Regional for a career

[Russ]

One airport an airline does not make. You said the 50 seat market was dead, you now qualify the remark by city and airline.

We are losing routes of course, we are gaining some as well. Granted they are places most have never heard of, but the plane is still flying.

 

[Gr82Aviate]

One airport an airline does not make. You said the 50 seat market was dead, you now qualify the remark by city and airline.

We are losing routes of course, we are gaining some as well. Granted they are places most have never heard of, but the plane is still flying.

Russ, apparently you don't realize that General Flea is always right...

Sooner or later he's bound to convince you and everyone else by repeating himself ad nauseam!!!uke:

 

[Ops check good]

Not in SLC. Ed Bastian said in the conference call last week there won't be any "single class" RJs in SLC in a couple years , meaning unless someone plans to put a first class section in the -200, it's GONE. You probably fly the UAL side, but I have a feeling each Legacy CEO is planning to park almost all 50 seaters sooner than later. Gas is still way too high to justify the expense. Throw in a lack of pilots at most Regionals, and those 50s will be parked first so they can crew the 70/76 seaters. It's already happening Russ.


Bye Bye---General Lee

Oh wise one, you forget about "pro rate". I bet you actually believe the E120 is dead too.

 

[ROSWELL41]

The wage gap between LCC/legacy and regional is only going to widen. During the 'lost decade' since 9/11, regionals have seen tremendous growth and RJ captains could touch a six figure salary. Now the shoe is on the other foot and by second year pay, most LCC/legacy FO's exceed senior RJ captain pay. There is little to no growth on the regional side. If you have more than ten years left and this business supports you and your family, making the jump or trying to is worthwhile. Who would want to do essentially the same job over decades for a million or two less in compensation?

 

[Russ]

Because I want to be at my kids games, recitals, be at home for Chistmas for the kids, home for New Years for me.

Yeah, it's worth that much to me to "sacrifice" and not make major airline wages. Then again, I haven't been wanting for a paycheck for 15 years while some of those at majors have.

 

[Russ]

Gr82

Thanks, but I can be as persistent as GL. I simply try and be civil about it.

 

[IBNAV8R]

The wage gap between LCC/legacy and regional is only going to widen.

Bet you two rounds (beverages) that you're wrong.

There WILL be a regional market in the future. The economics will always be there as long as there is customer demand for frequency over gauge in smaller markets.

Pilot pay in the cost-model is peanuts. The one thing that is certain is that if regionals/LCCs/etc, are going to keep pilots, they are going to need to close the pay gap - again.

The only thing I can foresee keeping some of the disparity is for the industry to make the case for lower mins (750 hours?). Even then, unless industry-wide compensation increases, intelligent prospects are going to pursue more stable and lucrative careers.

 

[asayankee]

Did you guys hear that Delta is getting 88 717's???

 

[General Lee]

One airport an airline does not make. You said the 50 seat market was dead, you now qualify the remark by city and airline.

We are losing routes of course, we are gaining some as well. Granted they are places most have never heard of, but the plane is still flying.

Russ,

Hey, listen to the analysts and airline CEOs. It's not getting any better for 50 seaters. Just bid to the 70/76 and hang on there if you need to. You guys are getting some E175s for UAL, try that. And one airport does make a very large hub for you. SLC is full of 50s now, but that will change. Throw in an app somewhere, you have the PIC.... Or.... Don't. Good luck.


Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[General Lee]

Did you guys hear that Delta is getting 88 717's???

You've probably seen some in ATL and DTW already. More to come. Rumor has it a possible 717 category in NYC too. About 600 new Capt slots.


Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[ROSWELL41]

Because I want to be at my kids games, recitals, be at home for Chistmas for the kids, home for New Years for me.

Yeah, it's worth that much to me to "sacrifice" and not make major airline wages. Then again, I haven't been wanting for a paycheck for 15 years while some of those at majors have.

I used to work at one of the 'best' regionals. I know lots of guys in your situation and due to the last ten years I'm sure your career plans have changed. Your kids will want help paying for college and I'm sure you'll want to retire comfortably someday. What if you ended up as an FO again at your company due to contraction? Comair guys probably never thought it could happen either. The reality is the guys flying in your right seat now will make way more than you and be home just as much within a few years of making the jump. The industry is changing.

 

[Russ]

All of that is possible. It's also possible at a major for bad things to happen. I know far more people furloughed at a major in the past decade plus than from SkyWest. My eyes are wide open, I'm not in some fantasy land. I just happen to think there will always be a regional airline industry. Hopefully I'll be a part of it. If not, then I'll bite the bullet and apply to a major and watch my sons games on tape when I get home on Monday night before I start packing for a Tuesday night departure back to base.
From what I make in addition to a gov check down the road (20 years in the reserves) I will be able to put the kids through college and have at least an ok retirement. Sorry if I don't fit the mold and my statements run counter to what most others think is the obvious path.

 

[ROSWELL41]

All of that is possible. It's also possible at a major for bad things to happen. I know far more people furloughed at a major in the past decade plus than from SkyWest. My eyes are wide open, I'm not in some fantasy land. I just happen to think there will always be a regional airline industry. Hopefully I'll be a part of it. If not, then I'll bite the bullet and apply to a major and watch my sons games on tape when I get home on Monday night before I start packing for a Tuesday night departure back to base.
From what I make in addition to a gov check down the road (20 years in the reserves) I will be able to put the kids through college and have at least an ok retirement. Sorry if I don't fit the mold and my statements run counter to what most others think is the obvious path.

I think SkyWest is the best place to be in a contracting segment of the airline industry. That being said, many at SkyWest are not as in tune with reality as you are. A :03 minute increase to MDG or $.05 increase in per diem is not a raise. You guys are falling behind inflation and are likely to keep taking concessions. I hope you can spread some of your reality to your peers.

 

[j41driver]

Because I want to be at my kids games, recitals, be at home for Chistmas for the kids, home for New Years for me.

Well done. That's what matters.

 

[Russ]

R41

Yup, there's some here that I can't quite figure out, but to each his own.

I voted no btw.

 

[General Lee]

I keep telling people there is a "window" of opportunity coming up. If you get on at a legacy in the next 2-3 years, you will probably spend very little time on reserve. You can pick a narrowbody plane, get senior on it, get double pay overtime if you want it, have great QOL because you are senior in category, and pay for college while creating a retirement plan for yourself. If you wait until the end of the hiring wave, you are opening yourself up to potential problems. 5000 pilots will retire at EACH legacy. Getting on early could mean the difference between holidays off, weekends off, sooner.

Roswell is correct, Regional pay and benefits don't seem to be getting any better.


Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[IBNAV8R]

Roswell is correct, Regional pay and benefits don't seem to be getting any better - yet.

There, fixed that for you.

 

[General Lee]

There, fixed that for you.

Yet? We'll see. You may be right, they may have to sweeten the pot a bit to retain some people, but huge portions of the fleet could get parked because of lack of pilots. According to people I know at Republic, they too are having problems filling classes. Look at Great Lakes as another example. You'd think Regional managements would have figured this out by now.


Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[Freebrd]

You'd think Regional managements would have figured this out by now.

Bye Bye---General Lee

Reg mgt's don't care. They already have their golden parachutes. Somewhat like Leo did to Delta a few years ago.

 

[chqflyer]

Yet? We'll see. You may be right, they may have to sweeten the pot a bit to retain some people, but huge portions of the fleet could get parked because of lack of pilots. According to people I know at Republic, they too are having problems filling classes. Look at Great Lakes as another example. You'd think Regional managements would have figured this out by now.





Bye Bye---General Lee

Republic is having EPIC problems getting "meat in the seats" as the manager of scheduling was so fond of saying. Cancellations galore.