 to 18 days off at some of the better regionals and with flight bennies you can enjoy that time off. Look at it this way, everyone claims that their company is stable and blah blah blah, one thing I have learned is that in aviation nothing is stable. Do what you think will make you QOL and family time the most comfortable. If 7 days away from the wife and kids and 7 days at home works for you then go right ahead. If 3 days froms the kids and 4 days at home works, then good for you too.

 

[Willy21]

I could see your point if we were talking major vs fractional, but fractional vs regional. One has a future the other is waiting for the next guy to undercut him or the next management team to play you against some other regional. The regionals are a place to get some time and move on.

 

[Flybet3]

The regionals are a place to get some time and move on.

Exactly! move on....TO A MAJOR! :beer:

 

[Dooker]

Do any of you guys have anything to throw in about the QOL at Flexjet? It looks like a real beating versus NJA. Plus I think they make you sign a training contract, unlike NJA.

I ask because I just got an email from FlexJet's HR about discussing "pilot opportunities" there.

I sent them my resume a week ago ...

 

[bailout]

To any regional guy out there... do you have Aug 1st off? How about Nov.1st or Dec. 15th? Not that those dates are significant, but I can tell you right now if i have those days off or not. Can you?

 

[Flybet3]

To any regional guy out there... do you have Aug 1st off? How about Nov.1st or Dec. 15th? Not that those dates are significant, but I can tell you right now if i have those days off or not. Can you?

sorry....what?